What are the requirements/steps for salvation

[Guest shiloh357]

Even though baptism itself doesn't save us it still has a huge part in God's plan of salvation. It was mentioned already in Romans what happens in baptism. Many have said that baptism takes away from the work Jesus did on the cross, but Romans tells us that in baptism we are buried and resurrected with Jesus into his death and those who are dead are freed from their sins.

the Baptism spoken of in romans, particularly Romans 6 is not a reference to water immersion. The word baptism simply means "immerse" it does not mean "immersion in water." if I dunk a cookie in milk that is a "baptism" according to the usuage of the greek word. If you take a bath in a tub of water, that is a "baptism" as well.

We are immersed (baptized) into Christ by the Holy Spirit at the moment of salvation. That is all it means in Romans 6. we are taken out of Adam and immersed into Christ. It is also known a "positional justification."

[Khristeeanos]

Even though baptism itself doesn't save us it still has a huge part in God's plan of salvation. It was mentioned already in Romans what happens in baptism. Many have said that baptism takes away from the work Jesus did on the cross, but Romans tells us that in baptism we are buried and resurrected with Jesus into his death and those who are dead are freed from their sins.

the Baptism spoken of in romans, particularly Romans 6 is not a reference to water immersion. The word baptism simply means "immerse" it does not mean "immersion in water." if I dunk a cookie in milk that is a "baptism" according to the usuage of the greek word. If you take a bath in a tub of water, that is a "baptism" as well.

Perhaps you could give more here.

We are immersed (baptized) into Christ by the Holy Spirit at the moment of salvation. That is all it means in Romans 6. we are taken out of Adam and immersed into Christ. It is also known a "positional justification."

We are immersed into Christ by the Holy Spirit in baptism at the moment of salvation. It is clear from this and other verses. It is also the theological position of the entire Church (universal) until Huldrych Zwingli introduced a different meaning of baptism around Calvin's time.

[Rick-Parker]

You would cite all those chapters and verses to the guard (seeker) who asked what he must do to be saved? I would respond "I'm confused. I do have to do something besides believe in Jesus Christ as my savior? I must be baptised to be saved? What else must I do?" So, Paul did leave something out, is that right?

I left the rest of the passage in Acts out on purpose because they did not answer my question but described what happened after Paul witnessed to the jailer and his family.

[Khristeeanos]

Baptism is God's work - not mans work.

There is no where in scripture that says baptism is man's work. Look at the Great Co-mission:

Matthew 28:

18Then Jesus came to them and said, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."

Here we can break this down into parts.

1. Jesus has the authority for everything for all times.

2. Jesus gives the command to his followers to make disciples everywhere we go.

3. Jesus gives instructions on how to make disciples - through baptism.

4. Jesus teaches us to do good works.

5. Jesus makes us a promise to walk with His followers forever.

If people didn't have a presupposed theological bias it would be much more obvious that God is the one who instituted baptism and it is His work, not ours.

Be blessed.

[eric]

Baptism is God's work - not mans work.

There is no where in scripture that says baptism is man's work. Look at the Great Co-mission:

Matthew 28:

18Then Jesus came to them and said, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."

Here we can break this down into parts.

1. Jesus has the authority for everything for all times.

2. Jesus gives the command to his followers to make disciples everywhere we go.

3. Jesus gives instructions on how to make disciples - through baptism.

4. Jesus teaches us to do good works.

5. Jesus makes us a promise to walk with His followers forever.

If people didn't have a presupposed theological bias it would be much more obvious that God is the one who instituted baptism and it is His work, not ours.

Be blessed.

If my bible is correct, Jesus' commission was give to the eleven disciples who met Him in Galilee, where Jesus made arrangements to meet them. they were to make disciples of all nations (gentiles) baptising them in the name of Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Nothing mentioned about water. They would have a hard time immersing the gentiles who dwell in the deserts in water. The followers He referred in # 5 of your post, are his jewish followers.

Shiloh was right when he said you baptised into the body of Christ at the moment of receiving Him as your saviour, after repentance, and confessing the fact that you are a sinner in need of salvation. It was the Jews who were commanded to go forth and preach the gospel.

[Guest]

.... If people didn't have a presupposed theological bias it would be much more obvious that God is the one who instituted baptism and it is His work, not ours....

Amen!

Baptism

Fire

I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:

Matthew 3:11

By God's Power

Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.

Acts 11:16

Leaving No Brag Nor Boast

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Ephesians 2:8-9

No Thing Saves Or Sustains Except Jesus

Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins.

1 John 4:10

No Thing Covers And Cleans Except The Blood Of The Lamb Of God, Nothing

Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

Romans 3:25

The One Way Is KING Jesus Who Is The Way The Truth And The Life And All Other Ways Are But Speedways Of Death

Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Matthew 7:13-15

Only One Rock Of Ages Only One Savior Only One Hope For Sinners Only One Whose Holy Blood Was Only Once Shed For The Remission Of Sin Only Jesus Christ

Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.

Matthew 7:24-27

Recorded Bias

Jesus Saves

And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

1 John 5:11-13

Praise His Holy Name

Hallelujah

Amen

Be Blessed Beloved Of The KING OF THE JEWS

The LORD bless thee, and keep thee:

The LORD make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee:

The LORD lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.

