Guest joshbwamble Posted December 13, 2011 Share Posted December 13, 2011 I know of no situation in which God forced himself on anyone and I don't believe it's in his character to do so. Every person that comes to God must seek him. I think that is an absolutely necessary step to accepting Christ. Jaybo What do you make of Romans 3:11? Paul says that no one seeks God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted December 13, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted December 13, 2011 Can God open up a closed person's mind or would that be a violation of free will? That is His specialty. The Holy Spirit is the revelator! He opens up what is simply to the natural man paper and ink and words---Scripture, God-breathed and alive with great power, wisdom and insight to the mind and spirit of man. To quote something I have read: "Without the Spirit's wisdom and insight, science is but trickery, psychology is just self-obsession, sociology is just the workings of the rabble, language becomes merely a tool for manipulation, and religion really becomes the opiate of the masses that Marx thought it was." (http://www.spirithome.com/spirwork.html#seeing) Now, while it is within God's power to present Himself to men in powerful ways, the failure in knowing Him is man's alone. He misses God, or denies God, or thinks himself into a corner and stays there. It is all down to the sovereignty over his own destiny that God has built into him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Given Grace Posted December 14, 2011 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 14 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/16/2011 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/13/1982 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Can God open up a closed person's mind or would that be a violation of free will? That is His specialty. The Holy Spirit is the revelator! He opens up what is simply to the natural man paper and ink and words---Scripture, God-breathed and alive with great power, wisdom and insight to the mind and spirit of man. To quote something I have read: "Without the Spirit's wisdom and insight, science is but trickery, psychology is just self-obsession, sociology is just the workings of the rabble, language becomes merely a tool for manipulation, and religion really becomes the opiate of the masses that Marx thought it was." (http://www.spirithom...ork.html#seeing) Now, while it is within God's power to present Himself to men in powerful ways, the failure in knowing Him is man's alone. He misses God, or denies God, or thinks himself into a corner and stays there. It is all down to the sovereignty over his own destiny that God has built into him. To open up a closed person's mind is God's specialty, indeed. However, it bothers me to read this response. I mean, no offense Floatingaxe, I just can't see the answer to the second question, which is, "would that be a violation of fee will?" I like this thread because it stimulates my interest in reading more about this topic. However, that question is somehow more interesting, yet unanswered.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoob57 Posted December 14, 2011 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 35 Topic Count: 100 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 41,332 Content Per Day: 7.99 Reputation: 21,531 Days Won: 76 Joined: 03/13/2010 Status: Online Birthday: 07/27/1957 Share Posted December 14, 2011 Can God open up a closed person's mind or would that be a violation of free will? That is His specialty. The Holy Spirit is the revelator! He opens up what is simply to the natural man paper and ink and words---Scripture, God-breathed and alive with great power, wisdom and insight to the mind and spirit of man. To quote something I have read: "Without the Spirit's wisdom and insight, science is but trickery, psychology is just self-obsession, sociology is just the workings of the rabble, language becomes merely a tool for manipulation, and religion really becomes the opiate of the masses that Marx thought it was." (http://www.spirithom...ork.html#seeing) Now, while it is within God's power to present Himself to men in powerful ways, the failure in knowing Him is man's alone. He misses God, or denies God, or thinks himself into a corner and stays there. It is all down to the sovereignty over his own destiny that God has built into him. To open up a closed person's mind is God's specialty, indeed. However, it bothers me to read this response. I mean, no offense Floatingaxe, I just can't see the answer to the second question, which is, "would that be a violation of fee will?" I like this thread because it stimulates my interest in reading more about this topic. However, that question is somehow more interesting, yet unanswered.... Your answer God gives in the form of a question... Ro 9:14-21 14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? Certainly not! 15 For He says to Moses, "I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion." 16 So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to the Pharaoh, "For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I may show My power in you, and that My name may be declared in all the earth." 18 Therefore He has mercy on whom He wills, and whom He wills He hardens. 