America's Lost Freedom and the 'Obama Deception'

[Doowopjock]

.....I am not posting this as truth but rather a sincere quest to understand the truth,......

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The Truth is at Psalms 146:3-5. There is no other "truth".

[Chelsea7]

Thank you Doowopjock

Psalms 146:3-5 says

" 3 Do not put your trust in princes,

in mortal men, who cannot save.

4 When their spirit departs, they return to the ground;

on that very day their plans come to nothing.

5 Blessed is he whose help is the God of Jacob,

whose hope is in the LORD his God, "

That is a very good verse, and so true.

I am still interested in everyone's opinion on this film and if this is really happening in America. If it is or isn't - there is no doubt in my mind that God is sovereign over all, and in Him alone I put my trust.

If you think the film is untrue please state reasoning behind it, or visa-versa. I do also appreciate all the great verses people are posting, they are very encouraging and welcome. But I'm really looking for opinions on the film and reasoning behind the opinions. Thanks!

[lekh l'kha]

I don't know if the President of any country (not even the United States) has the power over the presidents of all other countries (including those whose ideologies are at odds with his own), to knowingly and deliberately introduce global policies and a global program specifically aimed at subjecting whole populations to slavery.

I don't believe that the leaders of the E.U for example, are aware that the choices they make today might be paving the way for the rise of the antichrist. They do what they do in ignorance of the eventual outcome. The same goes for Obama.

Human leaders do things, plan things and implement decisions while not having the foresight (or enough foresight) to know what those decisions are going to lead to.

The war ultimately is a spiritual war being fought by the forces of darkness against God.

I don't actually believe that our human governments know what Satan's plan is (and he does have a plan), nor are our human presidents willingly cooperating with him. They all think that what they're doing is good and right, not realizing that often (if not most of the time) they're a tool in the hands of the god of this world, their thinking influenced by the god of this world because through their rejection of God and His one and only true gospel, their minds are blinded. But they don't realize that. They think that what they do is good and right. So when they make decisions which will eventually lead to the rise of the antichrist, they do so in ignorance, not deliberately.

But God is ultimately in control of all history, and will use the plans, schemes and decisions of man to bring His own plans to fruition, thus thwarting Satan's plan.

I think that conspiracy-theorists also ignore or down-play the popular vote. Obama is the President of the United States because most Americans wanted him in that office.

In South Africa, we now have a president who was charged by the National Prosecuting Authority with a whole list of crimes including fraud, corruption, accepting bribes when he was a government minister and when he was the deputy President, and tax evasion.

He was fired as the deputy president, but managed to keep stalling the court case against him, and the charges were eventually dropped by the National Prosecuting Authority on a minor trumped-up technicality because the whole case was threatening the outbreak of a civil war, because 67% of South Africans support the man.

And that's why he's our president today - the general elections took place in April of this year.

And that's why Obama's the president of the U.S.A - not because of his real and/or alleged links with the illuminati and the Bilderbergers and the freemasons and the what-not.

As a non-American I think he's dangerous for Americans because he seems to think America can appease it's enemies into becoming it's friends. But that's just my own opinion.

But conspiracy theorists provided and placed a major anti-America propaganda tool in the hands of the world's Muslims in all parts of the world, including my own country:

The videos produced by Americans claiming 9/11 was an inside job and orchestrated by the Bush administration to provide an excuse to invade Afghanistan and Iraq, has been used to the fullest by Muslims to spread anti-American propaganda and hatred. Nearly every Imam has made sure every Muslim has a copy, and nearly every Muslim encourages non-Muslims to watch it.

And since some Americans themselves are gullible enough to believe such trash, what do you think people in other parts of the world will believe?

Conspiracy-theorists can bring, and have already brought a great amount of damage to the United States and to the image non-Americans have of America.

I just think we need to bear all these things in mind before we listen to the claims of conspiracy-theorists.

lekh

Edited July 3, 2009 by lekh l'kha

[nebula]

I saw the first 1/2 hour or so of the video.

