Angelfishie

He WAS possessed before he was saved (about 48 hours ago). Please read what I wrote instead of deciding what I mean. I didn't change the wording of anything. My explanation of the point regarding possession in Christians was not an explanation of THIS situation or person. I was simply disagreeing with your ascertion. Or perhaps your semantics. I did however come looking for help and suggestions, not a theological argument around assumptions. Thank you for your contribution.

I think you should read my request again, there's an order of events which has happened here. WE ARE NOW AT THE POINT where he needs discipleship. That statement clearly indicates a process of events which has culminated in THIS point in time, and the use of the word discipleship in the context of the word "now" infers the state of NOW being saved. One who came to Christ OUT of possession needs a specific kind of discipleship quite different to the kind which someone who didn't have that experience of the demonic would need. There are specific questions that that individual will need answers to that run-of-the-mill discipleship generally does not offer. And a Christian absolutely can have a demon in control of a particular area of their lives (which by dictionary definition is "possession" - which denotes "mastery over" not inhabitation as popularly believed). I've SEEN it with my own eyes and the idea that it can't happen is one of the lies of the enemy uses to lull Christians into denial and idolatry.. and not dealing with the shameful areas of permissiveness in their lives, the closed doors, the secret shames. If you have something in your life that is secret from EVERYONE else who doesn't share that thing... you have demonic strongholds - places where the enemy can influence and control you with shame and fear. It DOESN'T mean inhabitation - though I'm not saying that inhabitation doesn't exist because it most certainly does, and I would agree that inhabitation cannot take place if the Holy Spirit already inhabits you. So - I reiterate - please if there's anyone in the Michigan area here - please contact me or post here!

EVERY person is invested in and endowed with a facet of God's heart for others. For years (since my early teens) I've KNOWN with an absolute certainty that my "heart" was for teaching Christians how to tap into the Spirit. I'm NOT an evangelist, I'm NOT a person who takes care of physical needs. That is NOT the heart God gave me. If you have a Heart for the Jewish people then embrace it, pursue it, equip and empower yourself with knowledge. Learn Hebrew, read the Torah, read all the books and scriptures for the Jewish people, go after it with FULL FORCE, because God will anoint you and empower you to reach those hearts that other people declare are closed off from the truth! Step out in Faith and reach for the people God is giving you!

It honestly sounds like the actual Question part of the question was left out. I don't see them doing any asking of anything, and the actual request seems like it should come somewhere after this part "Of all these 5 books of Moses (known as the Torah or law) were the " most high rated. The keeping of the Torah was very strongly emphasized" and before this part: "Differentiate between the "Ceremonial", "Civil" and "moral" law. For 6 marks." It REALLY seems like there's a piece missing out of the question.

Hi guys I've been counselling by email a young man somewhere in the Michigan area. We've come to the point where he really needs discipleship and prayer and some really good teaching - I'm looking for people in the Michigan area to give me some names of good Evangelical Pro-Spirit Christian Communities/Churches in the area that I can point him to, or groups who are well versed in Spiritual warfare to minister to him. Or indeed members who are in Michigan who can come alongside him and disciple him. It's been really hard to get actual info out of him because he's been suffering under massive possession and torment of demons, so if you're not a real warfare type, then this is not for you, I'm looking for someone who is VERY grounded, VERY confident, very certain of what they believe and who can HEAR the Holy Spirit, and is working in gifts and power. I'm not looking for help from anyone who wants to do deliverance rituals or anything like that. I'm looking for someone/a group/church/community that KNOWS how to disciple someone who is clueless and has been demonically tormented because of his ancestor's involvement in witchcraft. Can anyone help me, are there any Michigan members on Worthy? Thanks to any and all for suggestions, tips, ideas or directions!

Bill Johnson responded to this story on a podcast/radio station.

Yes, I've heard it referred to as "The seat of False Religion or Idolatry" (or the belief system that sets itself up against, contrary to God, trying to redirect glory away from the Lord Almighty) which was established in the original city of Babylon (hence the reference and name) and then grew and insidiously spread into all these kingdoms mentioned in the reference scripture, and it's by this system of false religion, this established mindset of self-serving idolatry which underpins the way these governments and rulers operate, that the beast can ultimately gain his foothold and by which the false prophet can persuade and entrap.

Precisely, but most Christians lump one guy's theory (which isn't that well supported anymore, even in Scientific atheistic circles) with all the other aspects of this 'field of study' and scratch a big red line through it all and declare it utter crap. Which in turn makes those atheistic scientific types laugh at us. Because a massive portion of the data which led to the guy presenting that theory in the first place is REAL provable science. I'm not big on throwing out facts because they led some people to think up objectionable and offensive theories that contradict my beliefs. I'll just bin the theories and keep the science... If you actually look at definitions for "evolution" there's no subtext which includes the theory of Ape to Man evolution as "fact" because there's no actual proof to support this theory - and so, therefore, it cannot be considered "fact" - not even to scientists in the field. A better question would have been Are there Christians who believe that Man evolved from Apes? To which my answer would be: no, I do not believe men evolved from apes.

I have studied this subject (and clarified in a later post precisely what I MEAN in this context) and as per my clarification: I was referring to the biological process and not the Theory of Evolution - which is a not actually one single theory at all - of which some are, I agree, quite nonsensical.

Oh, I'm sorry, you appeared to be asking for help. I misunderstood your intent.

Precisely.

