Overcome with awareness of people's eternal destination....

[carlos123]

Howdy tryingtounderstand,

Don't know about what everyone else believes but yes, I believe in a literal hell.

A hell that I wish to encourage others to avoid through the blood of Christ. But it's not just about avoiding hell tryingtounderstand. There is more to becoming a Christian than just trying to avoid an eternal hell.

God loves us and has our best interests at heart for one. He is not out to rip us off or make us miserable.

All the more reason to discuss what the Gospel is and how it should be presented in a discussion of potentially writing tracks together.

Perhaps it would be best if you started a seperate thread where we could discuss what you brought up more fully than in this one. Don't know. Just a thought to consider.

Or you can DM me anytime.

Carlos

PS. If you want to discuss this here on this thread more that's fine too. Perhaps that is a way in which we can indirectly discuss what the Gospel is though such a discussion might take up a lot of posts before it is concluded.

Does everyone on this forum believe in a fiery tormenting hell? I just can't believe that God would burn someone alive forever when he would not even approve of letting his people burn their children alive to the god Molech. Plus it would be unjust to punish someone forever when they had only lived a few years of life as a sinner and God is not unjust. No but and eye for an eye, life for life. punishment for sin is death not everlasting torment. Plus I know God would not take pleasure in anyone suffering that long no matter how bad they were in this short life. Adam was told that he would go back to the dust. Fire accomplishes the same thing it completely destroys what is thrown in it thus never again existing.

There is many scriptures in the Bible that are hard to balance but I just think about God's ultimate qualities first being love then wisdom, justice and power and the thought of a burning torturing hell makes no sense to me. Nobody who says that they are love would do such a thing. How many of you could burn your child in a fire and watch him suffer even for a minute? Well if you can't do it then neither will God because he is love!

[Believer1997]

Believer1997,

I just now noticed that you are a member of the fairer gender

And here I thought I was talking to a man all along

I shall endeavour to be...well...less like a bull in a China closet and more gentle in the future

.

Carlos

LOL - no need to give me special treatment Carlos - I grew up in a houseful of 'bulls in china shops' and it's made me strong and somewhat opinionated... God works with me everyday to be more patient and understanding. We are all works in progress - blessings!!

[carlos123]

LOL - no need to give me special treatment Carlos - I grew up in a houseful of 'bulls in china shops' and it's made me strong and somewhat opinionated... God works with me everyday to be more patient and understanding. We are all works in progress - blessings!!

Whew! (Wiping sweat from my brow)

Thanks...I'll go back to being a bull in china closet then

You are so right about us all being works in progress. I've got to be more careful about thinking that I am a better work in process than the rest of my brothers and sisters in Christ. I was so humbled this morning before the Lord to realize that I am just a flub. A floppy Christian who flops around like a fish out of water when compared to the kind of Christian I should be. I am my worst enemy in the Presence of God in that I so often get in the way of what He might want to do through me.

My temptation when my eyes are opened, yet once again to the deceitful nature of the sin within me, is to withdraw and go hide in a corner somewhere. But I know that the Lord would have me stand strong in His grace and keep moving forward on those things which He has seemingly laid on my heart to do.

Carlos

[tryingtounderstand]

I don't think I have enough posts to start a new thread. I tried and got denied. So that is why I brought it up here plus the theme of this thread had to do with peoples eternal destination. If you can start a new thread then I'll talk about there or here.

I believe in Christ. In fact he is just about the only reason I even have faith. A lot of the Bible just makes me feel depressed, unworthy, and no good. But he gives me hope that just maybe I can be saved through all the mess. A lot of Christians believe that if you just accept and believe Christ then you will be saved. Yes I think that you must accept him and believe but there are many scriptures that make it seem like you still need to do more than that.

example: Many will say to me in that day lord lord..... yet he will not accept them. Matt 7:21-23 So will I or you be one of those who is say lord lord and yet is not be acceptable to him? I feel that I have a good heart and I care for people, ALL people not just Christians and isn't that what we are supposed to feel. Jesus said love your enemy,love your neighbor and be perfect like the Father is perfect by loving everyone. What about the millions in China that were not brought up Christian or in other countries that have other religions? We are lucky to be born here were Christianity is prevalent. So if your born is Iran or China then you are just doomed. There has to be another way God will deal with the nations that are not Christian because it is not fair that just because they are born and raised in a nation that does not know Christ that they should die. Everyone should have a chance to accept Christ and my belief is that God will be just and give them that chance in the resurrection of the dead. The second resurrection that is!