I'm not into conspiracy theories, but there are a lot of points brought out that make sense.

Personally, I would not be surprised of their being a "secret controlling force" behind everything. I wish I were better at explaining myself so that I could put the pieces together verbally that have clicked together in my mind.

Now there's a lot about the End Times prophecies I don't understand and am reluctant to make claims on as far as interpretations go, but the one I will stand on is that we are still living under the rule of the statue in Nebuchadnezzar's dream. The manifestation of the feet and toes may be confusing and not as obvious to understand as the golden head (Babylon), chest and arms (Medo-Persian empire), etc. But whatever the feet and whatever the toes represent, we are down there, still waiting for the Rock to topple the statue.

So, if you can figure out what power ruled since the fall of the Roman Empire (the bronze legs), you can find your answer to who's pulling the strings.

[lekh l'kha]

I saw the first 1/2 hour or so of the video.

I'm not into conspiracy theories, but there are a lot of points brought out that make sense.

Personally, I would not be surprised of their being a "secret controlling force" behind everything. I wish I were better at explaining myself so that I could put the pieces together verbally that have clicked together in my mind.

Now there's a lot about the End Times prophecies I don't understand and am reluctant to make claims on as far as interpretations go, but the one I will stand on is that we are still living under the rule of the statue in Nebuchadnezzar's dream. The manifestation of the feet and toes may be confusing and not as obvious to understand as the golden head (Babylon), chest and arms (Medo-Persian empire), etc. But whatever the feet and whatever the toes represent, we are down there, still waiting for the Rock to topple the statue.

So, if you can figure out what power ruled since the fall of the Roman Empire (the bronze legs), you can find your answer to who's pulling the strings.

You mean the iron legs, nebula! (I know you know that, just saying )

Maybe we can find the answer in history:

The two legs of iron represent the Roman Empire, and the Roman Empire split into Eastern (Byzantine) and Western halves in the 4th century.

The Eastern (Byzantine) and Eastern Orthodox part of the Roman Empire was eventually completely taken over by Islam, but the Muslim armies did this gradually from the early 7th century onward, through invasions of more and more of the Eastern Empire's territory, until the Byzantine Empire had been completely overrun by Islam and replaced by the Ottoman-Turk (Islamic) Empire.

The "Christian" Crusades came about when (finally) even the Capital of the former great Byzantine Empire (Constantinople, now Istanbul) came under threat of succumbing to Islamic invasion: The Byzantine Emperor asked the Pope for help, and the Crusades began.

Muslims never mention the fact that it was the Islamic Crusades against the Byzantine Empire which sparked the "Christian" Crusades in the first place.

The Ottoman-Turk Empire was defeated in the first world war, and its territory fell into the hands of Britain, who then handed it over to the rulers of the modern Middle-Eastern states we now know as Iraq, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon and (falsely as) "Palestine". (I don't remember if Iran was also part of the Ottoman-Turk Empire). The Arab League was formed sometime later.

Since the end of WWII, the E.U has signed many social, cultural, political, and even some military agreements with the Arab League nations, in an attempt to form a trade-block with the Arab-League nations as a counterweight to American power. They're "mixing with the seed of men, but not adhering to one another" (which is exactly what Daniel says about the meaning of the iron/clay mixture in the feet).

The three animal symbols which are used to represent the beast of Revelation 13 (the one that rises from the sea) are the same three that Daniel used in Daniel 7 to represent the former empires of Greece, Medo-Persia and Babylon.

Those empires incorporated what today is Pakistan, Iran, Iraq, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon, Egypt, Turkey and Greece.

With the exception of Greece, these nations are what we now know as the Islamic Middle-East.

I believe it all fits with history. The two feet can only be the two former halves of the Roman Empire - the Middle-East and the E.U.

Five of the 10 final "kings" are on one foot, and five on another. I don't know if that means anything?

