The Deity of Christ

[Guest shiloh357]

There is no way the term Son of God can mean God the son, no matter how hard you try to prove it.

You just don't understand Hebrew culture:

[jmwhalen]

(bold/underline my emphasis)

[jmwhalen]

"Columbo: the Case of the Missing Believer"(or, subtitle- "Who Wrote this Book?"(The Holy Bible))

Submitted/prepared by John M. Whalen

(bold my emphasis)

Most of us love a

[RebekahDavid]

Dear Mike,

blessings.

Scripture does indeed speak clearly that Jesus is Lord- not a prophet, not a merely a man but Lord. search your heart what does the term "Lord " mean?

as Erich showed you in this post: (bold emphasis mine)

John 8: 58

Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, I am.

1. In the original Hebrew of Exodus the exact same words are used that we today translate as "I am". One says I am that I am, the other I am.. In both cases it is the exact same Hebrew word. Since Jesus did not make these statements in Greek, the septuagint's forumlation has no bearing here. Jesus would have been quoting the Hebrew. The Jewish Bible translation of John uses the exact Hebrew word from the original Hebrew of Exodus.

2. You have misunderstood the rules of Greek grammar. The septuagint reads. I am (ego eimi) that I am (ho hown) ... say to Israel I Am (ho hown). What you failed to mention is the eimi and hown are different forms of the exact same verb in Greek. They are in different forms because of their place in the sentence and the grammar. Eimi is in the 1st person singular present indicative active. Hown is the present active participial form of eimi in the nominative case. They are not 2 different words. They are the same word used 2 ways grammatically (because of where they are in the sentence).

3. If Jesus was not quoting Exodus, He would not have used ego eimi to say that he simply existed before Abraham. The present indicative active would not work there, He would have used "I was" not "I am".

4. The greek in John could not have used ho Hown for grammatical reasons.

5. That the Jews took up to stone Him for blasphemy shows that his original hearers understood he was making a claim to diety.

So you analysis is incorrect here. They are not 2 different words, they are the same word in dofferent grammatical forms. Also the context of the passage mitigates against your conclusions. neither the grrek grammar, the hebrew, nor the context support your conclusions.

you have not answered the above post nor the question in the post below posted below by blind seeker:

"Can you explain how the death of one man can atone for the sins of all humanity?"

love your sister in Christ,

Rebekah David

[jmwhalen]

(underline/bold is min emphasis)

[traveller]

There hve been good refutations in this thread. However, it is circling over the same ground, and has become redundant. I want to thank everyone for their participation.

To mike s - I do want you to know that all of us here really do care about your choices and your decisions. I personally care about your future and your standing before God. Please, study on the things said here.

You will continue in my prayers, mike.

[traveller]

i agree

here is another

John 8: 58Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

love your sister in Christ,

Rebekah David

John 8: 58

Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, I am. Many site this, claiming Christ is saying He is,

[Guest shiloh357]

Why does Luke not make sure we know Christ was God, Here we have only the statement Christ is the Messiah. You would think Luke would have included the revelation Christ was God, yet it is not mentioned here. That

[Botz]

Hi Mike...if you consider what it is that actually sets G-d apart and defines Him as G-d, I think the same gradual process of revelation that dawned on the disciples will dawn on you. Here's praying. Botz

Let's look at what the Disciples said

Matthew 8:27 But the men marvelled, saying, What manner of man is this, that even the winds and the sea obey him! (Would they marvel if God calmed the sea?)

Matthew 16:13-17. When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am? And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets. He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am? And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven. (The Christ, not God, Christ told Peter he was correct)

Matthew 17:4 Then answered Peter, and said unto Jesus, Lord, it is good for us to be here: if thou wilt, let us make here three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias. (No difference between how they would honor God, then how they would honor Moses and Elias)

Matthew 21:20 And when the disciples saw it, they marvelled, saying, How soon is the fig tree withered away! (Would they marvel that God could do this?)

Mark 6:49-51 But when they saw him walking upon the sea, they supposed it had been a spirit, and cried out: For they all saw him, and were troubled. And immediately he talked with them, and saith unto them, Be of good cheer: it is I; be not afraid. And he went up unto them into the ship; and the wind ceased: and they were sore amazed in themselves beyond measure, and wondered. (Same as Matt.21:20)

Mark 8:23-25 23. And he took the blind man by the hand, and led him out of the town; and when he had spit on his eyes, and put his hands upon him, he asked him if he saw ought. And he looked up, and said, I see men as trees, walking. After that he put his hands again upon his eyes, and made him look up: and he was restored, and saw every man clearly. (Would God need two attempts to heal?)

Luke 24:19 And he said unto them, What things? And they said unto him, Concerning Jesus of Nazareth, which was a prophet mighty in deed and word before God and all the people (A prophet not God)

Hi again Mike...thanks for your response.

I think you missed the point I was trying to make(sometimes I could be clearer...you know the feeling, its in your heart, but you cannot adequately express what you are trying to get out)....

What is it about G-d, that sets Him so far apart from anyone or anything, that there can be absolutely no doubts that He alone is G-d, and that He is incomparable? (notice I am not using any Scriptural references. )

and...hi again Mike, I'm glad Traveller opened this thread again, and I know you have been industrious in your discussions, but I did ask you this several days ago, and was hoping you might find time to reply. Thanks in advance. Botz

[jmwhalen]

bold/underline my emphasis)