Ok, so here's a thing that keeps happening when conversations about this particular issue arise; if the people having this conversation come from a science/biology background or arena they tend to have this dictionary definition for the word evolution, in mind: Evolution Biology. change in the gene pool of a population from generation to generation by such processes as mutation, natural selection, and genetic drift. Which does not refute the existence of God, or specifically promote or purport the idea that man evolved from apes. Thing is we can SEE the process of biological evolution happen in specific animals (the rats in London's sewer system are an excellent example), over just a few years, so if you ask me, it definitely exists. Theories, like those of ape to man evolution, are just that, theories. Extrapolated, projected and calculated ideas that "go well" with the things we can prove. There are several theories connected to the study of the biological process of evolution. Many of them are complete rubbish and some are pure conjecture. But they are theories so some of them are bound to be nonsense and completely unprovable. Most people who are not from a science/biology background will actually be discussing the veracity of just one or two of these theories, which are related to the field of study; evolutionary biology, AND NOT the biological process to which the actual term "evolution" refers. And this is why I believe there is so much disconnect over this topic. SO: to clarify: I do not believe that humans evolved from apes. I do not believe that there is sufficient evidence in the fossil record to support such a claim. I do however totally accept and believe that the biological evolutionary process does exist and operates on a daily basis in all types of species worldwide.

@JTC this is part of the reason Paul exhorts is to be part of a church community, so we can specifically avoid being isolated from the rest of the Body of Christ. Please make a point of being connected to a local cell/ or home church or community church. You will quickly have wads of opportunity to connect with people and make like-minded friends. Churches also often have programs for singles, older folks or people who need additional support. And they're all part of our family, and they only don't know you're there and need them. Reach out and connect with your true family. Edit: I noted your comment about churches in your area, if you message me with where you are - I can put my cyberskills to use and see what opportunities I can find you in your area...

Me too SBlue! I come from a very intellectual family who were not particularly academic, however I've worked and lived with academic people and spaces now for close to 25 years and I too, understanding the actual term and scientific implications, believe evolution takes place all the time all around us. It makes complete sense to me that God who made first instances of things that self-replicate would instigate processes (like evolution) that self-propel. There's absolutely no conflict for me between these two ideas.

@onedirection I've read this thread through and am interested to see parallels to how I'm experiencing coming back from a massive relational earthquake, of which I admittedly had a huge part in allowing or facilitating the unfolding. My husband was caught out violating the terms of our relationship, and ultimately, after eleven months of spiritual warfare, prayer and a massive spiritual learning curve, I left. But within a month, he admitted his wrongdoings (after months of blunt persistent deflection or lies) and apologised and I chose to come back because of promptings from the Spirit about what my husband's annoiting is and God's purpose for his life. And my desire to see him free from his past and living in the fullness of abundant life. Now I'm in a place very similar to your current state. But there's no counselors - even if I could get him to agree to go, there is no one I trust in my town who shares our faith. I feel for you brother and I totally relate. Happy to chat any time.

I'm a painter too, Deb. Acrylic though. How does one share images?

I greatly dislike videos like this... some of what was shown in that video was genuine and some of it was quite bizarre. Are we to simply believe this lot's take in its entirety, because they say it is so. Although I do not doubt something dodge is going on with this lot at Bethel who are seeking signs and manifestations instead of God himself, I do not think the wild dramatisation and using video of people being slain in the spirit (which I've experienced many many times in many many forms) as a way to drum up more disbelief and drama is a good thing. I am convinced that if you are brimming over with the Spirit and filled to overflowing with the Word, this sort of thing cannot draw you in. Plus if you believe that each individual person has a specific unique God-given (and ultimately God-equipped & anointed) purpose (as the scripture suggests) to fulfil. I'm really a bit confused as to why you would want someone else's anointing if you have your own lined up waiting for you to claim? Seems like the pure silliness of people who do not understand WHO they are in God.

If you read the first 5 or so books of the Old Testament you'll see God's instructions for his people in terms of their worship and their offerings etc. The house of Levi was the priestly house, they served in the temple and received none of the inheritance (land/ plunder etc) allotments given to the other 11 family lines. Instead each of the others had to give a percentage of theirs (and specific offerings as defined in the instructions) to the Levites/ in sacrifice at the temple as part of their sacrifice, tithe and worship. Some of these offerings at the temple (or portions of them), including physical items, measures of grain, food, wealth and livestock, were specifically given by God to the Levites as their portion and share. As such the Levites (or the priests) did not tithe and were not required to - they were bound by a much longer and more complicated set of requirements actually (read Leviticus). In light of this I come to the conclusion that this is God reprimanding the nation as a whole for not upholding his statutes and keeping his laws, which they had unfortunately made a habit of doing. The question posed is "how will we return to God?" The answer is "begin with tithing". The key teaching here as it applies to us now in the new covenant context: The reason that tithing is the mechanism for returning to God is that it's both an act of obedience and of faith. It's a literal choosing of God over self. He says "give me the FIRST ten percent of your income" - doing that means you actually have to act in obedience before (as soon as you get that income) you see the benefits of that faith (the promises - open heaven, blessings, rebuke for the devourer - he lists after) come to fruit in your life. So if one is willing to prove their commitment to God, by stepping out in faith, and acting in obedience, and tithing to his local church, this proves the intent of your heart in 'returning' to God. And when he sees us do this, He will return to us (individually in personal relationship with us), as promised, and in our new covenant context He lavishes us with His undeserved Grace and Love when we do this.

It's interesting to reference Peter recognising Moses and Elijah because there's really no logical reason he would have because they lived thousands of years prior. It appears in fact that we'll easily recognise not only our own loved ones, but we'll somehow KNOW pretty much any other member of the Body of Christ.

Try reading "Bait of satan" John Bevere. A friend of mine has a similar struggle and he said this book (and one called "battlefield of the mind" by Joyce Myers really helped him too).