can salvation be lost?

[exrockstar]

If a person is saved, it will show up in their works/lives.

correction: After a person is saved, their works should show up in their works/lives.

No, if one is truly saved, it will show.

It shows through Jehovah's witnesses.

Are they saved?

[kross]

If a person is saved, it will show up in their works/lives.

correction: After a person is saved, their works should show up in their works/lives.

No, if one is truly saved, it will show.

It shows through Jehovah's witnesses.

Are they saved?

How is that possible if they do not profess JESUS as the way of salvation? What is it that is showing?

KInd of an odd arguement against it showing in saved folk.

[kross]

http://www.bible.ca/interactive/salvation-interactive.htm

Look at this.

Sometimes I am amused by the non-sense. IF there is one thing I am absolutely certain of, it is that any church that state "you must be baptised to be saved" is usually going to back that up with "and we are the only church that can baptise you". Something I here from every cult in America.

Since I was baptised, it is a mute point to me if you "must be baptised" or not. I do not know anyone who has been saved who rejects the first act of obedience and sign of salvation.

I glanced at the sight and at a couple of the posts. That was enough. James, John and Paul all give us guideline to know if we are saved, none of them ever mention baptism as a requirement.

"By grace you have been saved, through faith, and this not of yourself, it is the gift of GOD"

[kross]

If a person is saved, it will show up in their works/lives.

correction: After a person is saved, their works should show up in their works/lives.

No, it WILL show up. A transformed person has a new heart and a new set of desires. A true follower of Christ can't help but live out their faith. You always live what you believe. If you don't believe in Christ, your life will ultimately reflect it.

I have two questions for you:

1. Do you think you can save someone by explaining the gospel to them in a nice long conversation? There are people that go knocking on doors and say "can i have a minute with you and tell you how/why Christ died for your sins." Do you think they can save someone in a nice detailed chat?

2. Do you think that salvation is instantaneous? The person knocked on a strangers door, presented it well and saved that person? Is that possible to you?

just two simple questions.

I would like to answer;

One plants, another waters, but it is GOD who gives the increase. The person going door to door is planting or watering. Salvation is of the LORD.

Yes, salvation is instantaneous. The person knocked on the door, presented it poorly, and the HOLY SPIRIT moved and saved that person. Is that possible to you?

Another question for you;

Do you think it is ever a waste of time to share the gospel with a stanger? Either door to door or on a bus.

[exrockstar]

I would like to answer;

One plants, another waters, but it is GOD who gives the increase. The person going door to door is planting or watering. Salvation is of the LORD.

Yes, salvation is instantaneous.

The person knocked on the door, presented it poorly, and the HOLY SPIRIT moved and saved that person. Is that possible to you?

Another question for you;

Do you think it is ever a waste of time to share the gospel with a stanger? Either door to door or on a bus.

I think you and I see things more similar than not.

[Rhonda Lou]

If a person is saved, it will show up in their works/lives.

correction: After a person is saved, their works should show up in their works/lives.

No, it WILL show up. A transformed person has a new heart and a new set of desires. A true follower of Christ can't help but live out their faith. You always live what you believe. If you don't believe in Christ, your life will ultimately reflect it.

I have two questions for you:

1. Do you think you can save someone by explaining the gospel to them in a nice long conversation? There are people that go knocking on doors and say "can i have a minute with you and tell you how/why Christ died for your sins." Do you think they can save someone in a nice detailed chat?

2. Do you think that salvation is instantaneous? The person knocked on a strangers door, presented it well and saved that person? Is that possible to you?

just two simple questions.

It is possible to save somebody by explaining the gospel to them in a conversation -- short or long -- if God has opened their heart, mind and will, and it is God's timing. One person quoted the principle in 1 Corinthians 3:6: "I planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the increase." More than likely, if somebody spreads the Gospel in the way you describe, and the person is saved, then God has been at work in that person's heart for some time. There are some people who are also gifted by the Holy Spirit in such a way hat they can share the news in the way you describe, who are able to lead others to Christ via conversation, under the power and influence of the Holy Spirit.

Is salvation instantaneous? I believe the moment one repents of his/her love of sinning, recongizing to the core that it is impowwible to change without Christ doing it in them through the Holy Spirit, one is saved, and the Holy Spirit takes residence inside that person. A person indwelt by the Spirit, hidden with Christ in God (Colossians 3:3) is saved. There is a sanctification process which begins to take place, and our understanding of the "riches" we have in salvation comes also as part of the process -- but I believe that the LOVE of sinning is forever changed. From that moment on, a person tries to obey because the Holy Spirit inside him/her is changing him/her -- and because their whole reason for being saved is to be transformed -- to win the victory over sin. Our spirits are willing but our flesh is weak, and we fall into sin, but the moment we realize it, we will not rest until we have confessed and repented of that sin. That part takes a lifetime, yet salvation is instantaneous. Preparation for salvation might not be instantaneous, and the Christian walk is not instantaneous -- but salvation itself -- the transaction or exchange -- our life for Jesus' life in us -- that is instantaneous.

