MorningGlory Posted September 30, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1,022 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 39,193 Content Per Day: 6.10 Reputation: 9,977 Days Won: 78 Joined: 10/01/2006 Status: Offline Share Posted September 30, 2013 So 1 Corinthians 5 doesnt belong in the bible? Did I say that? At any time? Are you suggesting the church should kill this woman? Otherwise I don't see the connection. 1Co 5:11-13 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. (12) For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? (13) But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person. Sheba is correctly drawing from this passage where it says we are to judge within the Church. It doesn't say we should stone/kill them. 1Co 5:5-7 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. (6) Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump? (7) Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us: We can say this applies to someone caught in ongoing unrepentant sin I believe as the man who appeared to be in a sexual relationship with his father's wife. Sorry, I don't get it. Not in this instance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevenseas Posted September 30, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 30 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,373 Content Per Day: 0.76 Reputation: 683 Days Won: 22 Joined: 02/28/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted September 30, 2013 So 1 Corinthians 5 doesnt belong in the bible? Did I say that? At any time? Are you suggesting the church should kill this woman? Otherwise I don't see the connection. 1Co 5:11-13 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. (12) For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? (13) But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person. Sheba is correctly drawing from this passage where it says we are to judge within the Church. It doesn't say we should stone/kill them. 1Co 5:5-7 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. (6) Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump? (7) Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us: We can say this applies to someone caught in ongoing unrepentant sin I believe as the man who appeared to be in a sexual relationship with his father's wife. Yeah...I'm not sure why people will say things like 'don't you sin too" as if it were some kind of club wherein all the rules do not apply. There are rules people. There are rules. I have not read where anyone suggested the woman is beyond help or beyond repentance, yet, for some odd reason, those things seem to be suggested. Puzzling. Scripture is very clear on what to do in an instance of a person who lives as though sin were of no consequence. YET...sin separates us from God. Knowing what the Word says and doing it are two different things. No action on the part of the one who says they believe cheapens the grace of God and creates the perception that sin is well, just another bad habit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alphaparticle Posted September 30, 2013 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 48 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,363 Content Per Day: 0.35 Reputation: 403 Days Won: 5 Joined: 08/01/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted September 30, 2013 It isnt up to you or your wife to convict her, it is up to God, since she claims to be his child. That is why it is not up to us to judge...and by even thinking that maybe she isn't saved because she has divorces and slept with other men...well, that is jusdging her salvation...which is even worse than judging an action It is however up to believers to admonish and remind her of how she should be living if she is a Christian. Not harass her, but to let her know she is in the wrong and what God expects. As for judging, 1 corinthians 5 says we are to judge within the church. She is in continual sin. One day, two thousand years ago, Jesus told the crowd 'Let he who is without sin cast the first stone'. We always have to remember this; unless we are free of sin ourselves we can't condemn or judge others and THAT comes from the Lord Himself.. We all tend to do it but we shouldn't. This woman should be lifted up in prayer but not judged So 1 Corinthians 5 doesnt belong in the bible? I agree, I think that fits well here, not necessarily that the woman in question needs to be 'put out' of the church, but, there is clear precedence here for confronting people. I don't think it has to be, be mean and nasty or just pat her on the head, how about telling her she's doing wrong with concern and respect? Surely she needs to hear from others that what she is doing is wrong, and she's clearly not shy about sharing these matters, so that she realizes others don't think it's okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porque77 Posted October 1, 2013 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 33 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/01/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted October 1, 2013 A friend of my wife comes from a Christian home with both her mother and sister being ministers. This lady claims she has been saved and says she has accepted Jesus as her personal savior. However, her lifestyle does not live up to her being a good Christian. She has been divorced for about one year and since that time has had sex with numerous men often after their first date. She recently visited us and the discussion got around to her personal