What to expect next.

[gypc]

After the election, I was praying and feeling very smug that we could relax somewhat now that the election was over and Iraq was soon to have its elections. The lord joted me back to earth by showing me to expect things to speed up and get worse in the days and weeks ahead. There will be no stopping the volence ahead. Nor will things ever go back to normal.

I know what ya mean....I've done the same thing but as the Lord showed you, there is no time to relax. And, yes.....it's gonna get worse......let us keep our eyes on Christ as we preach this gospel for the day will soon be over!

In his love,

Brian

[other one]

Well, I'm waiting for the sun to turn dark and the moon to turn blood red, then the end will come and all the unsaved people I know will go to hell.

I don't think I am ready for that......

[apothanein kerdos]

JohnS ~

The Bible teaches us about eternity, however it speaks more of living a Christ-like life than looking forward to the end of the world. The fact is, God has not called us to look for His return. The only thing we've been called to do to prepare for His return is share His Gospel and disciple fellow Christians. Trying to understand when His return will happen, if it'll happen in our lifetime, if it will be before or after the tribulation, etc...doesn't matter. We aren't called to seek it out or understand it. We're simply called to follow His Word.

[JohnS]

JohnS ~

The Bible teaches us about eternity, however it speaks more of living a Christ-like life than looking forward to the end of the world. The fact is, God has not called us to look for His return. The only thing we've been called to do to prepare for His return is share His Gospel and disciple fellow Christians. Trying to understand when His return will happen, if it'll happen in our lifetime, if it will be before or after the tribulation, etc...doesn't matter. We aren't called to seek it out or understand it. We're simply called to follow His Word.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The parables in Matthew 25 call for us to do two things, watch and work.

Luke 12

"Be dressed in readiness, and keep your lamps lit. "Be like men who are waiting for their master when he returns from the wedding feast, so that they may immediately open the door to him when he comes and knocks. "Blessed are those slaves whom the master will find on the alert when he comes; truly I say to you, that he will gird himself to serve, and have them recline at the table, and will come up and wait on them. "Whether he comes in the second watch, or even in the third, and finds them so, blessed are those slaves. "But be sure of this, that if the head of the house had known at what hour the thief was coming, he would not have allowed his house to be broken into. "You too, be ready; for the Son of Man is coming at an hour that you do not expect."

Are we ready for Christ's second coming? It would be good if we asked our consciences this question frequently. It might prevent us from taking false steps in daily life. It might prevent much backsliding. The true Christian should not only believe in Christ and love Christ; he should also look and long for Christ's appearing. If he cannot say from his heart, "Come, Lord Jesus," there must be something wrong with his soul. Ryle

1 Corinthians 16:22 "If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema Maranatha."

The significant part of this statement in relationship to Christ'ts coming is the term "Maranatha," which was one of several "eschatological statements concerning Christ's coming. . .within the framework of early Christian tradition." It was distinctive among these statements because it was an Aramaic expression. It had the form of a petition. The Didache, an ancient Christian manual of worship, used this petition in statements that were to be made at the end of the communion service. This usage helps to clarify the meaning of this expression, especially in light of Paul's reference to the future coming of Christ in conjunction with the observance of communion (1 Cor. 11:26).

Leon Morris said the term "Maranatha" consists of three Aramaic words: "Mar" ("Lord"), "ana" ("our"), and "tha" ("come"); thus, the entire term meant "our Lord, come." In light of this meaning, Charles J. Ellicott declared that "Maranatha" was "practically equivalent to' the expression "The Lord is at hand" in Philippians 4:5.

William Barclay explained the significance of Paul's using this Aramaic term in a letter to the Greek church:

It is strange to meet with an Aramaic phrase in a Greek letter to a Greek Church. The explanation is that that phrase had become a watchword and a password. It summed up the vital hope of the early Church, and Christians whispered it to each other, identified each other by it, in a language which the heathen could not understand.

In the same vein K.G. Kuhn declared that "the untranslated Aram. term is meaningful only if it is a fixed formula" that began in the Palestinian Christian community and then was adopted untranslated by the Greek-speaking Christians. In light of this beginning and adoption of the term, Kuhn drew the conclusion that "maranatha is an important and authentic witness to the faith of the primitive Palestinian community."

