Who here has seen?

[wyguy]

I could have seen and spoken to an angel. We all could have:

"Do not forget to entertain strangers, for by so doing some people have entertained angels without knowing it." (Hebrews 13:2)

Yes, indeed. It's one of the reasons, imo, that Sodom and Gomorrah was condemned... for the lack of entertaining strangers.

They were condemned for their homosexuality and other perversions. The lack of entertaining strangers was the least of it.

[Permie]

I could have seen and spoken to an angel. We all could have:

"Do not forget to entertain strangers, for by so doing some people have entertained angels without knowing it." (Hebrews 13:2)

Yes, indeed. It's one of the reasons, imo, that Sodom and Gomorrah was condemned... for the lack of entertaining strangers.

They were condemned for their homosexuality and other perversions. The lack of entertaining strangers was the least of it.

I have to agree that their perversions were great. It could be that it all began with their lack of hospitality?

The bible tells us: 49 Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.

50 And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good. Ezekiel 16:49-50

[wyguy]

I could have seen and spoken to an angel. We all could have:

"Do not forget to entertain strangers, for by so doing some people have entertained angels without knowing it." (Hebrews 13:2)

Yes, indeed. It's one of the reasons, imo, that Sodom and Gomorrah was condemned... for the lack of entertaining strangers.

They were condemned for their homosexuality and other perversions. The lack of entertaining strangers was the least of it.

I have to agree that their perversions were great. It could be that it all began with their lack of hospitality?

The bible tells us: 49 Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.

50 And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good. Ezekiel 16:49-50

"Jude 1:7: "Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange (Greek: different, other) flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire."

I don't see any mention of "hospitality" but I do see "fornication" and "going after strange flesh." The term "going after strange flesh" is explained to us in Proverbs 7:5 and Romans 1:26-27:

"That they may keep thee from the strange woman, from the stranger which flattereth with her words."

"For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet."

"Going after strange flesh" in the Bible is not necessarily homosexuality, as we are warned about the "strange" adulterous woman in Proverb 5:20; 7:5; but, the context of Jude 1:7 clearly implies homosexuality. "Going after strange flesh" means going after flesh "different" than what is rightfully ours to claim (our spouse's body -1st Corinthians 7:4). Notice that Jude mentions both "fornication" and "going after strange flesh."

Obviously, Sodom's sins were more than fornication, and certainly more than a "lack of hospitality." The "strange" flesh simply refers to that which is forbidden by God for us to have, it is flesh outside the bounds of God's laws; hence, the term "sexual deviance" (to deviate from what is acceptable to God)."

Also, God never declared inhospitality to be an abomination to Him, while Leviticus 18:22 makes God

[Gentlewind]

Ummm . . . The bible tells us: 49 Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.

What kind of iniquity is "fulness of bread?" (not to get off-topic, just wondering)

[OneLight]

Hey Permie~

I just read that verse you gave in a whole new way! Wow!

Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by. John 8:59

Ahh, the pearls hidden in plain sight within scripture. Very cool! He "hid" Himself, and yet He went through the midst of them? Must've left them with their mouths hanging open!

Gentlewind

LOL, yes! There are many pearls. Since you liked that one, how about:

Jesus answered and said to him, "Because I said to you that I saw you under the fig tree, do you believe? You will see greater things than these."

John 1:50

Jesus was there, present with Nathanael under that fig tree, but Nathanael couldn't "see" him! At this time Jesus was as we are, in a human body, but . . . He was there, under that fig tree, unseen. How could this be?

Permie, good friend, you've done your homework! (unscriptural . . . grumble, grumble) The Spirit goes where it will.

Scripture tells us that all Jesus said was that "Before Philip called you, when you were under the fig tree, I saw you.

[wyguy]

Ummm . . . The bible tells us: 49 Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.

What kind of iniquity is "fulness of bread?" (not to get off-topic, just wondering)

They were prideful from having abundance.

[OneLight]

I was given a dream, whether in the body or out of the body, I don't know. I stood before Christ at the door of a classroom. He was the Teacher and being in His presence was the answer to every prayer. The feeling was indescribable--bliss. He spoke to me without words. I spoke to Him without words. He told me I could not stay. I knew this was true, but I hesitated to leave Him. Without words, my plea before Him was, "Will you be with me?" He turned, then, and with chalk wrote one word on the chalkboard behind Him, underlining it with a flourish: ALWAYS.

I hold the gift of this dream close to my heart and trust His word. He is with me. Always.

As He is also with all of His children.

Isn't it most awesome? The King of kings and the Lord of lords will call us friends. I am awed and humbled by this.

I just recalled a verse about this being called friends by Jesus and how it relates our going from glory to glory. That verse is: John 15:15

Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

And then, that leads me to think of the verse:

Luke 8:17

For nothing is secret, that shall not be made manifest; neither any thing hid, that shall not be known and come abroad.

Could that cause one to pause and wonder: is there more that Jesus revealed and continues to reveal to His friends that is not written? That the servants to this day know nothing of, yet?

Can you expound on this a little more? I am trying to follow what you are saying am this threw me a curve.

[OneLight]

Ummm . . . The bible tells us: 49 Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.

What kind of iniquity is "fulness of bread?" (not to get off-topic, just wondering)

They were prideful from having abundance.

Let's see what scripture tells us ...

Genesis 18:16-33 (New King James Version)

Abraham Intercedes for Sodom

16 Then the men rose from there and looked toward Sodom, and Abraham went with them to send them on the way. 17 And the LORD said,

[OneLight]

By the way, you may find this an interesting thread. It pertains to your original subject. Jesus Speaking, Has Jesus ever spoke to you?

[Permie]

I was given a dream, whether in the body or out of the body, I don't know. I stood before Christ at the door of a classroom. He was the Teacher and being in His presence was the answer to every prayer. The feeling was indescribable--bliss. He spoke to me without words. I spoke to Him without words. He told me I could not stay. I knew this was true, but I hesitated to leave Him. Without words, my plea before Him was, "Will you be with me?" He turned, then, and with chalk wrote one word on the chalkboard behind Him, underlining it with a flourish: ALWAYS.

I hold the gift of this dream close to my heart and trust His word. He is with me. Always.

As He is also with all of His children.

Isn't it most awesome? The King of kings and the Lord of lords will call us friends. I am awed and humbled by this.

I just recalled a verse about this being called friends by Jesus and how it relates our going from glory to glory. That verse is: John 15:15

Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

And then, that leads me to think of the verse:

Luke 8:17

For nothing is secret, that shall not be made manifest; neither any thing hid, that shall not be known and come abroad.

Could that cause one to pause and wonder: is there more that Jesus revealed and continues to reveal to His friends that is not written? That the servants to this day know nothing of, yet?

Can you expound on this a little more? I am trying to follow what you are saying am this threw me a curve.

Hello, OneLight,

We know that Jesus taught and did more than what is written due to this verse: And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen. John 21:25

Did I answer your question?