Kim Clement

[AnotherTraveler]

But, ealier in this thread, someone discussed 2 different types of prophecy: the kind that would happen no matter what we did and the kind that could be altered by human prayer and interecession.

Yes, that was me that brought that up, and you are right, God doesn't have to explain Himself, but He often does because He wants us to understand Him and trust His ways in all things.

I am glad you were obedient, and I really appreciate your committment to the Lord, and I don't doubt that your obedience (and that of others) does affect what the Lord decides to do, and like you, I hope for mercy and appreciate that the Lord does indeed show mercy.

Let me state that I could be wrong, I don't believe at this point that I am, but I have been wrong in other things before when I was certain that I was right.

I really appreciate your sweet spirit and obedience to the Lord.

I love the exchange of ideas here, and the willingness usually here to disagree without being disagreeable. There are many fine Christians here, and I am pleased that you are also finding this a worthy place to be.

[Guest shiloh357]

Your points are strong and backed by scripture. But, ealier in this thread, someone discussed 2 different types of prophecy: the kind that would happen no matter what we did and the kind that could be altered by human prayer and interecession. The Nebraska pastor stated in his prophecy that the outcome of this political time could be altered thru intercession. Do you suppose that the Clement prophecy was based on what would/could have happened if prayer, intercession, and obedient fasting had not been employed? Didn't God tell Israel that He would punish them, but Moses intereceded for them, so the outcome God had promised was altered? I don't know all the answers about this topic, because I'm very new in my close walk with the Lord. All I know is that I felt I was obedient to what God directed me to do. God doesn't always take the time to explain Himself to me. He doesn't have to. Like any good parent, He sometimes expects obedience with few questions, except to make sure that what is being asked is "of God". Thanks for allowing me to be part of this discussion. I feel like I am learning lots by reading the replies from everyone in this thread and other threads on this website.

The problem is that nothing in the prophecy says "if you repent and fast and pray then I will not do thus and such." Whenever there was a prophecy from God in Scripture that was not an inevitable event, God says so. A good example is the ministry of Jonah in Nineveh. The notion that God might change his mind if everyone fasts and prays was an element that was missing from this so-called "prophecy."

That fact that nothing happened, pretty much torpedoes any possibility that it came from God.

I am all for the gift of prophecy being employed in the Body of Messiah as God wills, but I am very careful who I listen to. I think there are legitimate prophets, but we have to be careful. Historically most people served reluctantly as a prophet. It was not an office anyone took to himself willingly or gladly. Most of the time true prophets are not sent to deliver pleasent news. That is why they had a short life expectancy in ancient Israel.

You don't need a prophet to tell you when things are going well. Usually, a prophet shows up when God is just about fed up with the disobedience of His people, and is giving a warning about impending judgement. You don't get too many people buying your books, tapes, and sending "seed" gifts to your TV ministry with messages like that.

[Yahsway]

Amen Shiloh, now thats what the body needs to understand. There are toooo many proclaiming to be walking in the office of prophecy, but are in actuality just men and women looking for a following.

John the baptist was a prophet I believe his message was REPENT for the Kingdom of God is at hand. I believe that message needs to be going out today, but sadly it is not.

[wondering04]

I think when it comes to prophets we have to be VERY careful. God indites the prophets who do not prophesy God's word, but their own words. And he also indites (sorry for spelling) those who follow false prophets. We are to know the word and any prophesy given will line up with the Word of God. It is our responsibility to make sure that the prophesies are Biblical.

I am suspicious of those who constantly receive prophesies from God, because it makes it more a performance than maybe a true word from God.

I know that it is a tendency of me and I am sure others to pick and choose prophesies that appeal to us, and unpopular ones tend not to be listened to.

I think of Jeremiah who was very unpopular. He warned what God was going to do, heard directly from God and warned the people of Israel. At the same time, on the scene were those prophets who told the people what they wanted to hear, and said they were speaking from God. Jeremiah stood out like a sore thumb, was so contrary to what the others were saying, but at the same time was speaking the true word of God. I worry that some of the prophets who have become immensely popular are maybe not always hearing from God, and saying what seems to be true.

It was warned that in the end days many false prophets would emerge. I would take all prophesies with a grain of salt. Maybe write down what they said and test the fruit of them. See if they really do come true, or what the statistics are. We really need to be fruit testers.

I am watching these prophets and checking them out, but not fully accepting everything they throw out hook, line and sinker.

Heather

[Guest yod]

I think a good rule would be this....

If a "prophet" is self-proclaimed OR is selling a book or a tape they are to be disregarded

:x:

[AnotherTraveler]

I agree Yod. If you will send $39.95 as a free will offering, we will send you an anointed prophecy cloth, made from geniune recycled cardboard.....Oh how such a thing must grieve the Lord!

[mdulin2004]

My spirit does not bare witness with the Elijah list prophets although I have remained open. When Kim Clement's prophesy didn't come to pass, I figured as much but I wasn't totally doubtful.

I checked out some other prophesies on the site and they just didn't ring true with the lateness of the hour. There is a element of truth but the drift seems to be going in the other direction of what I am sensing in the spirit.

However, I have had strong impressions concerning George Bush and an assassination attempt against him. So much so that I put a warning on my page. Since that time I also had a dream of President Bush including gunshots and an explosion. Since that time, I have ran across someone elses dream of an assassination that included the same.

So when I heard Kim Clement's prophesy, I was expecting something could happen. Date setting is never good unless you know that you know that you have heard from God and even then I would ask for many confirmations.

[Guest yod]

My opinion is that Kim Clements is well informed and capable of analyzing data. Then he takes this information and makes educated guesses. I have no problem with that.

When it is couched in terms of being a prophecy...well...I might agree with his possible scenario but I can't agree that he's a prophet. He has already proven that to be false so it gets in the way of his very good analysis of events.

[Guest LMKloft]

In response to mdulin2004: About a month ago, I had a vision about a large city skyline. I don't know what city it was. I didn't recognize the buildings, but there were lots of tall buildings. Also in the vision was the number "200" and the word "explosion". At the time, God told me to pray/intercede and fast about it. I did, but I did not receive any confirmation about what the vision referred to. After reading your dream, I wonder if my vision was related to your dream? When I was relating the vision to a trusted fellow Christian, I inadvertently used the word "bomb" instead of "explosion". I knew that I knew, instantly, that "bomb" was not the correct word. "Explosion" was the correct word to use. In my thoughts, "explosion" could refer to many things: an "explosion" of people coming to the Lord; an "explosion" that hurts many people; etc. All I know is that I saw that "200" people would be involved and that it would happen in a large city and that God wanted me to pray/intercede. Maybe I'll never receive confirmation about this, and that's OK. I did what God asked me to do, and for now, that will have to be enough. Lynn in Iowa

[O'Dannyboy]

Have faith LMKloft. Visions and dreams can be very hard to figure out. Know that 200 French Jews recently arived in Izrael to flee antisemitism. Rest assured this is just the begining. Your "explosion" could be the begining of an exodus of jews from Europe, starting with these first 200. Perhaps the "big city" you refer to is Jeruselem where they were greeted by Ariel Sharon.

Edited October 16, 2004 by O'Dannyboy