I could be so completely wrong about all that. And I get really worried about opening my mouth about prophecy, because I've seen too many unnecessary and ugly fights break out between brothers about it. Whether we're wrong or right about our understanding of Biblical prophecy is not going to make the slightest difference to what's going to happen.

I personally will be watching everything President Obama does and says, and especially any agreements he makes with Muslim nations. But I won't be assigning any last-days role to any politician until he's made his own role apparent by his actions.

I'm going to have to get hold of that video so that I can watch the whole thing

[nebula]

You mean the iron legs, nebula! (I know you know that, just saying )

D'oh! Yes, thank-you.

I'm careful about prophecy, too.

I admire how you explained things, though. That was good!

[lekh l'kha]

You mean the iron legs, nebula! (I know you know that, just saying )

D'oh! Yes, thank-you.

I'm careful about prophecy, too.

I admire how you explained things, though. That was good!

Thanks. I just watched a few more parts of that video, and I heard the claim "the New World Order is really just the Anglo-Saxon World Order" and something was said about "the Anglo-Saxon Empire" now being incorporated into America instead of into Britain.

NOW I understand why the Muslims in my country have been phoning into talk-show radio stations and running down "the evil Anglo-Saxon race" and the U.S.A, and asserting that it's "the Anglo-Saxon race" who are responsible for all the world's woes.

You see, the world's problems are never caused by the wars and acts of terrorism started by fundamentalist Muslims and based on Islamic theology.

No. The world's problems are caused by the evil plans of the Anglo-Saxon race and their drive for a new (Anglo-Saxon) World Order.

The world's problems are never caused by the evils of ideologies such as communism, or by the power-hungry, corrupt dictators in Africa who are prepared to kill to get to the top and to kill in order to stay there, and couldn't care less if all the citizens in their countries who fall outside the ruling elite (and their families) starve to death.

No. The world's problems are caused by the evils of the Anglo-Saxon race and their drive for a new (Anglo-Saxon) World Order.

This is exactly what I've heard coming out of the mouths of Muslims on talk-show radio in my country, and I wondered where they were getting this new "evil Anglo-Saxon race" thing from.

Turns out they got it from the same place they got their "America arranged it's own 9/11 in order to have an excuse to invade Afghanistan and Iraq".

These people who produce videos like this are making the world hate YOU, not your government.

Forget about the fact that America was called "the great Satan" by the Iranian regime from the early 80's onward, and that the Iranian revolution sparked a world-wide Islamic revival that was accompanied by more and more attacks on American institutions, embassies etc, until the big attack on American soil in 2001, which was the reason the American government decided that it was time to try to get the Middle East out of the hands of fundamentalist Islamic terrorists and dictators.

So the Bush administration underestimated the power of Islamic religious zeal and they failed to accomplish what they set out to accomplish - so what? At least they had the guts to try.

I remember 5 years ago already how Christian and non-Christian economists alike were warning in magazine articles and on the internet that the way people were buying on debt was going to cause the bubble to burst eventually - and the bubble did burst. Why are we so shocked that the debt-bubble burst?

The problem with videos like this is that they make a lot of assumptions and distribute a lot of misinformation, and ascribe a lot of motives and plans and schemes to powerful people, without providing evidence that would stand up in a court of law.

At least we all know that our politicians lie to us. But we now live in an age where we just don't know anymore whose doing the deceiving. Makes you think:

"But evil men and seducers will go forward to worse, deceiving and being deceived." (2Ti 3:13)

We know we're not living in the Kingdom of Christ because of all the deception going on - but who says that the people who produce those videos aren't part of the deception?

Come, Lord Jesus!

Edited July 3, 2009 by lekh l'kha

[lekh l'kha]

I am still interested in everyone's opinion on this film and if this is really happening in America. If it is or isn't - there is no doubt in my mind that God is sovereign over all, and in Him alone I put my trust.

