Are you still a Christian if...

[chloe_fantastic]

what about those who have unrepentant murder but still claim Christianity or even say they are murdering in the name of the Lord? There are those who do things in the name of Christianity that are horrible and wrong so do we claim they are not Christians or do we defend them somehow?

In regards to this question, the type of sin doesn't matter because what makes them not-a-Christian isn't the actions they take. It's the condition of their hearts. Their actions are just an outward reflection of the condition of their hearts.

[Guest man]

My question was in regards to Chris Broussard's comments about Jason Collins:

“Personally I don’t believe that you can live an openly homosexual lifestyle or an openly premarital sex between heterosexuals,” Broussard said. ”If you’re openly living that type of lifestyle, the Bible says you know them by their fruits, it says that’s a sin. If you’re openly living in unrepentant sin, whatever it may be, not just homosexuality, adultery, fornication, premarital sex between heterosexuals, whatever it may be. I think that’s walking in open rebellion to God and to Jesus Christ. I would not characterize that person as a Christian because I don’t think the Bible would characterize them as a Christian"

He does use the "know them by their fruits" but he also does state that he would not characterize a person as a Christian if they lived in unrepentant sexual immorality. And also what about those who have unrepentant murder but still claim Christianity or even say they are murdering in the name of the Lord? There are those who do things in the name of Christianity that are horrible and wrong so do we claim they are not Christians or do we defend them somehow?

Matthew 7

²¹ “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

²² Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’

²³ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

[revolutionist90]

what about those who have unrepentant murder but still claim Christianity or even say they are murdering in the name of the Lord? There are those who do things in the name of Christianity that are horrible and wrong so do we claim they are not Christians or do we defend them somehow?

In regards to this question, the type of sin doesn't matter because what makes them not-a-Christian isn't the actions they take. It's the condition of their hearts. Their actions are just an outward reflection of the condition of their hearts.

The point of the analogy is if the murderer is truly unrepentant. I understand their is not sin worse than the other but it does depend on if the person understands the sin and repents. If the person is unrepentant then their heart is also unrepentant. I have to respectfully disagree with your answer. If a murderer is killing innocent people and sees no wrong and is unrepentant to the bottom of their heart then I do not think they are a Christian. If a the murderer sees the error of his ways repents and works on changing then I think he/she is actually walking with God.

I just don't see how a person who murders, is unrepentant(thinks nothing wrong of the murder) and then calls themselves a Christian is actually still a Christian. I kind of think your missing the point of my examples, in which I am trying to understand if a person who is living in sin, unrepentant of their sin to the very core can still be called a Christian. I understand that we are not to judge but I think it is important to be able to differentiate between those who are culturally Christian and those who are actually Christians because their are many false prophets today.

I also don't understand what you mean by what is in a person's heart. If a person murderers an innocent, thinks nothing is wrong, and believes they have not sinned then is their not evil in their heart and are they not a Christian because to be a Christian you must humble yourself and repent to follow Christ?

[JTC]

I've been struggling with this question for 30 years. The real answer is we can never be sure where someone else stands with God. It can take all your life to defeat some sins, and some you may die with, having never defeated them. I think that may be where the scripture Tinky quoted comes in:

"If any man's work abide which he has built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire." (1 Corinthians 3:15)

But that's a dangerous verse, and certainly not one to base your life on. And I admit I have no real insight into that verse from God.

This question lead me to consider all the verses on judging. This is what I was lead to understand. We are to judge what is right or wrong, and if we don't know, some where in the Bible we can always find it. So as to avoid some confusion I say we are to evaluate all things as to whether they are of God or not. We are never to judge someone else, as to whether they are of God or not.

I find, as someone else said, that when I commit even a small sin, God is usually quick to chastise me. And even though I know that's a good sign, I don't like it.

I also remember reading some where in the NT that to him who knows a certain thing is a sin, it shall be counted as a sin. But to he who doesn't know it's a sin, it won't be held against him as a sin. Something like that. And I think this may be what's going to happen with homosexuals in the future, if Jesus doesn't come back first. In a few hundred years from now the knowledge that homosexuality is a sin may become lost, and those doing it won't know they are sinning. Maybe this is even true of some people already. Sexual sins are amongst the hardest to defeat. Because our whole society has become as sinful as it is, the answer for a lot of people is going to be abstinence. Because according to God the only sex that isn't sinful is between a married man and woman. And since divorce and remarriage is also usually a sin, but not always. We come back to abstinence. This is a hard teaching and it's taken me close to 30 years to accept it. But this is what God asks of us. I find it useful to constantly remind myself how short human life is, and how long eternally is. I also remind myself God is timeless, and we will be too, once this life ends.

[Guest man]

what about those who have unrepentant murder but still claim Christianity or even say they are murdering in the name of the Lord? There are those who do things in the name of Christianity that are horrible and wrong so do we claim they are not Christians or do we defend them somehow?

In regards to this question, the type of sin doesn't matter because what makes them not-a-Christian isn't the actions they take. It's the condition of their hearts. Their actions are just an outward reflection of the condition of their hearts.

The point of the analogy is if the murderer is truly unrepentant. I understand their is not sin worse than the other but it does depend on if the person understands the sin and repents. If the person is unrepentant then their heart is also unrepentant. I have to respectfully disagree with your answer. If a murderer is killing innocent people and sees no wrong and is unrepentant to the bottom of their heart then I do not think they are a Christian. If a the murderer sees the error of his ways repents and works on changing then I think he/she is actually walking with God.

