Anger as Japan moves to fingerprint foreigners

[buckthesystem]

http://www.theage.com.au/news/world/anger-...2941320246.html

Another place to add to your list of places to avoid

_________________________________________________________________________

Japan is to fingerprint and photograph foreigners entering the country from next month in an anti-terrorism policy that is stirring anger among foreign residents and human rights activists.

Anyone considered to be a terrorist -- or refusing to cooperate -- will be denied entry and deported.

"This will greatly contribute to preventing international terrorist activities on our soil," Immigration Bureau official Naoto Nikai said in a briefing on the system, which starts on November 20.

The checks are similar to the "US Visit" system introduced in the United States after the attacks on September 11, 2001.

But Japan, unlike the United States, will require resident foreigners as well as visitors to be fingerprinted and photographed every time they re-enter the country.

"It certainly doesn't make people who've been here for 30 or 40 years feel like they're even human beings basically," said businessman Terrie Lloyd, who has dual Australian and New Zealand citizenship and has been based in Japan for 24 years.

"There has not been a single incident of foreign terrorism in Japan, and there have been plenty of Japanese terrorists," he said.

There are more than two million foreigners registered as resident in Japan, of whom 40 per cent are classed as permanent residents.

The pictures and fingerprints obtained by immigration officials will be made available to police and may be shared with foreign immigration authorities and governments.

Diplomats and children under 16 are excluded from the new requirement, as are "special" permanent residents of Korean and Chinese origin, many of whom are descended from those brought to Japan as forced labour before and during World War Two.

Local government fingerprinting of foreign residents when issuing registration cards, long a source of friction, was abolished in 2000.

Amnesty International is calling for the immigration plan to be abandoned.

"Making only foreigners provide this data is discriminatory," said Sonoko Kawakami of Amnesty's Japan office.

"They are saying 'terrorist equals foreigner'. It's an exclusionary policy that could encourage xenophobia."

(continues .......... go to link)

[damo1]

damo1

why dont they just say out right to stop the confusion we do not want bin laden and his group doing this in our country i mean things have changed and we need to be very care ful as this can know strike at our core values and when i say this i say its all bin ladens fault and the muslims that support him

i am not saying al muslims are bad or belive in what bin laden belives in so i am making this clear but comon this group has created all the fear and i feel its going to get worse they need to put the anti up and they need bin ladens head on a plate this is what needs to happen and i feel if the muslims wear to support what the armed forces are doing in their country instead of following this lunatic the jappanese goverment would not be doing this as they have been very lucky like with my country Australia the only two countrys that have been attacked are America and England

and i feel if we sit back on our back sides thinking nothing wil happen this is how i feel bin laden and his followers and those who they are wanting to brain wash to join them wil hit

so i am all for what the goverment is doing as at least they are not that atheist as the chinesse goverment is and to what it is about to do to the in house pastors

these people are not in the same situation as their other brothers who live in china its self at least they are thinking of their people and their home land

we need to be putting pressure on the muslims as this is what i feel needs to happen sorry folks yet this is how mad i am at what bin laden has done

it wil not be long before we are all strip searched when we board a plane to go to another country

gee i am going to go threw this my self when i take off in jan for two to the philippines with a 100 and 1 questions thrown on me and when i apply for a visa i stil have to put on my visa that i had criminal convictions in the past even though i have been clean for the last know 15yrs and out of trouble with the law

i have to even do this in the jobs i apply for so i am ok with what japan is about to do what weight til bin laden hits a city kills more people than we say oh we could have done something why did we not do this

i feel bin laden is planning to hit and we need to do everything we can to prottect not just our countrys but our air ports and any way this group can get in

good on you japan other countrys should follow suit with out complaining

from damo

[MorningGlory]

What is the problem with Japan protecting the sovereignty of their country and the security of their citizens? Any American who lives along the southern border of the U.S. is acutely aware of the prudence of such a policy. It is NOT discriminatory to afford more rights to your citizens than to foreign nationals. I only wish my own government was as concerned about national security.

