For those that believe in the Big Bang, what was there before?

[neil_]

This is for Robby, but I’d also like D-9’s and Gerald McGrew's input, as well as (why not) JDavis’ and others. Thanks.

 

 

Once was a group of people that started to study a certain something. And then developed a theory. And they looked happy and congratulated each other, and gave each other diplomas and other recognitions. But then they started to study things closely. And it turned out that that certain something doesn’t actually work according to the theory – until they multiply that particular something by 19. But it’s not only a simple multiplication. The reality is what it is. So they were forced to claim that the reality is itself multiplied by 19 – the only way their theory would work. So they did that and, yet again, they looked happy and congratulated each other, and gave each other new diplomas and new recognitions.

 

My question is this: is their theory scientific (can it be)?

 

Now on to another group of people. They went into a trip of understanding a particular something – or so they claimed. But they had to formulate, from the start, the basis for such a trip. They reviewed all the evidence available, and then concluded that they have no evidence for that basis (in other words, it’s only faith). But they nevertheless kept on with their (baseless) theory.

 

My question is the same: is their theory scientific (can it be)?

 

I’m waiting for a ‘yes’ or ‘no’ to both questions – and then you can expand if you want.

 

And it doesn’t matter what that “particular something” was in either case – not for now. I’m looking for a rule here, a criterion.

 

 

 

 

  When it comes to God (and really most things) there comes a point where faith has to take over 

 

 Fair enough, JDavis. Thanks. 

 

But that goes both ways, doesn’t it, Robby? In order to postulate an exclusively naturalistic view of the universe, you must have FAITH in nature, don’t you? And that’s not all: you must also have faith in yourself.

 

Because I still didn’t receive any answer to one of my old questions in this forum: why does any atheist think (s)he will EVER understand the universe (let alone now)? What’s the basis for such an expectation? Until you have an answer to that question, please don’t claim you DO understand the universe: because you have no basis for that. You must reasonably conclude if the universe is understandable in the first place.

[blessedpeter]

I'm certainly not saying he can't ask such questions in a place like this.  I'm just questioning the utility of doing so.

Because scientific sites run by philosophical naturalists will not answer such questions truthfully, but will instead point you in the direction of myriad ad hoc mathematical theories to explain what philosophical naturalism cannot explain. Also, it is not so much that they cannot face the truth. Rather, it is because science is so infected with bad philosophy that they simply cannot find the truth.

[kwikphilly]

Hi blessedpeter,

     I would just like to welcome you to Worthy,God bless you!By the way...good answer!

                                                                                    With love,in Christ-Kwik

[enoob57]

 

How could you know that without resorting to circular logic? I don't mean that to be snippy, but the underlying assumption seems circular to me.

 

God's Word 'IS' written Spiritually as you cannot enter into It's contents and end... you see it through natural eyes as a bounded book but It's

contents are one of spherical pronouncement in which unbounded light extinguishes all darkness and the children are given the freedom from 

darkness to Boundless Intimacy of God Himself in Perfect Light... 

 

Here is the reason you see as you do (the circular rational concept of God's Word)

John 3:19-21

 19 And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light,

because their deeds were evil.  20 For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest

his deeds should be exposed.  21 But he who does the truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be clearly seen,

that they have been done in God."

NKJV

This light is God's Son's Work in providing The Spiritual Life in Him and the communication of The New Testament that has told us clearly all 

that God 'IS' doing for eternity-> that which involves Us, the Spiritually born again,  and those not of Us, those who reject Him...

We, the born of God, accept that which we have been promised as though we have and live accordingly-> this is the faith God's Word formed

in us and it is a Spiritual Substance which allows us to relax to the knowledge of all that we have began in will be destroyed and all that will be

created new then is our life now! Now where is the circular reasoning in this? As we never return to that which is now but in truth you remain

here in your reasoning and the hope of reason in this place is ending...  Love, Steven

[Guest DRS81]

God the Father invented science for us to explore. He also created the human beings that turned into scientists later in life. The origin of life begins with the Father. There was no big bang despite what Hollywood says. Intelligent design is the only truth. Do the math. Blessings - DRS81

[enoob57]

God the Father invented science for us to explore. He also created the human beings that turned into scientists later in life. The origin of life begins with the Father. There was no big bang despite what Hollywood says. Intelligent design is the only truth. Do the math. Blessings - DRS81

Where's the join list to the statement... when we push past The Written limits of God we become something other than what was allowed by God... Love, Steven

[blessedpeter]

 

    God created a fruit that would make us mortal therefore wouldn't you agree that He did create mortality?   

 

No, I’m not sure I would phrase it like that. But I’m not sure how exactly I would phrase it. That has always puzzled me. If anyone has a pertinent answer, looking forward -  and thanks.

 

 

The answer is really simple: God did not create a fruit that would make us mortal. We were created with mortal bodies and were given the gift of immortality or the body. When Adam disobeyed God, he lost that gift not only for himself, but for all of his posterity.

[ollkiller]

So over a month and Neil has not provided proof in 2 words that the Big Bang is wrong. Guess we will just have to wait. Also I see gravity is wrong and the earth doesn't move. Now I cansee where people might not believe the Big Bang but to believe gravity is wrong and the earth doesn't move requires a tin foil hat and suspension if brain function. I'm preparing my tin foil hat now and will report back soon........

[blessedpeter]

So over a month and Neil has not provided proof in 2 words that the Big Bang is wrong. Guess we will just have to wait. Also I see gravity is wrong and the earth doesn't move. Now I cansee where people might not believe the Big Bang but to believe gravity is wrong and the earth doesn't move requires a tin foil hat and suspension if brain function. I'm preparing my tin foil hat now and will report back soon........

I have read from astrophysicists that either system, helio or geo, satisfies the laws of physics. It is just that the helio system has more evidence and is simpler mathematically.

[Guest]

Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path. Psalms 119:105

 

~

 

.... over a month and..... has not provided proof in 2 words that the Big Bang is wrong. Guess we will just have to wait. Also I see gravity is wrong and the earth doesn't move. Now I can see where people might not believe the Big Bang but to believe gravity is wrong and the earth doesn't move requires a tin foil hat and suspension of brain function. I'm preparing my tin foil hat now and will report back soon........

 

 

lol, You Go Bro~! And Two Thoughts

 

For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Romans 1:18-20

 

From The Big Book Of Jesus

 

Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created. Revelation 4:11

 

Now Doesn't That Just

 

O come, let us sing unto the LORD: let us make a joyful noise to the rock of our salvation. Psalms 95:1

 

Glue Your Feet To The Rock

 

And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ: Ephesians 3:9

 

~

 

The Reason

 

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day. Genesis 1:1-5

 

The Big

 

And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day. Genesis 1:6-8

 

Bang Is

 

And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so. And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good. And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so. And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good. And the evening and the morning were the third day. Genesis 1:9-13

 

Phooey

 

And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so. And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good. And the evening and the morning were the fourth day. Genesis 1:14-19

 

Is Set Within

 

And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven. And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good. And God blessed them, saying, Be fruitful, and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let fowl multiply in the earth. And the evening and the morning were the fifth day. Genesis 1:20-23

 

The Order Of

 

And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so. And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good. Genesis 1:24-25
 

The LORD's Creation

 

And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. Genesis 1:26-27

 

You See?

 

And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day. Genesis 1:6