19 You will say to me then, "Why does He still find fault? For who has resisted His will?" 20 But indeed, O man, who are you to reply against God? Will the thing formed say to him who formed it, "Why have you made me like this?" 21 Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor? NKJV the understanding is in the light of truth... God 'IS' and answers to no one and does He not have right over what is His to begin with? Personal witness- of all persuasion I have encountered~ His is the most gentle and humble that I have ever witnessed I have been given the understanding of perfection in the knowing of Him. This speaks of one experiential truth in me- He is not threatened by the need of proving what is but by His pleasure He proclaims Himself to be as He 'IS'. Hence I am not forced to Love Him but because He has placed His Truth within me I can do nothing else but Love Him... Love, Steven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted December 14, 2011 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,245 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,971 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted December 14, 2011 Can God open up a closed person's mind or would that be a violation of free will? I believe I would put it like this. Yes God can open a persons mind..... what does that mean?? God can and does open people's mind so that they understand...... however he does not in general force himself on people. They do have the choice of accepting or rejecting God for who he is and what he has done for us. I can't say that he never does that for I'm not everywhere to know everything or everyone. I've learned that the Bible is so complex in it's entirety that I've learned by hard lesson never to say never, so I'm reluctant to say that the Bible doesn't say this, but it's what I peraonally believe out of everything I've read.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua-777 Posted December 15, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 410 Topics Per Day: 0.06 Content Count: 3,102 Content Per Day: 0.48 Reputation: 522 Days Won: 6 Joined: 10/19/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/07/1984 Share Posted December 15, 2011 Of course He can. I gave my life to Him. He showed me the intensity of His love. He revealed Himself to me, leaving me with no other option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Openly Curious Posted December 16, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 55 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,568 Content Per Day: 0.68 Reputation: 770 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/18/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted December 16, 2011 Can God open up a closed person's mind or would that be a violation of free will? It's not a violation of a persons free will to comprehend or recognize a truth that once was hidden to them in the dark. When a light bulb goes off in our minds you can't deny the light it gives you'd be foolish to do that. Thing is God sent his only begotten Son into the world to be the sacrifice for the sins of mankind while the world was yet in darkness ( John 1:1-18 & Romans 3:25; 5:8). Not everyone will simply accept a truth as a truth by faith and being closed minded the truth is rejected thus continuing further in the darkness of their own minds because it is truth that brings light and enlightenens opens up our minds. The Word (Jesus) from the beginning became flesh and dwelt among us he was the light of men but the darkness comprehendeth not the light. Christ the only begotten of the Father was the light of the world but those in the world will not all come to the light (Jesus) lest their deeds be made manifest (sins exposed) in light of the truth being Jesus was the Saviour of the world sent from God and mankind was in need of a Saviour for man couldn't save themselves from sin. Christ is the truth sent into this world by the heavenly Father showing through his only begotten Son's sacrifice on the cross his love toward fallen man from Adam. It was not a violation of free will but instead it was a liberation an unveiling of a truth that had been hid from ages past, from the foundation of the world that God was in Christ reconciling the world unto himself. Christ the light of the world was born and revealed to the world (Ephesians 1:7-14 chapters 1-3 ). Simply having faith believing that Christ was the Saviour of the world and that his blood was given for the remission of sins is a truth that opens our minds and frees us from the guilt and condemnation that sin had upon us. It's not a truth being forced upon us against our will but until that truth is acknowledged as individuals our minds remain closed held in the darkness of our tresspasses and sins. It's the truth that set's us free and God was in Christ reconciling the world unto himself. To deny Christ as Saviour of the world is to remain in darkness denying the light of the world. There is no violation of free will as humanity was given a gift from God that Light (Jesus) from heaven that shineth out of darkness the Saviour of the world either you receive the witness of God or you deny it. A gift is not a violation of free will but an outward expression of love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted December 16, 2011 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted December 16, 2011 Can God open up a closed person's mind or would that be a violation of free will? That is His specialty. The Holy Spirit is the revelator! He opens up what is simply to the natural man paper and ink and words---Scripture, God-breathed and alive with great power, wisdom and insight to the mind and spirit of man. To quote something I have read: "Without the Spirit's wisdom and insight, science is but trickery, psychology is just self-obsession, sociology is just the workings of the rabble, language becomes merely a tool for manipulation, and religion really becomes the opiate of the masses that Marx thought it was." (http://www.spirithom...ork.html#seeing) Now, while it is within God's power to present Himself to men in powerful ways, the failure in knowing Him is man's alone. He misses God, or denies God, or thinks himself into a corner and stays there. It is all down to the sovereignty over his own destiny that God has built into him. To open up a closed person's mind is God's specialty, indeed. However, it bothers me to read this response. I mean, no offense Floatingaxe, I just can't see the answer to the second question, which is, "would that be a violation of fee will?" I like this thread because it stimulates my interest in reading more about this topic. However, that question