[Guest shiloh357]

I have two questions for you:

1. Do you think you can save someone by explaining the gospel to them in a nice long conversation? There are people that go knocking on doors and say "can i have a minute with you and tell you how/why Christ died for your sins." Do you think they can save someone in a nice detailed chat?

It depends on whether or not the Holy Spirit is moving on their hearts. The conversation itself, no matter how long or short has no salvific power. No one can be saved unless the Holy Spirit draws them and they say yes to Spirit's call.

Isn't it us knocking on a strangers door a call to them?

No, it is an act of obedience to share the gospel. The Holy Spirit is the one who does the calling and the saving.

[Ashitaria]

Church of Christ?

I read the link and looked at the power point. The interesting thing is that they claim that Jesus would only be at a Church that is not divided, hmmm.

No you see, go to the link and read everything.

Salvation is something that many Christians get wrong, which is the most important thing after all. The website that I have given all of you is for all of you to test your salvation, and see if you are really saved.

How can one get salvation wrong if they study scripture? Are you saying that there is a test to take or are we to go through all the lessons to see if we agree with the teacher or not? You need to explain your point better.

http://www.bible.ca/interactive/salvation-interactive.htm

Look at this.

Sometimes I am amused by the non-sense. IF there is one thing I am absolutely certain of, it is that any church that state "you must be baptised to be saved" is usually going to back that up with "and we are the only church that can baptise you". Something I here from every cult in America.

Since I was baptised, it is a mute point to me if you "must be baptised" or not. I do not know anyone who has been saved who rejects the first act of obedience and sign of salvation.

I glanced at the sight and at a couple of the posts. That was enough. James, John and Paul all give us guideline to know if we are saved, none of them ever mention baptism as a requirement.

"By grace you have been saved, through faith, and this not of yourself, it is the gift of GOD"

Read everything the website posts.

Yes, people can get salvation wrong even if they study scripture. It doesn't mean that you're a Christian if you just read the book can you? Follow the 25 steps to determine, whether you are truly saved or not. The explanation is the website. You cannot be lazy and abandon your salvation, read everything.

Naturally. If lets say you are a Christian, and you want to be baptized, you can't necessarily be baptized by an Indian, can you? And if that is your argument, isn't Christianity a kind of cult too? Only a Christian can teach a Christian, the same way a cult member can lead a cult member. Same goes with this. Yes- no one who rejects the first act of obedience is saved, but the first act of obedience isn't enough. Knowing isn't believing, and yet, you are rejecting the knowledge. Read the website. The reason why I am posting this website is not to be saved, but to saved.

Look again. The Bible is big, and there are many verses that support baptism.

< 1 Peter 3:20-22 >

"A few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water. There is also an antitype which now saves us, namely baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, angels and authorities and powers having been made subject to Him."

<John 3:1-6>

"There was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews. This man came to Jesus by night and said to Him, 'Rabbi, we know that You are a teacher come from God; for no one can do these signs that You do unless God is with him.' Jesus answered and said to him, 'Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.' Nicodemus said to Him, 'How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?' Jesus answered, 'Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.'"

These verses are to name but a few. The website names MUCH MUCH more. Study it, read it, and go.

(And yes, by the grace of God we are saved, and yet:

Matthew Chapter 7

A Tree and Its Fruit

15"Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17Likewise every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.

21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'

the Lord has no patience for those who believe in the wrong thing. Grace, was when Jesus was baptized and crucified for our sake. But grace does not mean we are saved no matter what.)

TO ALL OF YOU THAT ARE READING THIS,

I know that this is not what you want to hear. But,

Matthew Chapter 7

The Narrow and Wide Gates

13"Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

from this verse, you should know that salvation is not to be made light of.

Once again, I must implore. My mission here is to spread the truth.

Just like John Washer is doing:

***Edit inks****

I recommend you to watch his sermon too.

May we, the Christians restoring the light, spread the gospel.

Let the people hear and be saved.

Edited November 7, 2009 by Matthitjah
No youtube allowed on Worthy

[Smalcald]

Yeah I certainly believe Baptism is part of the Grace of God and part of what every saved Christian will do, and I think almost everyone on this board agrees.

Is our faith a puzzle to be worked out over a secret bible code, "hidden" away from some who don't figure and work it out exactly correct? Or is our faith relatively straightforward; taken directly from the Gospel of Christ as shown in scripture and preached for the past 2000 years?