And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them.

Numbers 6:24-27

Love, Your Brother Joe

Thy words were found, and I did eat them; and thy word was unto me the joy and rejoicing of mine heart: for I am called by thy name, O LORD God of hosts. Jeremiah 15:16

[Khristeeanos]

Baptism is God's work - not mans work.

There is no where in scripture that says baptism is man's work. Look at the Great Co-mission:

Matthew 28:

18Then Jesus came to them and said, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."

Here we can break this down into parts.

1. Jesus has the authority for everything for all times.

2. Jesus gives the command to his followers to make disciples everywhere we go.

3. Jesus gives instructions on how to make disciples - through baptism.

4. Jesus teaches us to do good works.

5. Jesus makes us a promise to walk with His followers forever.

If people didn't have a presupposed theological bias it would be much more obvious that God is the one who instituted baptism and it is His work, not ours.

Be blessed.

If my bible is correct, Jesus' commission was give to the eleven disciples who met Him in Galilee, where Jesus made arrangements to meet them. they were to make disciples of all nations (gentiles) baptising them in the name of Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Nothing mentioned about water. They would have a hard time immersing the gentiles who dwell in the deserts in water. The followers He referred in # 5 of your post, are his jewish followers.

Shiloh was right when he said you baptised into the body of Christ at the moment of receiving Him as your saviour, after repentance, and confessing the fact that you are a sinner in need of salvation. It was the Jews who were commanded to go forth and preach the gospel.

The command was to his followers, thus it had to be something they were capable of doing. Mentioning water is pointless since they can only baptise with water. It would be like me telling you to eat something and then having to mention that you must use your mouth to eat, seeing as that is the only way one can eat it would be silly to add that additional point.

Check church history - you will see baptism in water for the remission of sins as a work of God all through out until Mr. Z.

[eric]

xrom Kristeeanos,

QUOTE (Khristeeanos @ Jun 1 2008, 07:02 PM) .... If people didn't have a presupposed theological bias it would be much more obvious that God is the one who instituted baptism and it is His work, not ours....

No one is denying That God instituted baptism, but not a prerequisite for salvation. Getting baptized, in water, comes after salvation as a witness to the fact that you have been saved by grace through faith. I was water baptized by my daughter and her husband three weeks after I had made my committment to the Lord and had received the H/S.

I am happy with that, that is my exegisis on the subject and I won't be shifted.

[deut31:12]

Nothing mentioned about water. They would have a hard time immersing the gentiles who dwell in the deserts in water.

God provides for all those who are seeking to worship in spirit and in truth, or is faith limited?

We have an example of a Gentile in the middle of the desert who had the desire to do the will of God and the Holy Spirit took Philip to meet him and baptize him.

Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus. And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him. - Acts 8:35-38

Shiloh was right when he said you baptised into the body of Christ at the moment of receiving Him as your saviour, after repentance, and confessing the fact that you are a sinner in need of salvation. It was the Jews who were commanded to go forth and preach the gospel.

Shiloh is wrong. This goes completely against the order that Jesus laid it down, the way that Peter taught it, and the way the Apostles carried it out.

Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call. And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation. Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. - Acts 2:38-41

Remember, the Apostles are baptizing in water and Peter here is teaching the multitude that they need to be baptized. If we are baptized in the fashion that Shiloh says then there would have been no need for them to be baptizing in water.

With this water baptism we also read the scripture that says that there is only one baptism (Eph 4:5).

Jesus tells us the he that believes and is baptized will be saved. Peter says to be baptized for the remission of sins. Romans says that we are buried and raised with Christ and are freed from our sins. Today we are told that baptism is basically not even needed as part of the salvation of our souls and it doesn't matter if we are or not. What this all reminds of is the account of Eve and the serpent in the garden. When God told Adam and Eve not to eat of the fruit or they will die. The serpent told Eve to go ahead and eat of the fruit and that she will not surely die. In this Eve was beguiled. The same is going on today with baptism. After all the commandments and examples of baptism in how that when we believe and are baptized we will be saved and that we are baptized for the remission of sins we are now being told that we really don't need it.

I would think after reading here how much faith people are professing, how much they love God, and how that Jesus is their savior that anybody could pick and choose not to obey certain verses of the bible while using excuses such as no water in desert, thief on the cross, Oreo cookies, deathbed, etc.

When we stand before God on judgment day and he asks us why we didn't get baptized are we going to say that the thief on the cross wasn't so I didn't, or the guy in the desert didn't so I didn't, or I didn't want to be an Oreo cookie, etc.?

If baptism was as Shiloh professes it then we would not have been told to be baptized as it would have been an automatic thing through God and the scriptures would tell us that when we asked Jesus to become our savior that we are automatically baptized into Jesus. There also would be no water baptism examples.

If baptism was not part of God's plan of salvation for mankind then it would not have been included in the scriptures. We can't pick and choose what we think is required for salvation like the scriptures are a menu to pick from.

Jesus is the way the truth and the life. With this he commissioned that this was something required for man to do as part of the salvation of our souls.

[EricH]

Check church history - you will see baptism in water for the remission of sins as a work of God all through out until Mr. Z.

This is a fallacious argument. Just because something was believed in the past, does not make it the correct belief.