Where is the true Law of God?

[Porque77]

There are multiple covenants in the bible. The covenant given to Adam was different then the covenant given to Noah, or the covenant given to the children of Israel thru Moses, and the covenant given thru Jesus. Each covenant had certain parameters, some of which are called laws. The New Covenant thru Jesus is not the same covenant as the covenant by God thru Moses.

 

Hello Qnts2. I appreciate your response. And I see that you believe that God gives covenants different at different times: the covenant of Adam, Noah, Moses, Jesus. But the fact is that the prophets tell us that the Covenant of God is one and forever:

" Faithful are all His commandments , They stand fast for ever and ever , done in truth and uprightness. Sent redemption to his people, for ever he has commanded his covenant " (Psalm 111.7-9 )

 

" From your decrees I have known for some time that has established forever " (Psalm 119 ( 118 ) , 152) .

 

Now, this is the issue I have. The Mosaic covenant was given by God thru Moses. These were laws given by God. You seem to be calling the laws given by God as bad, but the laws given by God are good.

Perhaps you did not understand me. What I'm saying is that the Law of God given by Jesus Christ is not equal to the laws of the Old Testament, as these laws mandate that men make wars and kill the enemies. They also allow men are slaves of other men.

The two laws are contrary, and I believe that God does not contradict and not give cruel laws to kill people.

 

You are not obligated to the Mosaic covenant unless you are a child of Israel

This is another thing I do not understand: that there are two peoples of God to follow two different laws, as the Scripture tells us that there is only one people of God and that is the Christian people:

 

²⁶For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

 ²⁷For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

 ²⁸There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

 ²⁹And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.   (Gálatas 3)

 

Thanks for your answers in which we discover that in the scriptures there are difficult points.

Edited October 3, 2013 by Porque77

[Porque77]

I know that's about as clear as mud but it's a starting point. Understanding what the old and new covenants are will give you a better understanding of the old and new testament laws. They are the same laws, but the way they are put into practice is different.

 

 

I see that the laws are not the same, because "an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth" is not the same as turning the other cheek to those who hurt us.

 

Some religions say that God gave to men different covenants in different times, but I do not see Jesus say that, because when Jesus gives us the Law, we read:

 

"All things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you , do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets." ( Matthew 7:12 )

 

I think this is the Law that God gave to men from the beginning. And this is the law forever.   God does not contradict.

 

Thanks, my friend.

[Micheal Westin]

Mark 12

28 Then one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, perceiving that He had answered them well, asked Him, "Which is the first commandment of all?"

 

 

29 Jesus answered him, "The first of all the commandments is: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one. 

30 And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength.' This is the first commandment. 

 

31 And the second, like it, is this: 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' There is no other commandment greater than these."

good post! this is all the law one needs to keep under the new covenant, in another scripture it says ALL the law falls under these two laws

[Micheal Westin]

 

I know that's about as clear as mud but it's a starting point. Understanding what the old and new covenants are will give you a better understanding of the old and new testament laws. They are the same laws, but the way they are put into practice is different.

 

 

I see that the laws are not the same, because "an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth" is not the same as turning the other cheek to those who hurt us.

 

Some religions say that God gave to men different covenants in different times, but I do not see Jesus say that, because when Jesus gives us the Law, we read:

 

"All things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you , do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets." ( Matthew 7:12 )

 

I think this is the Law that God gave to men from the beginning. And this is the law forever.   God does not contradict.

 

Thanks, my friend.

 

If you look at the words of the Prophets whom you hold dearly, you will see all the prophets spoke of a future day when God would make a new covenant, and it would be different from the old covenant, God never changes but when He makes something new, It very well may be different.

we are told He will make a new heaven and a new earth, will He be required to make them just like the old earth and old heaven, or will He be allowed to make them different in a better way

[Qnts2]

 

There are multiple covenants in the bible. The covenant given to Adam was different then the covenant given to Noah, or the covenant given to the children of Israel thru Moses, and the covenant given thru Jesus. Each covenant had certain parameters, some of which are called laws. The New Covenant thru Jesus is not the same covenant as the covenant by God thru Moses.

