Ancient Boundaries?

[Matthitjah]

Grace to you,

I heard a marvelous sermon some months back about the Ancient Boundaries and I wanted to open a discussion here about it.

Let's start with this verse I read this morning from Hosea;

Ho

[Guest]

Secondly, what are the Boundaries Stones, landmark, or bounds?

There Is A Physical Land And Peoples Of The Promise That These Terms Surly Apply to

And Her Name Is Israel And The City Of Jerusalem

And The People Of Faith

As I See It

The Rock Is The LORD

And The Boundaries Are His Holy Words

And The Landmark Event For All Of Mankind Is The LORD Jesus Christ And Him Crucified

The LORD

Our Rock

He only is my rock and my salvation: he is my defence; I shall not be moved. Psalms 62:6

Our Shield (Boundary)

For thou, LORD, wilt bless the righteous; with favour wilt thou compass him as with a shield. Psalms 5:12

Our Turning Point (Landmark Event)

At that time will I bring you again, even in the time that I gather you:

for I will make you a name and a praise among all people of the earth, when I turn back your captivity before your eyes, saith the LORD. Zephaniah 3:20

Maranatha!

Soon

Therefore say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; I will even gather you from the people, and assemble you out of the countries where ye have been scattered, and I will give you the land of Israel.

And they shall come thither, and they shall take away all the detestable things thereof and all the abominations thereof from thence.

And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh,

and will give them an heart of flesh: That they may walk in my statutes, and keep mine ordinances,

and do them: and they shall be my people,

and I will be their God. Ezekiel 11:17-20

Hallelujah!

[Hunterpoet]

From the commentaries that I read concerning this, it seems the boundaries are the laws, both G-ds and mans that were set down in ancient times to guide the people.

The princes, are any of power around the king, seem to have changed or altered the laws, both G-d and mans to suit their owns needs and desires.

The flood waters are the enemies of Judah that inflict G-ds punishment.

This is very interesting. Changing or abandoning G-ds law results in punishment, not nessecarily by natural disaster, but by your enemies. Also, doing likewise with man's law handed down by the forefathers can have the same result, the assumption here is that the man made laws were formed with G-ds guidance. Makes me think of America.

A good study and read....thank you

[Guest yod]

Those are all good "spiritual" applications but I think it is literally speaking to a basic dishonesty in everyday dealings. Moving a boundry was stealing a piece of your neighbors (or even brother's) property.

It speaks of the covetousness of wanting more than the Lord has given you....a foundational dissatisfaction with the Lord comparable to Esau selling his birthright for a bowl of porridge.

[Guest]

[Tehilah Ba'Aretz]

This passage can be taken literally so we mustn't completely leave the literal understanding unmentioned. Hebron is one of the ancient landmarks mentioned in the Bible as is Jericho. These boundaries have been removed from Israel in recent times and that really should not be the case. I have wondered at times if the fact that Prime Minister Rabin was murdered might have been because God removed protection from him after he gave away those two cities.

[Guest]

This passage can be taken literally.....

Yes Dear Brother, Yes!

And The Final Reckoning Is Yet To Come

I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for my people and for my heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted my land. Joel 3:2

[Botz]

Hi Dave...

Ok so I am waiting for the rest of this sermon before comment, but in answer to the question.

G-d has boundaries that He has ordained for the world...He set the stars in the Heavens...He set the earth on its foundations....He has limited the range of the Seas etc.

Likewise He set the borders for the people of Israel, and declared their limitation.

Likewise the land itself was broken into portions for the Twelve tribes...

Likewise people themselves had boundary stones marking out their portion of family land.

(When I lived in France, the land on which I lived was marked out with old boundary stones.)

THERE EXIST BOUNDARIES OF THE LAND, OF THE LAW AND OF THE HEART.

The Mosaic Law provides boundaries, and as people know, some zealous leaders of Torah created their own traditions/boundaries to protect further the boundaries that G-d set. Its a bit like G-d creating a barbed wire fence, and us placing mines and other deterents in front of it so that no one will even get to G-ds fence and have a chance of breaking through.

The fulfilment of the Law in/through Yeshua also provides boundaries, some say more than the 613 mitzvot (248 positive 365 negative ones) in the Mosaic Covenant and over 1,000 in the New Covenant.

In the Mosaic covenant a boundary stone might be...'thou shalt not commit adultery'

In the Messianic covenant...'don't look with lust in your eyes'

The Messianic does not negate the Mosaic...it fulfils it...it makes it even more exact (thus the 'Law' is not destroyed or put aside...it is completed. Digression over.)

[Matthitjah]

Grace to you,

The sermon I heard was on the Ancient Boundaries in the mindset of the Law of the Lord. All respondents have touched upon it.

I particularly like Botz's response here;

In the Mosaic covenant a boundary stone might be...'thou shalt not commit adultery'

In the Messianic covenant...'don't look with lust in your eyes'

It wasn't my intent to repost the whole sermon but to generate thought on it's premise which is what we seem to have done.

Hunterpoet hit on it in stating that America has begun to cross those ancient boundarly lines set by God. The sermon I heard was on Homosexual Marriage but not even that in particular.

We have heard that Gods Tender Mercy is New every day.

I believe that this goes along well with Gods Longsuffering Mercy and Lovingkindness towards us men that we might turn to repentance.

It is only in the last several decades that we as a Nation have really begun to step across the Ancient Boundary lines with open and flagrant boldness.

It would appear that God Judged Judah for removing the Ancient Boundaries.

Would it be prudent to state that God has set bounds upon the affairs of men?

I take from the responses so far that the Bounds can be:

1.) Land boundaries

2.) an inheritance or portion

3.) the bounds of physical plains

4.) the bounds of the Law of God

5.) supernatural bounds (we see this evidenced in how far satan could harm Job)

Here's another Scripture which I find relevant to the discussion;

Pr

[Tehilah Ba'Aretz]

Isaiah 5:20 Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil: who put darkness for light, and light for darkness: who put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!

This rather odd list in uncannily familiar. It might be a description of the guidelines for an American TV sitcom. It could just as easily be a description of hard hitting business ethics or world politics. This is a list of boundaries though, that seems clear.