angels4u Posted October 18, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Author Share Posted October 18, 2016 The first resurrection happened when Jesus rose from the dead and the graves opened also called the first resurrection: The Death of Jesus …51At that moment the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom. The earth quaked and the rocks were split. 52Thetombs broke open, and the bodies of many saints who had fallen asleep were raised.53After Jesus’ resurrection, when they had come out of the tombs, they entered the holy city and appeared to many people.…Matth.27:52 The Rapture will happen in the twinkling of an eye: Where O Death is Your Victory? …51Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52in an instant, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53For the perishable must be clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality.… Only the people who died in Christ will be changed to meet Jesus in the air. After the Tribulation the people who survived those days will enter the Millenial and on the end of the Millenial is the Great Judgement and all the graves will open and people will be judged. The second resurrection: The Final Judgment 11 And I saw a great white throne and the one sitting on it. The earth and sky fled from his presence, but they found no place to hide. 12 I saw the dead, both great and small, standing before God’s throne. And the books were opened, including the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to what they had done, as recorded in the books. 13 The sea gave up its dead, and death and the grave[a] gave up their dead. And all were judged according to their deeds. 14 Then death and the grave were thrown into the lake of fire. This lake of fire is the second death.15 And anyone whose name was not found recorded in the Book of Life was thrown into the lake of fire.Rev. 20:11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Posted October 19, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,665 Content Per Day: 0.46 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/11/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted October 19, 2016 21 minutes ago, seeking the lost said: Rev. 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. 5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. These are the resurrections in order. First is the resurrection of the tribulation martyrs. This is a closed set and non movable. That means the time of this resurrection is at the end of the seven years of tribulation. To move the time of this resurrection is adulterating the text. This is a closed set which means that only those who are mentioned are included in this resurrection. It is also an adulteration of the text to add to this closed set. Do not say all righteous are resurrected here. They are not. The church those who are alive and remain will be caught up right after the dead in Christ are raised. We will not proceed them. This is at the end of the 1000 years. This is not Amillennialism. I never said there was a resurrection before ... the tribulation, but only after ... the tribulation. But the 1,000 years Millennium is after ... the tribulation and begins on the 'day' of Jesus' 2nd coming. Your words: "It is my position that because the resurrection takes place at the end of the 1000 year that is the time of the rapture." Did you make a mistake with saying that quote above? It points to a false belief in the resurrection of the saints AFTER the 1,000 years of Rev.20, for the rapture is about Christ gathering His Church, not the wicked. And yet John 5:28-29, our Lord Jesus' words, He said 'all' ... in the graves shall hear His voice at His coming, and will come forth, the just to their resurrection, and the wicked to their resurrection. That's to occur at the end of this present world immediately after the tribulation. So the wicked indeed are... raised from the dead on the day of His return also. Isaiah 25 is where Apostle Paul was pulling from about death being swallowed up in victory on that day. It happens for everyone. Life in a flesh body will be over when this present world ends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeking the lost Posted October 19, 2016 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 496 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 209 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/15/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted October 19, 2016 35 minutes ago, Salty said: I never said there was a resurrection before ... the tribulation, but only after ... the tribulation. But the 1,000 years Millennium is after ... the tribulation and begins on the 'day' of Jesus' 2nd coming. Your words: "It is my position that because the resurrection takes place at the end of the 1000 year that is the time of the rapture." Did you make a mistake with saying that quote above? It points to a false belief in the resurrection of the saints AFTER the 1,000 years of Rev.20, for the rapture is about Christ gathering His Church, not the wicked. And yet John 5:28-29, our Lord Jesus' words, He said 'all' ... in the graves shall hear His voice at His coming, and will come forth, the just to their resurrection, and the wicked to their resurrection. That's to occur at the end of this present world immediately after the tribulation. So the wicked indeed are... raised from the dead on the day of His return also. Isaiah 25 is where Apostle Paul was pulling from about death being swallowed up in victory on that day. It happens for everyone. Life in a flesh body will be over when this present world ends. The rest of the dead are raised at the end of the thousand years. That is exactly what Rev. 20:5 says. It is not a false belief if you do not try to add to the Word or change it to fit your own ideas.They will hear His voice. Do you want to add to the first resurrection? You do see that it is a closed set do you not? In regard to the coming of Jesus; He is here, He will come as King, and He will come as Judge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Posted October 19, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,665 Content Per Day: 0.46 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/11/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted October 19, 2016 6 hours ago, seeking the lost said: The rest of the dead are raised at the end of the thousand years. That is exactly what Rev. 20:5 says. It is not a false belief if you do not try to add to the Word or change it to fit your own ideas.They will hear His voice. Do you want to add to the first resurrection? You do see that it is a closed set do you not? In regard to the coming of Jesus; He is here, He will come as King, and He will come as Judge. What I see is how