Arizona Governor Signs Controversial Immigration Bill

[Axxman]

Here you go with the spin again.

What I said was that it is an issue due to location. The law itself does not make race an issue. The law was not conceived to persecute or profile any race of people. Race is only being played up to avoid the moral reasons the law was enacted. The fact that Americans were murdered seems to take a backseat because the perps are latino. The traffickers and smugglers and drug dealers are latino, but more imporantly, they are illegal aliens and they are committing crimes on American soil against American citizens. The charge of racial profiling has no merit in this case.

Location is just the justification to make race the issue. I agree that the law itself doesn't make race the issue...but you cannot take race out of the equation. Just because you can find ways to justify making race the issue, doesn't necessarily make it right. Like I said earlier, I agree with Jeb Bush that the race issue is an 'unintended consequence' of this law. There is no escaping that fact. Legal, Amercian citizens, who are of latino descent will be caught up in this...that stinks.

QUOTE (shiloh357 @ Apr 28 2010, 07:45 AM)

Well within the context of the current discussion, the latinos would more likely be asked for proof of citizenship, however, context is important. If America were bordering Sweden, Finland or Denmark, then whites caught speeding might challenged. America is bordering Mexico, and so far, the offenders have been of latino/hispanic descent, so naturally, they will be looked at closer. It is not BECAUSE of their race, but becasue of their actions. So yes, if you are talking about the counties that have the most at stake, and the police officers that patrol those counties and cities, they will more than likely ask group of latinos who were caught speeding, have no drivers licenses, do not speak English, where they are from and attempt to establish that they are either legally or illegally living in the US. That is not racism; at least, not to thinking people.

The point is that car is being pulled over for speeding, NOT because it was being driven by latinos. The racial profiling drivel can only be supported if it can be proven that the law was conceived and passed for the purpose of profiling or in some other way, persecuting latinos.

If America was bordering Sweden...I would be uncomfortable (or have reservations) about a law that specifically targeted whites...even if I understood the intent of the law.

Do you even read what you write? Latino's/Hispanics will be looked at closer...because of their actions? I got news for ya...not all latinos participate in those illegal actions. Some of them are even law abiding American citizens. It would be all well and good if only people who were illegal were being targeted. This law targets everyone! Including American citizens who happen to look the part. Its okay that only mexicans are targeted? LOL!

You keep trying to say that race isn't an issue..but you can't make your case without introducing caveats such as "location", the "bad guys are mexicans," or if "they don't speak english." Bro...everything you are saying points to ONE race of people. Btw...it is not illegal to not know the english language. You are perfectly okay with the concept that my wife (who is of latino/native american descent) will be subject to more scrutiny by police than most other people...simply because she matches the identity of offenders of latino/hispanic descent.

The law was NOT passed or conceived with the purpose of profiling latinos...I agree that anyone who attempts to make that case is lying. The law has good intentions...with side-effects. Like you said, the two cars were pulled over for speeding with NO racial ties involved. However, one of those cars will be subjected to closer police scrutiny (as you admitted) because they are mexicans, close to the border, and it is mexicans actions that are the problem.

[MorningGlory]

Completely racist.

Jim crow laws come back.

I'd say it wouldn't BE slanted towards Hispanics if they WEREN'T the majority of the criminals sneaking into the country. This is profiling them according to nationality, not race. If they don't like it, they can leave before they're thrown out. If our Hispanic citizens are against it, they need to stop helping their relatives sneak in. Then there would be no one to profile. Problem solved.

[Axxman]

This is not racist no hatered is in this at all. OK forget the PC most illegals in the southwest are from Mexico. If you can not speek english when your pulled over thats good enough reason for me to check there background. People in the US are tired of the free rides, and if they want to call it racist then so be it. wouldnt hurt my feelings.

Its not illegal to not be able to speak english...why is that your criteria? I wish they spoke English as much as anyone...but I'm not going to marginalize them for doing something they are perfectly within their rights to do.

I'm tired of alot of things that have to do with illegals. I want illegal immigration stopped. I want the Gov to sign a law ordering a wall along the border protected by soldiers...something that will target illegals coming into the country. I'm not so keen on singling out people who have every right to speak spanish and look hispanic and subject them to scrutiny.

[Axxman]

I'd say it wouldn't BE slanted towards Hispanics if they WEREN'T the majority of the criminals sneaking into the country. This is profiling them according to nationality, not race. If they don't like it, they can leave before they're thrown out. If our Hispanic citizens are against it, they need to stop helping their relatives sneak in. Then there would be no one to profile. Problem solved.

WOW! My wife...a latino...is against it. You ready to throw her out? How many illegals do you suppose she has snuck in? <----that was kind of hurtful

She is one of the kindest, most sincere, loving Christians I've ever had the opportunity to meet. She is also staunchly conservative both morally and politically. She refuses to speak spanish, and won't teach it to our kids.

My wife fits the profile of people who will be targeted by this law.

[CSLewis]

This is a huge gift for the left- now they have everybody distracted and once again characterize us as racist "tea baggers" ugh....

So what happens to a Latino American woman who can't prove her citizenship? She gets carted off to jail? Now we are going to have a push for a national Id card- wait they are already doing that...

[nebula]

My wife fits the profile of people who will be targeted by this law.

OK, this is what I don't understand.

You speed and get got. You get pulled over. The police officer asks for your driver's license. Then he asks for your proof of citizenship (if it's not proven by the driver's license - which of course doesn't make sense to me???). You give him your license.

Or if there are others in the car. He asks for proof of citizenship.

I do not see why this is a problem?

[nebula]

So what happens to a Latino American woman who can't prove her citizenship?

How hard is it to prove citizenship?

Doesn't a drivers license do that?

[CSLewis]

They've all got drivers licenses-

we have a president who can't prove his own citizenship

[MorningGlory]

I'd say it wouldn't BE slanted towards Hispanics if they WEREN'T the majority of the criminals sneaking into the country. This is profiling them according to nationality, not race. If they don't like it, they can leave before they're thrown out. If our Hispanic citizens are against it, they need to stop helping their relatives sneak in. Then there would be no one to profile. Problem solved.

WOW! My wife...a latino...is against it. You ready to throw her out? How many illegals do you suppose she has snuck in? <----that was kind of hurtful

She is one of the kindest, most sincere, loving Christians I've ever had the opportunity to meet. She is also staunchly conservative both morally and politically. She refuses to speak spanish, and won't teach it to our kids.

My wife fits the profile of people who will be targeted by this law.

I'm talking about illegals, of any nationality or ethnicity, being thrown out of the country, Axx. My comment was not intended to hurt you or people like your wife but, if she is pulled over for a traffic violation, she may be asked for proof she is here legally. Is it better to just never check to see if someone is here illegally then? That hasn't been working so well. And I didn't say ALL Hispanics sneak their relatives across the border but I've known many who have. My own Hispanic relatives don't have anyone to bring here; they are third generation. But, if this law is enacted in Texas, they will probably be checked out as well. Remember the law doesn't give the police the power to go door to door or stop everyone they think looks illegal; they can ask for proof of legality if someone is arrested or ticketed. Right now, in Houston, they can't even ask someone arrested for murder. As long as no one wants to address the problem, or be inconvenienced by it, the problem will remain. No one wants to profile muslim looking people either; a policy that is guaranteed to be used against us just as the 'look the other way' mindset toward undocumented aliens has been. Our country simply can't support an estimated 20 million people who don't belong here.

I think the solution is to have EVERYONE be required to prove legality and to change the law regarding 'anchor babies'; I believe that would be fair to everyone.

[humbleseeker]

who knows this could all be more fuel to lead, America toward a national ID.