[buckthesystem]

damo1

why dont they just say out right to stop the confusion we do not want bin laden and his group doing this in our country i mean things have changed and we need to be very care ful as this can know strike at our core values and when i say this i say its all bin ladens fault and the muslims that support him

i am not saying al muslims are bad or belive in what bin laden belives in so i am making this clear but comon this group has created all the fear and i feel its going to get worse they need to put the anti up and they need bin ladens head on a plate this is what needs to happen and i feel if the muslims wear to support what the armed forces are doing in their country instead of following this lunatic the jappanese goverment would not be doing this as they have been very lucky like with my country Australia the only two countrys that have been attacked are America and England

and i feel if we sit back on our back sides thinking nothing wil happen this is how i feel bin laden and his followers and those who they are wanting to brain wash to join them wil hit

so i am all for what the goverment is doing as at least they are not that atheist as the chinesse goverment is and to what it is about to do to the in house pastors

these people are not in the same situation as their other brothers who live in china its self at least they are thinking of their people and their home land

we need to be putting pressure on the muslims as this is what i feel needs to happen sorry folks yet this is how mad i am at what bin laden has done

it wil not be long before we are all strip searched when we board a plane to go to another country

gee i am going to go threw this my self when i take off in jan for two to the philippines with a 100 and 1 questions thrown on me and when i apply for a visa i stil have to put on my visa that i had criminal convictions in the past even though i have been clean for the last know 15yrs and out of trouble with the law

i have to even do this in the jobs i apply for so i am ok with what japan is about to do what weight til bin laden hits a city kills more people than we say oh we could have done something why did we not do this

i feel bin laden is planning to hit and we need to do everything we can to prottect not just our countrys but our air ports and any way this group can get in

good on you japan other countrys should follow suit with out complaining

from damo

Damo you've obviously put a lot of thought into this post, as you also do. However, please put the same amount of thought into answering just one little question for me:

You feel that fingerprinting and photographing all foreigners who enter Japan will prevent a Muslim terrorist attack on Japanese soil, so just how will it succeed in preventing such an attack?

I would think that if (and this is a pretty big if) a terrorist group of (say) four or five suicide bombers planned to enter Japan to blow up one of their trains. They would be quite happy to be fingerprinted and photographed on entering the country, because after they had finished their mission and blown themselves up taking hundreds - maybe thousands of people with them, they would be dead so what would they care if their fingerprints and likeness were on file?

On the other hand as "diplomats and children under 16 are excluded from the requirement", maybe Bin Laden could recruit a troupe of terrorists made up of 15 year old boys with a diplomat as their leader. Then there would be no record of the fingerprints or photographs of the perpetrators of a bombing.

Here's a quote from the article: "The pictures and fingerprints obtained by immigration officials will be made available to police and may be shared with foreign immigration authorities and governments".

Well, there's your answer right there. That is the real reason for all this. It has absolutely nothing to do with terrorism.

[buckthesystem]

What is the problem with Japan protecting the sovereignty of their country and the security of their citizens? Any American who lives along the southern border of the U.S. is acutely aware of the prudence of such a policy. It is NOT discriminatory to afford more rights to your citizens than to foreign nationals. I only wish my own government was as concerned about national security.

Glory, you've made an assertion here, but I really don't get the point. Would you please clarify and tell me exactly how taking fingerprints and photographs of foreigners entering their country would protect the sovereignty of Japan or make their citizens more secure?

[damo1]

damo1

to buck the system

you seem to like to pull people up with out alowing them to have their say i am seeing this in you i took my time to read before i had a say on this topic and i am sory you feel this way but blame the muslims for what is going on know not what some one says in their own post other country should take this stance you have not lived in a comunist country have you or under a comunist goverment i have my father has and many croations and serbians can tell you buck the system what its like to live under one man who give our orders and just dictates

when i share i also share from experiance yet i notice this in you its as if you like to have the last word my friend why is this ?

would you be able to handle living under a dictator ? i think not so pleas when i respond i respond only to how i wil have a say in this

why are you worried so much what the japan goverment wants to do i wish other country had the guts to do this hear in my country we are keeping a close eye on these nut cases and the muslims know it as wel as they live in fear as australians do not sit on their lazy back side we also have our say as well and every time something hapens these muslims hear live in fear as they know us aussie males will have a good old go

its time other countrys also started to take a deep good look at what the japan goverment is doing

do you think i like having to put on my visa when i go to the philippines about my criminal past or when ever i apply for a job hear in australia i have to tel about my criminal convictions it get up my nose as every time i do this i get knocked back i have been out of trouble for 10yrs my friend but i am still seen as a criminal and even though god has forgiven me for my past i stil have to have this mark its like its with me for the rest of my life yet i do not let it worry me

what worrys me is when is the next 9 /11 going to happen is it going to happen in australia as australia has been lucky so far yet our security is very hope less at our air port is it going to be in my partners country again as so far sevral bombs have gone of and people have been killed and hurt

are you one of these people that just sit in your safe place and just like having a dig when ever some one has a say ?

