2 Tim & Titus- some things from Paul I didn't get

[jeffnevins]

Titus 1-

12Even one of their own prophets has said, "Cretans are always liars, evil brutes, lazy gluttons." 13This testimony is true.

It would be tough to say this about a whole nation today. I guess the population was somewhat small there- Did someone meet every person in the nation & confirm it? Or it's an expression...

2 Tim 2-

4No one serving as a soldier gets involved in civilian affairs

[kross]

Titus 1-

12Even one of their own prophets has said, "Cretans are always liars, evil brutes, lazy gluttons." 13This testimony is true.

It would be tough to say this about a whole nation today. I guess the population was somewhat small there- Did someone meet every person in the nation & confirm it? Or it's an expression...

2 Tim 2-

4No one serving as a soldier gets involved in civilian affairs

[cymba22]

I have some problems with whatever version your reading....

this is what I get for those same passages

Tts 1:12 One of themselves, [even] a prophet of their own, said, The Cretians [are] alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies.

Tts 1:13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;

now reading that....its talking about cretians not whole nations...look where the comma is.

Now 2 tim 2-5

2Ti 2:2 And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also.

2Ti 2:3 Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ.

2Ti 2:4 No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of [this] life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.

2Ti 2:5 And if a man also strive for masteries, [yet] is he not crowned, except he strive lawfully.

as you can see it reads completly differant...athleates are not even mentioned. off hand if I remember correctly this has bearing on being obediant to whomever is in charge of you and work with integrity and honour.

2Ti 2:18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.

Ressurection for judgement at grreat white throne.

2Ti 2:22 Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

the whole verse should answer your question on this

2Ti 4:18 And the Lord shall deliver me from every evil work, and will preserve [me] unto his heavenly kingdom: to whom [be] glory for ever and ever. Amen.

the above is what my version uses for that verse...as you can see...it makes way mroe sense.

[EricH]

Titus 1-

12Even one of their own prophets has said, "Cretans are always liars, evil brutes, lazy gluttons." 13This testimony is true.

It would be tough to say this about a whole nation today. I guess the population was somewhat small there- Did someone meet every person in the nation & confirm it? Or it's an expression...

The context of Titus 1:12 is the appointment of elders with certain qualifications. One of the key roles of the eders in the Cretan church would be:

holding to the faithful message as taught, so that he will be able both to encourage with sound teaching and to refute those who contradict it.

Titus 1:9 HCSB

The reason Paul is looking for this ability in the Cretan elders is that one of the pervasive characterisitics of the Cretan culture at that time was:

For there are also many rebellious people, idle talkers and deceivers, especially those from Judaism. It is necessary to silence them; they overthrow whole households by teaching for dishonest gain what they should not.

Titus 1:10-11 HCSB

To support his observation about the Cretan culture, Paul quotes one of their own prophets (cultural commentators):

One of their very own prophets said, Cretans are always liars, evil beasts, lazy gluttons.

Titus 1:12 HCSB

Basically Paul is saying, "Don't take my word for it, look at what the Cretans say about themselves."

[EricH]

4No one serving as a soldier gets involved in civilian affairs

[EricH]

2 Tim 4

18The Lord will rescue me from every evil attack and will bring me safely to his heavenly kingdom.

Wasn't he martyred (beheaded)? Sounds like an evil attack.

I believe he's in God's kingdom, though.

Thanks for any insights-

Paul believed God would bring him through the sufferings to the other side (eternity).

[jeffnevins]

Amazing help on those. Thanks very much.