life. She took the position that her "being saved" has wiped out all her past and her future sins and that she can continue to lead the life she is living with immunity. It's sort of like getting a perpetual get out of jail card. I cited to her two verses. The first was in Acts 3:19: "Repent then, and turn to God, so that your sins may be wiped out...." I then questioned if she truly repented if she willingly commits the same sin over and over again. The second section is contained in John Chapter 8 where Jesus in verse 11 tells the woman to "Go now and leave your life of sin." What do you folks think about persons such as this lady who claim to be Christians and say they are saved but continue to lead a life of sin and how would you answer them? Hello conservator. This is a good topic to ponder. Things about the Law of God and sin, it is sometimes complicated. I hope that together we reach good conclusions. I believe that mercy must always be present in the lives of Christians, because what God wants is mercy. God is merciful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conservator Posted October 1, 2013 Group: Members Followers: 2 Topic Count: 4 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 29 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 37 Days Won: 0 Joined: 09/23/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/20/1942 Author Share Posted October 1, 2013 Reading the Bible today I came across Matthew 18: 15-17: 15 “If your brother or sister sins, go and point out their fault, just between the two of you. If they listen to you, you have won them over. 16 But if they will not listen, take one or two others along, so that ‘every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.’ 17 If they still refuse to listen, tell it to the church; and if they refuse to listen even to the church, treat them as you would a pagan or a tax collector." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nikki1 Posted October 1, 2013 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 98 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,260 Content Per Day: 0.23 Reputation: 55 Days Won: 0 Joined: 06/29/2009 Status: Offline Share Posted October 1, 2013 God does not wink at or overlook repeated sinning. His word confirms this fact. It is better to follow what scripture teaches on this and all matters despite what some think or preach. From Ezekiel 18, the prophet Ezekiel tells us "But when the righeous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned; in his trespass that he hath tresspassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die." vs. 24 And in vs. 26, the prophet Ezekiel tells us "When a righteous man turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and dieth in them; for his iniquity that he hath done shall he die." There are those who will say but this is the "Old Testament", which Jesus Himself fulfilled; but read on in the New Testament, Jesus Himself tells us in Luke's Gospel Ch. 9 vs. 62 "No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God" Basically, Jesus is saying the same thing the prophet Ezekiel tells us only in a different way. The writer of Hebrews tells us the same thing but worded differently in Hebrews 10:26-32 "For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins. But a certain fearful looking for ofjujdgment and firey indignation, which shall devourthe adversaries. He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how much sorer punishment, sujppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of Grace?" For we know him that hath said, Vengence belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people. It is a fearful thing to fallinto the hands of the living God. But call to remembrance the former days in which, after ye were illuminated, ye endured a great fight of afflictions... Note all of the above scriptures are speaking of person who calls himself "saved" or "have accepted Jesus"...hmmm... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted October 1, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted October 1, 2013 (edited) God does not wink at or overlook repeated sinning. His word confirms this fact. It is better to follow what scripture teaches on this and all matters despite what some think or preach. From Ezekiel 18, the prophet Ezekiel tells us "But when the righeous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned; in his trespass that he hath tresspassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die." vs. 24 And in vs. 26, the prophet Ezekiel tells us "When a righteous man turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and dieth in them; for his iniquity that he hath done shall he die." There are those who will say but this is the "Old Testament", which Jesus Himself fulfilled; but read on in the New Testament, Jesus Himself tells us in Luke's Gospel Ch. 9 vs. 62 "No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God" Basically, Jesus is saying the same thing the prophet Ezekiel tells us only in a different way. The writer of Hebrews tells us the same thing but worded differently in Hebrews 10:26-32 "For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins. But a certain fearful looking for ofjujdgment and firey indignation, which shall devourthe adversaries. He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how much sorer punishment, sujppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of Grace?" For we know him that hath said, Vengence belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people. It is a fearful thing to fallinto the