i am sorry you cant handle what i have to say its not my problem please do not ever try to correct or point some thing out to me if i ever respond to a post you leave sorry bud but its just the way i am on this

you wil worry when they start to ask for a full strip search this is what i am hearing wil happen next if the goverments get their way

the japan goverment is doing what it can to prottect its people hay i even have to allow imagration to look into my past as my figner prints are still on file but i have kept a clean nose and i know they wil not find a thing sometimes people with convictions also get knocked back from entering a country our department of imagrations does this a lot

god bless from damo

[MorningGlory]

What is the problem with Japan protecting the sovereignty of their country and the security of their citizens? Any American who lives along the southern border of the U.S. is acutely aware of the prudence of such a policy. It is NOT discriminatory to afford more rights to your citizens than to foreign nationals. I only wish my own government was as concerned about national security.

Glory, you've made an assertion here, but I really don't get the point. Would you please clarify and tell me exactly how taking fingerprints and photographs of foreigners entering their country would protect the sovereignty of Japan or make their citizens more secure?

Knowing who is in your country and their status is a pretty good way to manage sovereignty, IMO. My country learned this the hard way back in 2001. Of course, my government has still to enforce our borders adequately but...that's another subject.

[buckthesystem]

damo1

to buck the system

you seem to like to pull people up with out alowing them to have their say i am seeing this in you i took my time to read before i had a say on this topic and i am sory you feel this way but blame the muslims for what is going on know not what some one says in their own post other country should take this stance you have not lived in a comunist country have you or under a comunist goverment i have my father has and many croations and serbians can tell you buck the system what its like to live under one man who give our orders and just dictates

when i share i also share from experiance yet i notice this in you its as if you like to have the last word my friend why is this ?

would you be able to handle living under a dictator ? i think not so pleas when i respond i respond only to how i wil have a say in this

why are you worried so much what the japan goverment wants to do i wish other country had the guts to do this hear in my country we are keeping a close eye on these nut cases and the muslims know it as wel as they live in fear as australians do not sit on their lazy back side we also have our say as well and every time something hapens these muslims hear live in fear as they know us aussie males will have a good old go

its time other countrys also started to take a deep good look at what the japan goverment is doing

do you think i like having to put on my visa when i go to the philippines about my criminal past or when ever i apply for a job hear in australia i have to tel about my criminal convictions it get up my nose as every time i do this i get knocked back i have been out of trouble for 10yrs my friend but i am still seen as a criminal and even though god has forgiven me for my past i stil have to have this mark its like its with me for the rest of my life yet i do not let it worry me

what worrys me is when is the next 9 /11 going to happen is it going to happen in australia as australia has been lucky so far yet our security is very hope less at our air port is it going to be in my partners country again as so far sevral bombs have gone of and people have been killed and hurt

are you one of these people that just sit in your safe place and just like having a dig when ever some one has a say ?

i am sorry you cant handle what i have to say its not my problem please do not ever try to correct or point some thing out to me if i ever respond to a post you leave sorry bud but its just the way i am on this

you wil worry when they start to ask for a full strip search this is what i am hearing wil happen next if the goverments get their way

the japan goverment is doing what it can to prottect its people hay i even have to allow imagration to look into my past as my figner prints are still on file but i have kept a clean nose and i know they wil not find a thing sometimes people with convictions also get knocked back from entering a country our department of imagrations does this a lot

god bless from damo

Damo I was not being sarcastic! I was not "getting at you personally"! I guess it did sound rather hostile and for this I am really sorry! You usually post with total honesty and most of what you say is really worth reading, so I don't want to alienate you!

Yeah, I do "like to have the last word". This is because I am convinced that I have a valuable contribution to make to a debate - I admit it, it is a human characteristic.

You say: "would you be able to handle living under a dictator" Well the thing is that this has nothing at all to do with living under a dictator! I really don't see any relevance.

Also, quote: "are you one of these people that just sit in your safe place and just like having a dig when ever some one has a say ?"

Well, yeah, I do "sit in a safe place" but I wasn't "having a dig", I am genuinely concerned about this because it is symptomatic of the way the world is going. And it will come to me soon.

Quote: "do you think i like having to put on my visa when i go to the philippines about my criminal past or when ever i apply for a job hear in australia i have to tel about my criminal convictions it get up my nose as every time i do this i get knocked back i have been out of trouble for 10yrs my friend but i am still seen as a criminal and even though god has forgiven me for my past i stil have to have this mark its like its with me for the rest of my life yet i do not let it worry me"

I am personally totally against this. I believe strongly that what ever you did as a youth is irrelevant to anything today. A criminal record should be expunged if you are "clean" for, say, five years. It is irrelevant to your employment and your life in general, and hardly makes you "terrorist material". I also believe the only reason for it is so that the people with the power to make you disclose this can "get off" on this power over you.