Leon Morris asserted that the term "Maranatha" "must have expressed a sentiment that the early church regarded as supremely important, else it would never have been taken over in this way by the Greek-speaking Christians."

Our Lord Come!

[JohnS]

The inspired writer proclaims the followers of Christ will ultimately and completely defeat the enemies of God and the Christian religion will triumph in the end.

Nope, no way, or, as Paul would say, ME GENOITO!

Show the references please.

[apothanein kerdos]

So many like you have criticized christians for using prophecy as their primary witnessing tool and focus in the ministry of the body of Christ We are not called to do same things.

We criticize people like you because you put too much emphasis on it. You use it for evangelism when:

1) We don't know when Christ is comming back

2) We don't know if we're close

and

3) Prophecy in the New Testament is never used as an evengalism tool but instead as an inspirational tool for Christians.

It's not your place to judge anothers ministry in God's body of believers as long as it's edifying and in line with the core doctrines of the church.

How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.

This is talking about the gifts concerning the body...not people who take prophecy too far. The problem with the prophecy is that if I were to drop the line, "Pre-trib is true" I'd be lined up against a wall and shot. Obviously prophecy doesn't line up anywhere near the core doctrines of belief. All truly believe is that Christ is comming back...yet this is more of a general prophecy. There is no way we can use specific prophecy because it's all theory. Sometimes these Christians remind me of Joe Dirt's mom and use the ole' "Is this where you wanna be when Jesus comes back?" routine. It's luricrous to think that eschatology could ever lead someone to the Lord when we have no idea when Jesus will come back.

If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.

But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.

Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues.

Let all things be done decently and in order.

Prophecy is passing christians by, and has most christians fooled for two reasons. They are either bound to a certain set of prophetic beliefs that will not come to pass, or thy just don't care, like you.

Prophecy is the gift of boldness, of speaking of things that are there. It is a gift, not a study. There is a difference between the gift of prophecy and the study of Eschatology.

You said that...We are likewise told not to worry about when Christ will come back.

I would like to see a scripture, in context, to support that idea!

We are told to be alert (Matthew 24:42). What this means is always be doing the work of Christ because we don't know when Christ will return. This doesn't mean we are to look for the signs of the times because we don't know when it will be. The only sure sign is the abomination of desolation. That's it. Notice that Jesus spends verses 42-51 instructins us to live holy lives because we don't know when He will return. He doesn't tell us to look for it, or to hypothesize of how He will come, simply to acknowledge that He will and that we should live every moment as if though our last.

You are one of many who are so complacent about when Christ shall return that I doubt your passion to serve Him in a time of great need and urgency is what it should be. We should be excited about His soon return and not have an apathetic attitude and criticizing those who study, preach, or use prophecy as their primary witnessing tool.

Oh that's just stupid to say. If Christ's return is the only thing that motivates you then you are in a sad state. Our works for Christ should come out of our love for Christ. We should work because love, not because we expect. Besides, we don't know that His return will be in our lifetime...so it's stupid to base our works off of that.

It's important for me to preach to the choir because I believe most of the choir is prophetically misled. Most of the choir will miss the time of His return. Most have been taught and have accepted the standard theory of prophecy and will not even consider another viewpoint. The Eu and Papal origin theory will fool many. All I can hope for is that the big shots stop mixing their theory with Catholicsm and remove the RRE from their end time formula. It isn't scriptural. I also hope that some of you "research" my claims that the RRE, will have nothing to do with the end times and many will be fooled by it.

This is what I'm talking about. You've become so mixed up in studying when Christ will return you've completely forgotten about the modern world. I could give a rat's butt about when He returns or how He returns...what I care about is whether or not my fellow man is dying and going to hell. In fact you forgot, death is the only thing promised in our lifetime...so why not work against that?

The arrogance of the American people will soon be brought low. We will lose more people in one day than in any day in US history. This could happen both in the Middle East and at home. The events in the Middle East are signs that I believe are passing in the seals of Revelation 6.