If you think the film is untrue please state reasoning behind it, or visa-versa. I do also appreciate all the great verses people are posting, they are very encouraging and welcome. But I'm really looking for opinions on the film and reasoning behind the opinions. Thanks!

Hey, Chelsea7.

Here's what I think of the part of the video wherein they say that America arranged its own 9/11:

Rubbish!

Reason: I watched the original video claiming this, too, and the steel "drum-wheels" (or whatever they called it in the video) that were found on the ground at the Pentagon crash site, which they said were the wheels that electric cables or something were delivered in (because according to them there had been renovations undertaken of that section of the Pentagon), I recognized immediately to be the rims of Boeing wheels - I worked for 10 years on the apron (loading area) of an airport, and I know what Boeing rims look like, and what size they are.

Here's what I think of the New World Order conspiracy:

You'll never find the light by groping around in the darkness - the light is the Word of God and conspiracy-theories are a bottomless pit - no-one will ever get to the bottom of them to find out how much (if any) truth is in them.

The Bible tells us that everyone will eventually be forced to receive a mark and that no-one will be able to buy or sell without the mark. I personally take this up literally, and believe that technology will be used to achieve this.

But the Bible doesn't tell us the names of the people, organizations and countries that will be involved in bringing this about, or how it will be brought about.

Conspiracies have been around since the fall of Adam, anyway - ask Cain

I don't like it when I hear about the eradication of individual freedoms, but I don't see how anyone's going to stop "them" from carrying out "their" plans when we're not really sure who "they" are or what "their" plans are, and we have to grope around trying to find the bottom of the bottomless pit in conspiracy-theories in order to find out whose lying and whose telling the truth.

God has in any case told us in the Bible what's going to come at the end of the age - so I'd rather stick to the light of the Word of God than fret about videos claiming that King Kong, Donald Duck and Minny Mouse are in cahoots and are planning to take over the world and bring us all into slavery.

I know I've had a lot to say in this thread about this, and I apologize. It's just that I know how these conspiracy-theory videos are used by America's enemies to spread anti-U.S propaganda.

I won't say another word, promise

[John 8:7]

As a liberal christian that used to be a conservative christian, I understand why many of you think this. I understand where all this paranioa and fear is coming from. But, we are not in the "end days" as you all put it. I gurantee you, our great-grandchildren will learn about how Obama was an adaquate president, no better or worse than those that came before or after. Obama will spend no more money than Bush, and no one was complaining when Bush spent 6 trillion during his term. The world has been in a constant state of abhorrance, hatred, war, violence, genocide... etc, since the dawn of civilization. The only difference is, we have 24 hour cable news networks, like FOX or MSNBC, that emmit FEAR into the public. As a liberal, I cannot STAND, MSNBC because they are passionate about subjects, and ommit information that hurts their ideals. FOX does exactly the same thing, just for conservatives. "Fair and Balanced," "The place the for politics," these are not true. Today, for example, Sarah Palin will resign in three weeks. On MSNBC, they talked about how Sarah Palin did not serve her full term and was unfaithful to the people that voted for her. On FOX, they talked about how she was speaking from the heart, and it would not affect her run for 2012. Same exact story, one presented in a biased way against her , one biased for her. They are simply trying to shove their political beliefs into you. These networks try to make up your mind about everything. If you agree with everything that FOX or MSNBC says, check yourself. I challenge you, just for one month, only get your news from local cable networks. Local networks are not nearly as biased as 24hour ones. After that month, you will have little, if any paranoia towards Obama. (The reason the "end days" aren't here, is because of the UNIVERSE. It is 13.7 billion light years across. Don't your think we have some purpose exploring this? Don't you think that it will take thousands of years to adaquatley do this?)

With love,

The only liberal in Kansas.

Edited July 3, 2009 by John 8:7

[nebula]

Obama will spend no more money than Bush,

What do you mean "will not"? He's already put the country in greater debt in a few months than Bush did in 8 years!