Quote: "what worrys me is when is the next 9 /11 going to happen is it going to happen in australia as australia has been lucky so far yet our security is very hope less at our air port is it going to be in my partners country again as so far sevral bombs have gone of and people have been killed and hurt"

Sorry Damo, but I don't buy any of this! If you truly do believe this you are a victim of the "Reichstag fire" mentality.

AND IT MOST CERTAINLY ISN'T A REASON FOR JAPAN OR ANYONE ELSE FOR THAT MATTER TO FORCE ALL 'FOREIGNERS' TO BE FINGERPRINTED AND HAVE THEIR PHOTOGHRAPH ON FILE!!!!!

Quote: "you wil worry when they start to ask for a full strip search this is what i am hearing wil happen next if the goverments get their way

the japan goverment is doing what it can to prottect its people hay i even have to allow imagration to look into my past as my figner prints are still on file but i have kept a clean nose and i know they wil not find a thing sometimes people with convictions also get knocked back from entering a country our department of imagrations does this a lot"

Seriously, what has any of this got to do with Japan fingerprinting foreigners and demanding their photograph???????

The "the terrorists are at the door, oh lack a day, lackaday, woe is me" is the silliest excuse for different governments demanding that people give up their rights to basic privacy and their biometric measurements, and everything else that has been freely given up, that I have ever heard of.

That is my opinion, I am not trying to insult you! Honestly!

[Scarletprayers]

bucks, I don't mean this to sound insulting cause I love ya and you know it, so I'm just trying to be honest here, like you were with damo!

It worries me that you seem to think having to show ID is so bad, its worth innocent peoples lives. That there is absolutely no justification for the government to require ID. I've been having to show my ID ever since I started working, to get a job, to open a bank account, to get my license renewed, to cash a check............I don't mind, and I don't really care. If they want my fingerprints well, more power to them.

[damo1]

damo1

to buck the system

one i never am a person that is hostile i just found this thread and have been going over it very slow to see wear its up to the way i think its just who i am and by you saying the japanesee goverment should not be doing this our country is already in the prosses of having a natioanl id card its been already passed threw parliment and know they are working out the glitches so to get it right

the national id card wil have everything on from dr records to what you are alrergic to some did not like it at first but once people got use to the id of a national id card it is know cool

and the way i talk i talk also to what is going on in my partners country right now and i am all for what japan is about to do as i see no wrong in this with a big country like japan with more of a pupulation than us what is the problem of the goverment wanting to know who is in their country ? and i see know wrong in finger printing or taking some ones photo we do this on our pass ports when we plan to travel we have or citazen ship i feel this is a good thing

and to me it sounded like you wear having a good old dig

half of this has to do with bin laden as i have friends also in japan and honkong that are thinking hard on what they have seen so far to what bin laden is doing

and another thing i noticed as wel i wil be living in a country buck the system wear muslims kill christians my partners best freind is on an island in the philippines wear the heavy fighting has been her and her husband are very young pastors buck the system so if i am going to be pastoring along side of my partner than i need to learn as much as i can about abu sayiff as this is the main group that has been doing al the bombing and all the killing plus christian women have been raped buck the system and christians are the ones this group targets mainly and other dignitareys that come threw that country

we would be not in this situation if what happend on 9 /11 and also in london wear sevral bombs went off

so my friend i am with in my rights to worry as i wil be runing into this group when i go their in jan to meet my partners friend who has been pastoring a church in mindanoa

also buck the system i am going to have to be on full allert when i board a bus or a fairy to cross to lacastaliana as this is wear the new church is that my partner has just planted and this is wear i wil be based once my filapino citazen ship is approved

so when i talk or have an input into a topic i talk from experiance and not what i see on news or read in the paper and al my training i had in my own country is going to come to use my partner is a black belt even though she is a pastor and is a small women her self and it says we are not to use violence as vengance is the lords she is not a door mat all the single women her age serving in gods kingdom know how to handle them selves very wel and my partner has only used her skills twice to defend her self

you are forgiven but please do not ever try this on me i am also hear to what japan is doing it is going to happan to wear we wil be strip searched

well you are alowed to feel the way you are feeling i am also alowed to feel the way i am feeling

we have diffrent views on this and i respect you for your view on this i just ask for the same

god bless from your brother in the lord damien