This is another problem. People who find eschatology so essential are usually so wrong in their study of it. Revelation 6 hasn't come about and won't come a bout until the Great Tribulation which occurs after the abomination of desolation.

Have Americans forgotten that in Bush's axis of evil there are only 2 down and 2 more to go?

How in the world does that math work? There were 3 original ones (North Korea, Iraq, and Iran). Of those three, only one is down (Iraq). So how in the world does 3-1 = -2 and +2?

Syria will likely be next and I think this will really be nasty, and the downfall of the US military. In Bush's efforts in trying to clean the house of terror, he will likely stir up the hornets nest into a regional Mid East war that will also result in mass persecution. We will not win the war on terror. It appears we will only intensify it.

Answer me this:

Does this information help you what-so-ever in witnessing to someone besides use as a scare tactic?

This is the scenario that will bring about a united Arab/Muslim Empire, or the ten horned beast.

We will be just day's away from Jesus return and so many christians will be asleep. Totally fooled as to the time of His return. This is why christians should care. We are on the eve of redemption and too many christians will be in apathy or denial. I care about our Redeemer's soon return. Many christians will be preaching otherwise...that it doesn't matter etc.

I'm pretty sure when He returns we'll know it. When He talks about being asleep, He's talking about people who aren't doing His works or aren't saved. If you read the Greek you would see that. Heck, it's pretty plain in the English.

And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.

Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?

Blessed [is] that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.

Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.

But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;

And shall begin to smite [his] fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for [him], and in an hour that he is not aware of,

And shall cut him asunder, and appoint [him] his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

This scripture is talking to you! He's telling us not to worry. He's telling us to do the work regardless of when He comes back because we don't know when He'll come back. IN other words, don't worry about it.

Are we ready for Christ's second coming? It would be good if we asked our consciences this question frequently. It might prevent us from taking false steps in daily life. It might prevent much backsliding. The true Christian should not only believe in Christ and love Christ; he should also look and long for Christ's appearing. If he cannot say from his heart, "Come, Lord Jesus," there must be something wrong with his soul. Ryle

It's a terrible standard to go by and a terrible reason to work. If you work soley so you aren't embarrassed when He comes back then you have problems. The proper question is, "Am I proving my love to Jesus for what He did?"

1 Corinthians 16:22 "If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema Maranatha."

The significant part of this statement in relationship to Christ'ts coming is the term "Maranatha," which was one of several "eschatological statements concerning Christ's coming. . .within the framework of early Christian tradition." It was distinctive among these statements because it was an Aramaic expression. It had the form of a petition. The Didache, an ancient Christian manual of worship, used this petition in statements that were to be made at the end of the communion service. This usage helps to clarify the meaning of this expression, especially in light of Paul's reference to the future coming of Christ in conjunction with the observance of communion (1 Cor. 11:26).

I fail to see the importance in this. Likewise, you forgot anathema which gives the connotation of "cursed". Basically, Paul is saying if a man doesn't love Christ he is cursed because the Lord is comming. He is comming...however this isn't a focus. So I once again fail to see your point.

The fact is, people who use eschatology to motive themselves in their walk or try to win people to Christ have missed the mark big time.

[JohnS]

1 Corinthians 16:22 "If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema Maranatha."

The significant part of this statement in relationship to Christ'ts coming is the term "Maranatha," which was one of several "eschatological statements concerning Christ's coming. . .within the framework of early Christian tradition." It was distinctive among these statements because it was an Aramaic expression. It had the form of a petition. The Didache, an ancient Christian manual of worship, used this petition in statements that were to be made at the end of the communion service. This usage helps to clarify the meaning of this expression, especially in light of Paul's reference to the future coming of Christ in conjunction with the observance of communion (1 Cor. 11:26).

I fail to see the importance in this. Likewise, you forgot anathema which gives the connotation of "cursed". Basically, Paul is saying if a man doesn't love Christ he is cursed because the Lord is comming. He is comming...however this isn't a focus. So I once again fail to see your point.

Sorry Super Jew,

The point is that "Maranatha" is an Aramaic word in a Greek letter. That was the rallying cry of the early Christians...our Lord come!

