Jayyycuuup Posted July 25, 2012 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 68 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,384 Content Per Day: 0.37 Reputation: 155 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/20/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/22/1996 Share Posted July 25, 2012 1. Moses was NOT a murderer. Moses killed a man who was beating another man to death, which doesn't fit the definition of wanton homicide. Moses committed justifiable homicide to protect someone else. 2. Yes, if God desires that a man be delivered from execution, then he will act. 3. It is the duty of society to carry out God's commands. "If anyone sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed." This was long before the law of Moses. If killling the man was justified then why did he bury the body?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bold Believer Posted July 25, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 121 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,931 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 126 Days Won: 8 Joined: 01/22/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/13/1955 Author Share Posted July 25, 2012 1. Moses was NOT a murderer. Moses killed a man who was beating another man to death, which doesn't fit the definition of wanton homicide. Moses committed justifiable homicide to protect someone else. 2. Yes, if God desires that a man be delivered from execution, then he will act. 3. It is the duty of society to carry out God's commands. "If anyone sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed." This was long before the law of Moses. If killling the man was justified then why did he bury the body?? Out of respect, possibly. If he were a murderer, he would've simply hidden it. Also possibly out of concern that even though HE knew it was justified, the Egyptians would not have believed him because he identified with the Hebrews over them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayyycuuup Posted July 25, 2012 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 68 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,384 Content Per Day: 0.37 Reputation: 155 Days Won: 1 Joined: 01/20/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/22/1996 Share Posted July 25, 2012 1. Moses was NOT a murderer. Moses killed a man who was beating another man to death, which doesn't fit the definition of wanton homicide. Moses committed justifiable homicide to protect someone else. 2. Yes, if God desires that a man be delivered from execution, then he will act. 3. It is the duty of society to carry out God's commands. "If anyone sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed." This was long before the law of Moses. If killling the man was justified then why did he bury the body?? Out of respect, possibly. If he were a murderer, he would've simply hidden it. Also possibly out of concern that even though HE knew it was justified, the Egyptians would not have believed him because he identified with the Hebrews over them. But then He ran and Hid, I know the pharoh sought to kill him but why didnt he have faith in the Lord, faith that he would show the pharoh the truth of things. He didnt because he was guilty of murder. In Exodus 2:14, the Hebrews thought Moses might have killed them... Then on top of that he looked this way and that to ensure he could kill the Egyptian... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdemoss Posted July 25, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 59 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,402 Content Per Day: 0.98 Reputation: 2,154 Days Won: 28 Joined: 02/10/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1971 Share Posted July 25, 2012 1. Moses was NOT a murderer. Moses killed a man who was beating another man to death, which doesn't fit the definition of wanton homicide. Moses committed justifiable homicide to protect someone else. 2. Yes, if God desires that a man be delivered from execution, then he will act. 3. It is the duty of society to carry out God's commands. "If anyone sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed." This was long before the law of Moses. If killling the man was justified then why did he bury the body?? Out of respect, possibly. If he were a murderer, he would've simply hidden it. Also possibly out of concern that even though HE knew it was justified, the Egyptians would not have believed him because he identified with the Hebrews over them. But then He ran and Hid, I know the pharoh sought to kill him but why didnt he have faith in the Lord, faith that he would show the pharoh the truth of things. He didnt because he was guilty of murder. In Exodus 2:14, the Hebrews thought Moses might have killed them... Then on top of that he looked this way and that to ensure he could kill the Egyptian... Jacob, I think you might be having difficulty understanding what really happened with Moses killing the Egyptian. Moses looked around before he killed him. To some this shows that Moses knew what he was about to do was wrong. To others it shows that Moses knew that someone else who seen him might think it was wrong. We are told in the NT that Moses' motive for killing the Egyptian was that he thought that they would understand that God would deliver them by his hand. This is where he made his mistake. He wasn't sent by God to deliver them but he judged that they needed delivered and had faith that God would do it by his hand and acted upon that faith. You ask why he didn't have faith that the Lord would show the pharaoh the truth of things. His original faith was based in faulty logic, why should he have had faith when his original plan failed? He was not in God's will as God had not sent him. God would choose to send him 40 years later though and Moses would act appropriately this time by following Gods instruction. If I had a dollar for every time I jumped out on faith when I wasn't actually called to do that which I purposed to do for God. God love Moses. He didn't understand the will of God. He understood justice though. In Jesus Name, Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xero