The thing with these sorts of links is that they assume "most" Christians have it wrong and only this little group has it right, this little group that has existed for only about 40 or 50 years; the assumption is before that the Gospel did not really exist. Well I know which Gospel and which Church I trust and will trust.

the Lord has no patience for those who believe in the wrong thing. Grace, was when Jesus was baptized and crucified for our sake. But grace does not mean we are saved no matter what.)

But you have said that faith is NOT just about intellectual belief, so if someone has one point of doctrine wrong, they are not saved? What if you are wrong about the true meaning of communion?

21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'

What does this verse say about those He does not know? Does it say you had your doctrine wrong? You actually should be happy that He does not say that given your doctrine.

Ever since the Reformation it is amazing to me, how many Christians want to re-erect the walls and barriers to grace which were torn down by the opening of the Gospel. You must DO it in THIS way with OUR Church or you are not saved, this sounds more like the Pope than anything else, just with different bells and whistles. Over and over again this idea rears its head to deny the Gospel of Christ in order to build up one particular Church body as the only way to salvation, instead of Christ being the only way to salvation.

[kross]

Church of Christ?

I read the link and looked at the power point. The interesting thing is that they claim that Jesus would only be at a Church that is not divided, hmmm.

No you see, go to the link and read everything.

Salvation is something that many Christians get wrong, which is the most important thing after all. The website that I have given all of you is for all of you to test your salvation, and see if you are really saved.

How can one get salvation wrong if they study scripture? Are you saying that there is a test to take or are we to go through all the lessons to see if we agree with the teacher or not? You need to explain your point better.

http://www.bible.ca/interactive/salvation-interactive.htm

Look at this.

Sometimes I am amused by the non-sense. IF there is one thing I am absolutely certain of, it is that any church that state "you must be baptised to be saved" is usually going to back that up with "and we are the only church that can baptise you". Something I here from every cult in America.

Since I was baptised, it is a mute point to me if you "must be baptised" or not. I do not know anyone who has been saved who rejects the first act of obedience and sign of salvation.

I glanced at the sight and at a couple of the posts. That was enough. James, John and Paul all give us guideline to know if we are saved, none of them ever mention baptism as a requirement.

"By grace you have been saved, through faith, and this not of yourself, it is the gift of GOD"

Read everything the website posts.

Yes, people can get salvation wrong even if they study scripture. It doesn't mean that you're a Christian if you just read the book can you? Follow the 25 steps to determine, whether you are truly saved or not. The explanation is the website. You cannot be lazy and abandon your salvation, read everything.

Naturally. If lets say you are a Christian, and you want to be baptized, you can't necessarily be baptized by an Indian, can you? And if that is your argument, isn't Christianity a kind of cult too? Only a Christian can teach a Christian, the same way a cult member can lead a cult member. Same goes with this. Yes- no one who rejects the first act of obedience is saved, but the first act of obedience isn't enough. Knowing isn't believing, and yet, you are rejecting the knowledge. Read the website. The reason why I am posting this website is not to be saved, but to saved.

Look again. The Bible is big, and there are many verses that support baptism.

< 1 Peter 3:20-22 >

"A few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water. There is also an antitype which now saves us, namely baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, angels and authorities and powers having been made subject to Him."

<John 3:1-6>

"There was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews. This man came to Jesus by night and said to Him, 'Rabbi, we know that You are a teacher come from God; for no one can do these signs that You do unless God is with him.' Jesus answered and said to him, 'Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.' Nicodemus said to Him, 'How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?' Jesus answered, 'Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.'"

These verses are to name but a few. The website names MUCH MUCH more. Study it, read it, and go.

(And yes, by the grace of God we are saved, and yet:

Matthew Chapter 7

A Tree and Its Fruit

15"Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17Likewise every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.

21"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' 23Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'

the Lord has no patience for those who believe in the wrong thing. Grace, was when Jesus was baptized and crucified for our sake. But grace does not mean we are saved no matter what.)

TO ALL OF YOU THAT ARE READING THIS,

I know that this is not what you want to hear. But,

Matthew Chapter 7

The Narrow and Wide Gates

13"Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.

from this verse, you should know that salvation is not to be made light of.

Once again, I must implore. My mission here is to spread the truth.

Just like John Washer is doing:

************************

I recommend you to watch his sermon too.

May we, the Christians restoring the light, spread the gospel.

Let the people hear and be saved.

I read enough to know that I do not agree with what was written.

I think I will just take my chances. I believe and was baptised. Now I will trust in HIM who is able to keep me from falling and present me blameless before the throne.

The real scarey thing is that there are those people who have tossed aside salvation in JESUS alone and have been duped into believing they are saved by a particular church. Perhaps if one leaves CHRIST they will be lost, but one can leave any church or denomination and still have JESUS. My trust will remain in HIM.

HIS peace to you.