I can't for the life of me figure out why a Christian would be upset about another Christian wanting Jesus to return. That and that alone is what is going to set things right.

shalom, shalom

[Guest philws]

Mark 13, Matthew 24, Luke 21 all give Christ's warning least we be deceived as to His ACTUAL (vs. false) second advent.

2 Cor 11:12-15

12 But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we.

13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming (more accurately "disguising" ) themselves into the apostles of Christ.

14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed (disguised) into an angel of light.

15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed (disguised) as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

(KJV)

very few of us have been vouched that the gathering is at the seventh trump and not the sixth. do you know how many of our brothers and sisters are being taught the "at any minute" doctrine of the Lord's return ? how many "revrends" are fleecing the sheep with the "left behind at any minute" fairy tale$ ?

( Ps 111:9-10

9 He sent redemption unto his people: he hath commanded his covenant for ever: Holy and Reverend is His Name.

10 The fear ("reverence" more aptly translated ) of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: a good understanding have all they that do His commandments: His praise endureth for ever. )

anyhow might the "Keys of David" be the chronology of Psalms 22,23 and 24 ? that is, the death, ressurection and final return in Glory of our Precious Lord ?

how churlish is the usage of the false "any minute" doctrine as a scare tactic and blessed is the teaching of of the pure doctrine of The Word ?

agape,

phil

[apothanein kerdos]

1 Corinthians 16:22 "If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema Maranatha."

The significant part of this statement in relationship to Christ'ts coming is the term "Maranatha," which was one of several "eschatological statements concerning Christ's coming. . .within the framework of early Christian tradition." It was distinctive among these statements because it was an Aramaic expression. It had the form of a petition. The Didache, an ancient Christian manual of worship, used this petition in statements that were to be made at the end of the communion service. This usage helps to clarify the meaning of this expression, especially in light of Paul's reference to the future coming of Christ in conjunction with the observance of communion (1 Cor. 11:26).

I fail to see the importance in this. Likewise, you forgot anathema which gives the connotation of "cursed". Basically, Paul is saying if a man doesn't love Christ he is cursed because the Lord is comming. He is comming...however this isn't a focus. So I once again fail to see your point.

Sorry Super Jew,

The point is that "Maranatha" is an Aramaic word in a Greek letter. That was the rallying cry of the early Christians...our Lord come!

I can't for the life of me figure out why a Christian would be upset about another Christian wanting Jesus to return. That and that alone is what is going to set things right.

shalom, shalom

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Again, you're failing to look at the word "anathema" which is a curse. I never said there was anything wrong with gaining hope in the comming of the Lord. What I did say was wrong was using it as motivation to work for Christ or using it as a type of evangelism or declaring with absoluteness that it will occur within our time.

[apothanein kerdos]

Mark 13, Matthew 24, Luke 21 all give Christ's warning least we be deceived as to His ACTUAL (vs. false) second advent.

2 Cor 11:12-15

12 But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we.

13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming (more accurately "disguising" ) themselves into the apostles of Christ.

14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed (disguised) into an angel of light.

15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed (disguised) as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

(KJV)

very few of us have been vouched that the gathering is at the seventh trump and not the sixth. do you know how many of our brothers and sisters are being taught the "at any minute" doctrine of the Lord's return ? how many "revrends" are fleecing the sheep with the "left behind at any minute" fairy tale$ ?

( Ps 111:9-10

9 He sent redemption unto his people: he hath commanded his covenant for ever: Holy and Reverend is His Name.

10 The fear ("reverence" more aptly translated ) of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: a good understanding have all they that do His commandments: His praise endureth for ever. )

anyhow might the "Keys of David" be the chronology of Psalms 22,23 and 24 ? that is, the death, ressurection and final return in Glory of our Precious Lord ?

how churlish is the usage of the false "any minute" doctrine as a scare tactic and blessed is the teaching of of the pure doctrine of The Word ?

agape,

phil

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

John, the above is my reason of why I despise the study of eschatology. Here we have someone so concerned about when Christ is comming back that they're missing the entire point.