Free Grace Theology Vs. Lordship Salvation

[nebula]

I disagree. That is works plus faith based salvation, which borderlines works based salvation. Works based salvation is very dangerous to one's spiritual health. Granted, it cannot take away your salvation, but it can still damage your spiritual health.

Byron - salvation is by faith. No one disagrees with that.

What we disagree on is what is meant by faith.

In the Hebraic mindset, belief means nothing if it has no hands and feet. "Even the demons believe."

Think about it, what do you call someone who professes belief but has no actions to back up that claimed belief?

Answer: hypocrite

hypocrisy [hɪˈpɒkrəsɪ]

n pl -sies

1. the practice of professing standards, beliefs, etc., contrary to one's real character or actual behaviour, esp the pretence of virtue and piety

Another way to look at this:

Imagine a man asks a woman to marry him, and she says, "Yes!" But then she never binds herself to a relationship with him.

To claim belief in Jesus as Savior yet not commit yourself to Him as your Lord is the exact same thing.

Eph. 5

22 Wives, be subject to your own husbands, as to the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife, as Christ also is the head of the church, He Himself being the Savior of the body. 24 But as the church is subject to Christ, so also the wives ought to be to their husbands in everything. 25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her, 26 so that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, 27 that He might present to Himself the church in all her glory, having no spot or wrinkle or any such thing ; but that she would be holy and blameless. 28 So husbands ought also to love their own wives as their own bodies. He who loves his own wife loves himself ; 29 for no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ also does the church, 30 because we are members of His body.

Now faith is not belief, really. Rather it is an action.

Belief says, "I believe Horse C will win the race today." Faith says, "I'm betting $x on Horse C in the race today."

See the difference?

[oldzimm]

Faith in God/Jesus will get us saved.

It has been said that this small verse is one of single most important scriptures in the entirety of the word of God.

(I can think of other ones that I'm also fond of, but for this topic, I'll go with it)

Gen. 15:6 And he (Abraham) believed in the Lord (exercised Faith, believing what the Lord told him); and he (the Lord) counted it to him (Abraham) for righteousness.

Abraham was saved by Grace through Faith, not by his works alone.

Now my question is, if somebody said they have faith and don't have good works, did they really have true Faith in the first place?

[~candice~]

Now my question is, if somebody said they have faith and don't have good works, did they really have true Faith in the first place?

No

[Matthitjah]

Now my question is, if somebody said they have faith and don't have good works, did they really have true Faith in the first place?

No

Amen and that faith manifested itself in Abraham's life when he left the land of Shinar, and when he sojourned in tents, and found no permanent residence, but looked to a City built without hands, whose maker and architect was God. He manifested that faith when he strapped the son of the promise down to an altar an moved forward to sacrifice him believing that the God that he worshipped could raise him from the dead.

[Matthitjah]

Joh 12:24

Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a grain of wheat falls into the ground and dies, it abides alone: but if it dies, it brings forth much fruit.

[~candice~]

1 John 2

³ We know that we have come to know him if we keep his commands. ⁴ Whoever says,

[oldzimm]

Now my question is, if somebody said they have faith and don't have good works, did they really have true Faith in the first place?

No

And I agree.

I keep getting this thought that good works is letting your light shine.

[Guest]

Now my question is, if somebody said they have faith and don't have good works, did they really have true Faith in the first place?

No

And I agree.

I keep getting this thought that good works is letting your light shine.

Shine

Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.

Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.

Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven. Matthew 5:14-16

And Gve The Glory To Jesus

I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images. Isaiah 42:8

[Byron A]

As I said before, I do not believe in Free Grace Theology in order to be able to live a life of sin. I am going through the process of sanctification just like everyone else here. If I wasn't, I wouldn't worry about being here or even going to church. I believe in Free Grace Theology because it is what the Holy Spirit has shown to me to be true. Lordship Salvation places both justification and sanctification under "salvation", and says that one cannot be saved without both. This borders on a works-based salvation.

My belief is that salvation is easy. Sanctification is hard. Anyone can be saved and get into heaven by the skin of their teeth. To actually be a good and faithful servant, and to receive all the heavenly rewards God has promised, takes hard effort.

I am not saying a Christian should frown upon good works. We should all be striving for good works. Its how we receive our heavenly rewards, by running the race well.

BUT, these things have no bearing upon Salvation, which is earned by simple trust in Jesus Christ.

I am off to school now! Have a good day and God bless!

[Smalcald]

I think it is a false dichotomy.

Faith cannot help but produce a change in a human being; it is a supernatural act of the Holy Spirit, it is not intellectual assent thus it cannot help but produce good works. As a wise theologian said you can no more separate faith from works than you can separate smoke from fire.

However we as humans cannot make the determination of how someone else is being saved by God, we cannot look from the outside and say for certain well that person is not saved or that person is saved because they have not changed enough or they are showing many good works.