I just don't see how a person who murders, is unrepentant(thinks nothing wrong of the murder) and then calls themselves a Christian is actually still a Christian. I kind of think your missing the point of my examples, in which I am trying to understand if a person who is living in sin, unrepentant of their sin to the very core can still be called a Christian. I understand that we are not to judge but I think it is important to be able to differentiate between those who are culturally Christian and those who are actually Christians because their are many false prophets today.

I also don't understand what you mean by what is in a person's heart. If a person murderers an innocent, thinks nothing is wrong, and believes they have not sinned then is their not evil in their heart and are they not a Christian because to be a Christian you must humble yourself and repent to follow Christ?

"For out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks"......Mathew 12:34

The contents of your heart is who you are. That's why God searches it. Everything we say, everything we do, every action, thought, word, comes from the heart. All of our motivations come from the heart. It is the center of our being. It's who we are.

.

[cuddles^.^]

Only God knows..

But I have to say, people will manifest whatever is actually in their hearts. The lost will not anguish over their sins.

hmm, what a wonderful response. "The lost will not anguish over their sins".

I wonder, if from God's perspective, there is no particular black or white, but rather, a huge spectrum of infinite grays in between, where he alone is able to determine where a person's exact location is on the spectrum and to judge them on that basis.

[Guest ninhao]

"For out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks"......Mathew 12:34

The contents of your heart is who you are. That's why God searches it. Everything we say, everything we do, every action, thought, word, comes from the heart. All of our motivations come from the heart. It is the center of our being. It's who we are.

.

Hear hear !

[revolutionist90]

what about those who have unrepentant murder but still claim Christianity or even say they are murdering in the name of the Lord? There are those who do things in the name of Christianity that are horrible and wrong so do we claim they are not Christians or do we defend them somehow?

In regards to this question, the type of sin doesn't matter because what makes them not-a-Christian isn't the actions they take. It's the condition of their hearts. Their actions are just an outward reflection of the condition of their hearts.

The point of the analogy is if the murderer is truly unrepentant. I understand their is not sin worse than the other but it does depend on if the person understands the sin and repents. If the person is unrepentant then their heart is also unrepentant. I have to respectfully disagree with your answer. If a murderer is killing innocent people and sees no wrong and is unrepentant to the bottom of their heart then I do not think they are a Christian. If a the murderer sees the error of his ways repents and works on changing then I think he/she is actually walking with God.

I just don't see how a person who murders, is unrepentant(thinks nothing wrong of the murder) and then calls themselves a Christian is actually still a Christian. I kind of think your missing the point of my examples, in which I am trying to understand if a person who is living in sin, unrepentant of their sin to the very core can still be called a Christian. I understand that we are not to judge but I think it is important to be able to differentiate between those who are culturally Christian and those who are actually Christians because their are many false prophets today.

I also don't understand what you mean by what is in a person's heart. If a person murderers an innocent, thinks nothing is wrong, and believes they have not sinned then is their not evil in their heart and are they not a Christian because to be a Christian you must humble yourself and repent to follow Christ?

"For out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks"......Mathew 12:34

The contents of your heart is who you are. That's why God searches it. Everything we say, everything we do, every action, thought, word, comes from the heart. All of our motivations come from the heart. It is the center of our being. It's who we are.

.

But that is why I am so confused. If a person is an unrepentant murderer, adulterer, pedophile or any other sin this type of evil must be in their heart thus I don't see why I should defend them as Christians if they are doing things that are very much not something Christians should do. If they changed their ways that is different but until they do then they are not really Christians.

I understand that we should not make poor judgments but when it is quite obvious what is happening we are called to say something about people who claim Christianity.

[Elhanan]

Are you still a Christian if you live in unrepentant sin? For example, lets say a person frequently commits homosexual/adultery/sexual immorality acts, they know it is wrong but yet they continue to do it by ignoring scripture. Are they still a christian? Also lets say a person reads scripture and uses it to justify their sexual immorality even if that is not the purpose. If they ignore those who explains the real meaning of the scripture and they ignore the claim are they still a Christian. Overall if a person is unrepentant in sin or even twists the scripture to accept their sin are they really a Christian?

-these examples are for a person who already claims they are Christian.

The gospel that was preached as depicted in Acts required repentance and maintaining a repentant lifestyle as seen in Acts 26:20 "but declared first to those in Damascus, then in Jerusalem and throughout all the region of Judea, and also to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds in keeping with their repentance." John the Revelator recorded God's warnings to his churches if they failed to repent:

Rev 2:5 "Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent, and do the works you did at first. If not, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place unless you repent."

Revelation 2:16 "Therefore repent. If not, I will come to you soon and war against them with the sword of my mouth."

God does not go to war against his own children; therefore those who refuse to repent despite engaging in known, habitual sin are no longer His.

[Guest man]

But that is why I am so confused. If a person is an unrepentant murderer, adulterer, pedophile or any other sin this type of evil must be in their heart thus I don't see why I should defend them as Christians if they are doing things that are very much not something Christians should do. If they changed their ways that is different but until they do then they are not really Christians.

I understand that we should not make poor judgments but when it is quite obvious what is happening we are called to say something about people who claim Christianity.

Why do you?