Posted July 25, 2012 Group: Advanced Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 365 Content Per Day: 0.08 Reputation: 90 Days Won: 6 Joined: 03/16/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted July 25, 2012 But I would not feel so alone, everybody must get stoned. -Bob Dylan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels4u Posted July 26, 2012 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 56 Topic Count: 1,664 Topics Per Day: 0.20 Content Count: 19,764 Content Per Day: 2.38 Reputation: 12,164 Days Won: 28 Joined: 08/22/2001 Status: Offline Share Posted July 26, 2012 God never let anyone off the hook from earthly consequences. His forgiveness grants them eternal life... which may happen much sooner than if they hadn't committed a death penalty crime in the first place. we still must pay the earthly consequences for our actions. we don't get a free pass on that. Agree with you,God can forgive us if we are Christians or become Christians,but we still would have concequences for whatever crime we commited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdemoss Posted July 26, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 59 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,402 Content Per Day: 0.98 Reputation: 2,154 Days Won: 28 Joined: 02/10/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1971 Share Posted July 26, 2012 As for consequences of forgiven sin, yes there is biblical proof that even forgiven sin has its consequences. Davids baby died and his son was raised up as his enemy in his house and ended up dying as a result. The consequence for the sin seems to be metered out by God who is righteous judge, though he might use the hand of man to do it. The problem comes in when believers begin to fault God for not having punished someone for a crime in the way they believe they ought to be punished for it. In Jesus Name, Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdemoss Posted July 26, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 59 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 4,402 Content Per Day: 0.98 Reputation: 2,154 Days Won: 28 Joined: 02/10/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/26/1971 Share Posted July 26, 2012 We serve a Merciful and awesome God. Very true, but he will have mercy upon whom he will have mercy upon. David repented. David brought forth fruit meet for repentance, yet the baby died. God did not repent. Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted July 26, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted July 26, 2012 Repentance and belief in Christ as your Savior does not change your entire history. If a person is drinking themself to death, and then they become a Christian, is it God's obligation to cure them? Of course not. Of course, He can and most likely does sometimes (for His reasons) heal someone in that situation, but EXPECTING God to clean up your mess is just not scriptural IMO Asking the penal system to defer a person's death sentence because they became a Christian would ensure alot of converts and perhaps we can also just let people out of prison if they promise they will now be good. As Gary has already pointed out, David's son died...so, that does present a very clear picture of sin and its consequences which, I realize, is just NOT what some people wanna hear... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bold Believer Posted July 26, 2012 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 121 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,931 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 126 Days Won: 8 Joined: 01/22/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/13/1955 Author Share Posted July 26, 2012 David's Romp with Bathsheba cost him more than just a son. Check all his children. The difference is David's Revelation of God. King Evil did not have a revelation of God, so when he repented, God had great mercy. King David was judged according to his revelation. God will have mercy on who he has mercy, that is not a God that is being fickle or hard to figure out. His mercy has always been according to repentance, the Heart, and the revelation the person had at the time of offense. A women who clubbed her two kids to death with a Rock, because she thought God would raise them up was found not guilty. How does this happen? Because God is full of mercy. God had pity on her because in her heart she was obeying Him, though she was dumb as rocks in her understanding of the Word. Jesus said............... Because you have said you see, then your sin remains. What you say, effects Judgement. You define your own revelation, even if you have it or not. If they claimed they see it, and understand, then nothing else Jesus can help them with. What they should have said is, have mercy, explain this more. Even when we sin, we know it's bad, but just how bad? I never tell God I knew better, because if I knew better, I would have never done the sin to began with. Once a Person says they "KNOW" then there is no more light that can be given. This was Jesus Point. I know Lord looking at Porn is wrong!!! Then if you know, why are you looking at it? What can God do to help at this point? It's like walking over to help someone you see having issues with a project to help them, and they get mad and tell you that they know what their doing. What help can you be to them at this point, even though you know a few things that would make their job a lot more easy? So there was a reason David did not fully escape his sin and murder of Bathsheba's Husband. David had far more revelation than King Evil. Jesus Is Lord. Might I ask Mike, have you ever been addicted to anything? If so, then you know that it has an appeal that is difficult to resist. One may very much desire in their heart to rid themselves of such a thing, whatever it might be, but the hook is there and they keep getting dragged back. That type of evil is very insidious. Repentance begins in the heart. The very word means 'change of direction.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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