you equated the 'rapture' with a resurrection for after the future 1,000 years of Rev.20 when no such idea is written in God's Word. The word rapture isn't even in God's Word to begin with; it originated from a Latin translation of Greek harpazo. The harpazo event in God's Word is about Jesus' second coming to gather His elect that are still alive on earth, which is immediately after the tribulation like Matt.24 confirms. There is NO rapture after the 1,000 years of Rev.20, nothing written of that sort in God's Word, so who's trying to add to God's Word here? Certainly not me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeking the lost Posted October 19, 2016 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 496 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 209 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/15/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted October 19, 2016 6 hours ago, Salty said: What I see is how you equated the 'rapture' with a resurrection for after the future 1,000 years of Rev.20 when no such idea is written in God's Word. The word rapture isn't even in God's Word to begin with; it originated from a Latin translation of Greek harpazo. The harpazo event in God's Word is about Jesus' second coming to gather His elect that are still alive on earth, which is immediately after the tribulation like Matt.24 confirms. There is NO rapture after the 1,000 years of Rev.20, nothing written of that sort in God's Word, so who's trying to add to God's Word here? Certainly not me. The event of which you speak of as rapture is that which is spoken of in 1 Cor. and 1 Thessalonians. 50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. 51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words. This changing, being caught up together with them is what is called the rapture. Do you not understand this? This rapture is preceded by the resurrection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coheir Posted October 19, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 104 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 2,458 Content Per Day: 0.55 Reputation: 729 Days Won: 5 Joined: 02/09/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 01/31/1950 Share Posted October 19, 2016 Act 24:15 (15) And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust. "A" in this verse means 1; any time "A" is used it Always means ONE. it is a definite article in English language;it can Never mean more than one. and this verse is only talking One thing; the dead. has nothing to do with meeting God in the air and in the twinkling of an eye being changed. the two kinds are just and unjust in A (1) resurrection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Posted October 19, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,665 Content Per Day: 0.46 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/11/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted October 19, 2016 3 hours ago, seeking the lost said: The event of which you speak of as rapture is that which is spoken of in 1 Cor. and 1 Thessalonians. 50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. 51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words. This changing, being caught up together with them is what is called the rapture. Do you not understand this? This rapture is preceded by the resurrection. I well know what the idea the 'rapture' is. It's the timing where you placed it being after the 1,000 years Millennium that I do not agree with. You must be an Amillennialist, one who does not believe the future 1,000 years by Jesus and His elect is literal. I understand it per God's Word to be very literal, and does not begin until Jesus returns at His 2nd coming. So let's stick to what you said before about its timing before trying to get off track with cut and pasting Scripture out of relevance to this: Your words: "It is my position that because the resurrection takes place at the end of the 1000 year that is the time of the rapture." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seeking the lost Posted October 19, 2016 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 496 Content Per Day: 0.17 Reputation: 209 Days Won: 0 Joined: 05/15/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted October 19, 2016 3 hours ago, Salty said: I well know what the idea the 'rapture' is. It's the timing where you placed it being after the 1,000 years Millennium that I do not agree with. You must be an Amillennialist, one who does not believe the future 1,000 years by Jesus and His elect is literal. I understand it per God's Word to be very literal, and does not begin until Jesus returns at His 2nd coming. So let's stick to what you said before about its timing before trying to get off track with cut and pasting Scripture out of relevance to this: Your words: "It is my position that because the resurrection takes place at the end of the 1000 year that is the time of the rapture." The time of the resurrection and the time of the rapture are the same. They are raised first then we which are alive and remain will be caught up together with them and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Would you want to move the time of the resurrection? It is at the end of the thousand years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted October 19, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Author Share Posted October 19, 2016 26 minutes ago, seeking the lost said: The time of the resurrection and the time of the rapture are the same. They are raised first then we which are alive and remain will be caught up together with them and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Would you want to move the time of the resurrection? It is at the end of the thousand years. Amen ,seeking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted October 19, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.39 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Author Share Posted October 19, 2016 3 hours ago, Giller said: A resurrection for the just , and a resurrection for the unjust. And just by comparing scriptures with scriptures it shows that there is a difference. Amen Rev.20:28 11Then I saw a great white throne and the One who sat on it. The earth and the heavens fled from His presence, and no place was found for them. 12And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne. And there were open books, and one of them was the book of life. And the dead were judged according to their deeds, as recorded in the books. 13The sea gave up its dead, and Death and Hades gave up their dead, and each one was judged according to his deeds.… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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