Another problem is how do you convince people that Christ is the way when so many Christians believe differently?Who is right who is wrong? Plus their is much corruption in the churches that even Christ said would happen. He said true Christians would be kicked out and betrayed by fellow Christians! matt 24:9-13

Might biggest and hardest thing to understand is that we are not on a fair and level playing field. Satan has way to much power to influence and corrupt leaving most at a disadvantage. Not only that but we must fight are own sinful inclinations that we were born with too. This is what I mean when I say Christ is the only one that gives me hope because inborn sin and Satan are two powerful things to overcome! I really don't understand why God has given that evil being so much free reign to destroy and deceived his creation. I know he promises to fix everything but why so much suffering and why let such an evil being have so much power to ruin people?

I could go on and on and I sure you will give me some Bible verse that you think will answer all of this but I think it is very complicated and I wonder why is has to be so complicated. You figure if God is love that it would not be so hard and there would not be so much evil and he would want people to come to him and be loved by him. But the world is such a mess under Satan's control and people have been deceived. It just doesn't seem fair.

My favorite verse is this one because it is how it should be. 1 cor 15:22 emphasis on ALL!

[carlos123]

Good morning to you tryingtounderstand!

I don't think I have enough posts to start a new thread. I tried and got denied. So that is why I brought it up here plus the theme of this thread had to do with peoples eternal destination. If you can start a new thread then I'll talk about there or here.

I really didn't want to start another thread as I got lots of things going on that tie up my time elsewhere on the Internet but I will start a new thread so that we can discuss this more thoroughly. It's important.

Please know that your questions and concerns are no different than the kind of questions and concerns I had before I became a Christian. There are answers to many. But also you need to understand that not all your questions and concerns will be answered to your satisfaction. After 30 years of being a Christian myself...I still got questions and concerns!

But I also know that the Lord is real and that I have forgiveness and am headed for the promised land .

And a lot of times, though not always (as the recent bout of frustration I have felt in the last few days can testify to), I experience a joy and peace in my heart that is very real, and not something I make up to soothe myself, as a result of having real relationship with Him.

Anyway I will start another thread and post a link to it here if you want to follow me to it.

Thanks for your openess. I appreciate that.

Carlos

[carlos123]

Oh...one other thing tryingtounderstand.....

The thread I start may get moved, by virtue of what we are discussing, to a place on here called the Seekers forum. There are some pluses to having such a thread moved to the Seekers forum. Among them, no post will be allowed unless it is first reviewed by a Moderator. That can be a good thing in that people with weird ideas or beliefs or those who might respond to you in a less than loving way...won't be able to steer you wrong.

But for me personally...such a thing would cause me to not want to post since I would always be wondering if the time I take to post would be wasted in that a Moderator might not let through what I say however loving or true what I say might be.

It's just a concern of mine and I do not mean to say that Moderators here are in the habit of denying good posts.

So...if the thread I start ends up in the Seekers area such that my posts will first be reviewed I will most likely contact you through DM so that we can continue conversing without having my posts go through a delaying review process before they are allowed into the thread if that's okay with you.

Regardless whether you and I continue our conversation or not...please do stick around as I am sure that others here can also help you with your answers and concerns.

Carlos

[carlos123]

Here's the new thread I started tryingtounderstand...look forward to seeing you there.

http://www.worthychristianforums.com/hell-...on-t102386.html

Carlos

[carlos123]

Hi tryingtounderstand,

Hopefully you are still around and everything is okay. I haven't seen you over at the new thread I started.

I wanted to pass along a couple of thoughts to you, assuming you even see this post and did not decide to stop coming here or something.

I read a couple of things this morning that led me to remember our conversation here and that I thought might be appropriate for you to consider...

Here's the first thing....

Matthew 13:19 [WEB - World English Bible]

When anyone hears the word of the kingdom, and doesn

[tryingtounderstand]

Sorry Carlos but I have had internet connections problems so I haven't been able to get back here til now. I haven't gone anywhere. I'll tell you something though I think I have gotten some answers from God, today in fact. I will be around now to tell you and we can have that discussion in the new thread. I'll be busy tomorrow but hope to get back by Sunday.

Peace of God be with you

[carlos123]

Sorry Carlos but I have had internet connections problems so I haven't been able to get back here til now. I haven't gone anywhere. I'll tell you something though I think I have gotten some answers from God, today in fact. I will be around now to tell you and we can have that discussion in the new thread. I'll be busy tomorrow but hope to get back by Sunday.

Peace of God be with you

Hey...no problem tryingtounderstand. I understand.

Great to see that you are still around and even greater to hear that the Lord might have provided some answers to you. Can't wait to hear what you've learned.

I'll see you on the other thread when you can join us there.

Carlos