is somehow more interesting, yet unanswered.... It is God's part and pleasure to reveal Himself to us and it is our part to either receive or reject Him. There is no violation of our free will going on. The only violation that happens is when one rejects the free gift of sins paid, and eternal life---it violates the One who created us for Himself and who loves us unfathomably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Given Grace Posted December 19, 2011 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 14 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/16/2011 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/13/1982 Share Posted December 19, 2011 Can God open up a closed person's mind or would that be a violation of free will? That is His specialty. The Holy Spirit is the revelator! He opens up what is simply to the natural man paper and ink and words---Scripture, God-breathed and alive with great power, wisdom and insight to the mind and spirit of man. To quote something I have read: "Without the Spirit's wisdom and insight, science is but trickery, psychology is just self-obsession, sociology is just the workings of the rabble, language becomes merely a tool for manipulation, and religion really becomes the opiate of the masses that Marx thought it was." (http://www.spirithom...ork.html#seeing) Now, while it is within God's power to present Himself to men in powerful ways, the failure in knowing Him is man's alone. He misses God, or denies God, or thinks himself into a corner and stays there. It is all down to the sovereignty over his own destiny that God has built into him. To open up a closed person's mind is God's specialty, indeed. However, it bothers me to read this response. I mean, no offense Floatingaxe, I just can't see the answer to the second question, which is, "would that be a violation of fee will?" I like this thread because it stimulates my interest in reading more about this topic. However, that question is somehow more interesting, yet unanswered.... Your answer God gives in the form of a question... Ro 9:14-21 14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? Certainly not! 15 For He says to Moses, "I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion." 16 So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to the Pharaoh, "For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I may show My power in you, and that My name may be declared in all the earth." 18 Therefore He has mercy on whom He wills, and whom He wills He hardens. 19 You will say to me then, "Why does He still find fault? For who has resisted His will?" 20 But indeed, O man, who are you to reply against God? Will the thing formed say to him who formed it, "Why have you made me like this?" 21 Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor? NKJV the understanding is in the light of truth... God 'IS' and answers to no one and does He not have right over what is His to begin with? Personal witness- of all persuasion I have encountered~ His is the most gentle and humble that I have ever witnessed I have been given the understanding of perfection in the knowing of Him. This speaks of one experiential truth in me- He is not threatened by the need of proving what is but by His pleasure He proclaims Himself to be as He 'IS'. Hence I am not forced to Love Him but because He has placed His Truth within me I can do nothing else but Love Him... Love, Steven Thank you Steven for this response. But philosophically speaking, isn't it inappropriate to answer a question with another question? sorry, just thinking out loud... Anyway, I like the way you take out quotes from the Bible. I am just curious, did you learn them by heart and put them in action, or are you just using "CTRL + F" in your system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Given Grace Posted December 19, 2011 Group: Members Followers: 1 Topic Count: 0 Topics Per Day: 0 Content Count: 14 Content Per Day: 0.00 Reputation: 0 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/16/2011 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/13/1982 Share Posted December 19, 2011 Can God open up a closed person's mind or would that be a violation of free will? That is His specialty. The Holy Spirit is the revelator! He opens up what is simply to the natural man paper and ink and words---Scripture, God-breathed and alive with great power, wisdom and insight to the mind and spirit of man. To quote something I have read: "Without the Spirit's wisdom and insight, science is but trickery, psychology is just self-obsession, sociology is just the workings of the rabble, language becomes merely a tool for manipulation, and religion really becomes the opiate of the masses that Marx thought it was." (http://www.spirithom...ork.html#seeing) Now, while it is within God's power to present Himself to men in powerful ways, the failure in knowing Him is man's alone. He misses God, or denies God, or thinks himself into a corner and stays there. It is all down to the sovereignty over his own destiny that God has built into him. To open up a closed person's mind is God's specialty, indeed. However, it bothers me to read this response. I mean, no offense Floatingaxe, I just can't see the answer to the second question, which is, "would that be a violation of fee will?" I like this thread because it stimulates my interest in reading more about this topic. However, that question is somehow more interesting, yet unanswered.... It is God's part and pleasure to reveal Himself to us and it is our part to either receive or reject Him. There is no violation of our free will going on. The only violation that happens is when one rejects the free gift of sins paid, and eternal life---it violates the One who created us for Himself and who loves us unfathomably. Thanks for your response Floatingaxe. I think agree more on your reply than on Steven's... God bless us all!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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