hands of the living God. But call to remembrance the former days in which, after ye were illuminated, ye endured a great fight of afflictions... Note all of the above scriptures are speaking of person who calls himself "saved" or "have accepted Jesus"...hmmm... It seems here you are equating normal Christian who have the typical struggles in their walk with what God calls reprobates...people who have not had a regenerate spirit in them. It seems too you also are equating the Gospel with the way God dealt with people under the Law... Which is not the same in my opinion. Edited October 7, 2013 by GoldenEagle Edits in red Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micheal Westin Posted October 1, 2013 Group: Removed from Forums for Breaking Terms of Service Followers: 1 Topic Count: 13 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 616 Content Per Day: 0.14 Reputation: 96 Days Won: 3 Joined: 03/07/2012 Status: Offline Share Posted October 1, 2013 Actually according to the bible if this woman professes to be in Christ yet lives in sexual immorality and you know it, your not supposed to even eat with her 1 Corinthians 5:9-11 but the church of today is so into toleration and acceptance that I don't think there even exist a sin that you couldn't live in and still be allowed to be apart of the church, its seeker friendly on steroids, its what the church thinks is a better way than what the apostle Paul taught in keeping the leaven out of the church Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwikphilly Posted October 1, 2013 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 96 Topic Count: 307 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 18,138 Content Per Day: 4.62 Reputation: 27,819 Days Won: 327 Joined: 08/03/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted October 1, 2013 Blessings conservator and Worthy family! What I would say is we are all a process of repentance....only God knows the heart and she is accountable for her salvation,it is between her and the Lord... I know we can say that the scriptures tell us that we know a tree by the fruit it bears and the Lord did say ,"if you love Me you will follow My commandments "but I just cannot pass judgement on someone like this gal because I was her...... For me I have testified many times here that though I loved Jesus and was saved I did not have a wham bam instantaneous transformation...it was a very slow process as being a babe in Christ I had many reservations and was not fully committed to Christ because I resisted those promptings of the Holy Spirit...my heart was convicted but my mind was resistant....I found every excuse under the sun to live in the world(the past ,present & future sin forgiven was a favorite),carefully looking up an appropriate Scripture to justify my lifestyle......so how could I ever pass judgement on someone who is just another sinner like me? Some mature rapidly,some slowly....some never benefit from having the personal relationship with Jesus that they can have and have something they harbor and are not so quick to forsake.......I just pray they have that revelation from the Holy Spirit and grow in Christ while the blood still flows in their veins and get to experience the abundant life that is available to them and the freedom in Christ Jesus that is beyond words,and oh...all the gifts He has to give......praise Jesus!She so needs our prayers..... With love,in Christ-Kwik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floatingaxe Posted October 1, 2013 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 62 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 9,613 Content Per Day: 1.45 Reputation: 656 Days Won: 9 Joined: 03/11/2006 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1952 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Blessings conservator and Worthy family! What I would say is we are all a process of repentance....only God knows the heart and she is accountable for her salvation,it is between her and the Lord... I know we can say that the scriptures tell us that we know a tree by the fruit it bears and the Lord did say ,"if you love Me you will follow My commandments "but I just cannot pass judgement on someone like this gal because I was her...... For me I have testified many times here that though I loved Jesus and was saved I did not have a wham bam instantaneous transformation...it was a very slow process as being a babe in Christ I had many reservations and was not fully committed to Christ because I resisted those promptings of the Holy Spirit...my heart was convicted but my mind was resistant....I found every excuse under the sun to live in the world(the past ,present & future sin forgiven was a favorite),carefully looking up an appropriate Scripture to justify my lifestyle......so how could I ever pass judgement on someone who is just another sinner like me? Some mature rapidly,some slowly....some never benefit from having the personal relationship with Jesus that they can have and have something they harbor and are not so quick to forsake.......I just pray they have that revelation from the Holy Spirit and grow in Christ while the blood still flows in their veins and get to experience the abundant life that is available to them and the freedom in Christ Jesus that is beyond words,and oh...all the gifts He has to give......praise Jesus!She so needs our prayers..... With love,in Christ-Kwik You speak with the wisdom of God and His word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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