So men and make-up....

[OneLight]

I don't understand why this is so shocking to people. This has been happening for a long time. I can remember males in LA during the 70's wearing makeup. It became even more popular with the Goth look in men. After that, the transgenders starting coming out.

[Guest man]

Okay so:

An unjust man is an abomination to the righteous, but one whose way is straight is an abomination to the wicked.Proverbs 29:27

Unjust and Unrighteous are synonyms:

Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God. Corinthians 6:9-11

With my understanding homosexuals has been translated to include those who act effeminate meaning that men act in a way that really reserved for women.

Where is it stated anywhere that make-up is strictly reserved for women?

So if those who are unjust are an abomination and those men who act effeminate are an abomination (with the new translations that include effeminate men with homosexuality) then the guy trying to wear the same make-up as a woman (remember that he looked like woman) is acting effeminate and thus acting unjust and thus his actions are an abomination.

Making judgments on appearance alone is not a good idea.

@Man: I am not judging the guy. He is doing an act that I really thought was unjust. I don't think labeling him as effeminate and stating that the act is unjust is judgement. Aren't Christians suppose to have an understanding of what is unjust and unrighteous?

When you label someone, you're making a judgment about that individual.

Again, personal opinion.

[revolutionist90]

Okay so:

An unjust man is an abomination to the righteous, but one whose way is straight is an abomination to the wicked.Proverbs 29:27

Unjust and Unrighteous are synonyms:

Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God. Corinthians 6:9-11

With my understanding homosexuals has been translated to include those who act effeminate meaning that men act in a way that really reserved for women.

Where is it stated anywhere that make-up is strictly reserved for women?

So if those who are unjust are an abomination and those men who act effeminate are an abomination (with the new translations that include effeminate men with homosexuality) then the guy trying to wear the same make-up as a woman (remember that he looked like woman) is acting effeminate and thus acting unjust and thus his actions are an abomination.

Making judgments on appearance alone is not a good idea.

@Man: I am not judging the guy. He is doing an act that I really thought was unjust. I don't think labeling him as effeminate and stating that the act is unjust is judgement. Aren't Christians suppose to have an understanding of what is unjust and unrighteous?

When you label someone, you're making a judgment about that individual.

Again, personal opinion.

I feel like this is getting more sticky than necessary but anyway...

The problem is that with the scriptures that I have quoted a man who acts effeminate is unjust (there are different versions to the Corinthians homosexuality and it has been stated in previous threads with the term malakoi). But the point is what is an effeminate man? If the term effeminate is based upon cultural definitions of what is specifically female and male then there is a line that is crossed into whether a man is acting effeminate. The point is that the guy is dressing up like a woman (Deuteronomy 22.5).

I don't understand how me labeling him as a woman because he decided to dress like a woman is a bad idea. I also don't understand how i am suppose to gain an opinion of someone if I am unable to look at what they wear. For example, I usually stay clear from men who dress like gang members (wearing a colored) bandana I don't think me labeling him as potentially dangerous is wrong.

You believe that I am passing judgement. I disagree...I say I don't see it wrong to label him as acting effeminate. It is my personal opinion that he is acting effeminate. I understand that labels can be harmful if used incorrectly but I also am in agreement that if it walks like a duck, sounds like a duck then it should be a duck. If you think there is nothing wrong with his actions well that is your opinion.

Again these are my personal opinions in reply to your personal opinions.

[nebula]

My opinion on this: he's trying to hide his true self behind the make-up. (He would not admit that if asked; nor might he be consciously thinking this, but he is.)

While yes, seeing such things is painful and/or disgusting, we can choose to be angry and point fingers, or we can have compassion on the lost soul trapped in the prison of self-hatred.

By true self do you mean that he is trying to hide his gender? I was upset but I didn't get angry or point fingers at him

Hi, I apologize. One problem with the message board is that we lack voice expression and body language with the posts, so it is difficult to determine what emotions are being expressed.

The words had a tone of judgment, in my perception. So I apologize if this perception was incorrect.

However, my statement actually applied to everyone, not just to you, because the typical reaction is to be disgusted with the sin rather than seeing the soul's expression of his need for the Savior. I hope this clarifies things?

As for the first question, I can't tell what he was trying to hide.

[revolutionist90]

I don't understand why this is so shocking to people. This has been happening for a long time. I can remember males in LA during the 70's wearing makeup. It became even more popular with the Goth look in men. After that, the transgenders starting coming out.

I don't think that just because something is popular means that it is okay. I don't think that because something has been happening for a long time it is okay. The reason why I am so shocked is because I didn't grow up in the 70's ( I was born much later) and I generally grew up in a household where men do not wear make-up so the idea of men wearing make-up is shocking to me and I'm trying to understand if this is something that is biblically unsound and should be pointed out to younger generations who equally question it.

[revolutionist90]

I'm really confused with the answers here.

Yes the guy should be prayed for and I am not condemning the guy with my opinions. I generally am saying his actions are wrong. I don't think I am judging the guy because I have an opinion. Actually a judgement is synonymous with opinions. If you look up the definition of a judgement it is an opinion. I think some just believe there is nothing wrong with a man wearing make-up so thus there should not be a disapproved opinion since most of the time an opinion of disapproval is seen as judgement. I understand that we are called to see the soul but are we not suppose to see the sin also and refrain from doing said sin? I'm really confused here at some of the comments but I think the term effeminate along with how a person should dress is just debatable from what I am seeing on previous posts. I am not condeming the man's soul but I do believe his actions (wearing make-up and then becoming angry) are shocking and not something that I would encourage male youth to support.

Edited April 10, 2013 by revolutionist90

[Guest man]

The point is that the guy is dressing up like a woman

What exactly was he wearing? Was he wearing a dress and heels?

[revolutionist90]

The point is that the guy is dressing up like a woman

What exactly was he wearing? Was he wearing a dress and heels?

He was wearing a wal-mart uniform so that means no dress and heals (like all other wal-mart employees including women) but he did have on...well...something that would make him appear to have breast. Also do you think that there are effeminate men (not men who look like women biologically but choose to wear the norms of another gender)?

[Guest man]

The point is that the guy is dressing up like a woman

What exactly was he wearing? Was he wearing a dress and heels?

He was wearing a wal-mart uniform so that means no dress and heals (like all other wal-mart employees including women) but he did have on...well...something that would make him appear to have breast.

Also do you think that there are effeminate men (not men who look like women biologically but choose to wear the norms of another gender)?

They're called cross-dressers........transvestites.

I don't believe that one can automatically be defined as an effeminate man just for wearing make-up.

You said the guy got upset when you called him a woman, so he obviously wasn't identifying himself with that gender.

We live in a strange world.

[OneLight]

I don't understand why this is so shocking to people. This has been happening for a long time. I can remember males in LA during the 70's wearing makeup. It became even more popular with the Goth look in men. After that, the transgenders starting coming out.

I don't think that just because something is popular means that it is okay. I don't think that because something has been happening for a long time it is okay. The reason why I am so shocked is because I didn't grow up in the 70's ( I was born much later) and I generally grew up in a household where men do not wear make-up so the idea of men wearing make-up is shocking to me and I'm trying to understand if this is something that is biblically unsound and should be pointed out to younger generations who equally question it.

I don't think this is OK either. All I was referring to was the popularity of men wearing makeup in this generation.