 

Hello Qnts2. I appreciate your response. And I see that you believe that God gives covenants different at different times: the covenant of Adam, Noah, Moses, Jesus. But the fact is that the prophets tell us that the Covenant of God is one and forever:

" Faithful are all His commandments , They stand fast for ever and ever , done in truth and uprightness. Sent redemption to his people, for ever he has commanded his covenant " (Psalm 111.7-9 )

 

" From your decrees I have known for some time that has established forever " (Psalm 119 ( 118 ) , 152) .

 

Now, this is the issue I have. The Mosaic covenant was given by God thru Moses. These were laws given by God. You seem to be calling the laws given by God as bad, but the laws given by God are good.

Perhaps you did not understand me. What I'm saying is that the Law of God given by Jesus Christ is not equal to the laws of the Old Testament, as these laws mandate that men make wars and kill the enemies. They also allow men are slaves of other men.

The two laws are contrary, and I believe that God does not contradict and not give cruel laws to kill people.

 

You are not obligated to the Mosaic covenant unless you are a child of Israel

This is another thing I do not understand: that there are two peoples of God to follow two different laws, as the Scripture tells us that there is only one people of God and that is the Christian people:

 

²⁶For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

 ²⁷For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

 ²⁸There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

 ²⁹And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.   (Gálatas 3)

 

Thanks for your answers in which we discover that in the scriptures there are difficult points.

 

So, do you believe that God did not give the Mosaic covenant and law?

[SDAinFLA]

To answer the original question...the Law of God that existed in the Old Testament, is the same Law that exists in the New Testatment.

Remember, a covenant is simply an agreeement. The Old Covenant was created after God gave Israel the 10 Commandments, Statues and Judgements.

And he took the book of the covenant, and read in the audience of the people: and they said, All that the LORD hath said will we do, and be obedient. And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words. Ex 24:7-8

 

The new covenant, was not a change in the law, but rather a change in the power to keep that law through faith in Christ. Notice what Hebrews says -

For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people...For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more. Heb 8:10,12

Notice the new covenant is not a new law, but it's placing the SAME law in your heart.

 

The 10 Commandments is still the Law of God. It's not a different law in the New Testament from the Old Testament.

Remember what Jesus response was when he was asked what's the greatest commandment - "Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself." Matt 22:37,39

Jesus was not providing new light, but rather he was quoting the same light that they already had. Deut 6:5 says - "And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might."  Lev 19:18 says - "Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD."

 

If you take an even closer look at these two commandments (love God and love neighbor) they are summarizations of what the 10 Commandments is telling us.

The first 4 Commandments 1) Worship God 2) No Idol worship 3)Don't use God's name in vain 4) Sabbath - Summarize the first principle which is Love God

The last 6 Commandments 5) Honor Parents 6) No Killing 7) No adultery 8) No stealing 9) No lying 10) No lusting - Summarize the secont principle which is Love to Neighbor.

 

The statues and judgements are not all done away but they were specifics that helped the Jews understand how to keep the 10 Commandments. The letter of these laws may change with the times, but the spirit of these laws are still intact.

 

So what was done away? The ceremonial laws relating to the death of Christ. All sacrifices, all commandments contained in ordinances are done away along with the penalty.

Edited October 4, 2013 by SDAinFLA

[Porque77]

 

 

I see that the laws are not the same, because "an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth" is not the same as turning the other cheek to those who hurt us.

 

Some religions say that God gave to men different covenants in different times, but I do not see Jesus say that, because when Jesus gives us the Law, we read:

 

"All things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you , do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets." (Matthew 7:12)

 

I think this is the Law that God gave to men from the beginning. And this is the law forever.   God does not contradict.

 

Thanks, my friend.

 

If you look at the words of the Prophets whom you hold dearly, you will see all the prophets spoke of a future day when God would make a new covenant, and it would be different from the old covenant, God never changes but when He makes something new, It very well may be different.

 

Hello Michael . I understand what you say, but Jesus not tells us that the Law of the New Covenant is different from the law that God had given from the beginning. Only teaches us that the Law of God is the Law which He Himself taught in the Gospel:

 

"All things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you , do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets." (Matthew 7:12)

Moreover, Jesus abolished many commandments of the Old Testament , and I think that He abolished because they not were commandments of God but precepts of men . Jesus tells us that He did not come to abolish the Law (God's Law) , but abolished many commandments of the Old Testament , as we see in Matthew 5:21-48 and other parts of the Gospel . So abolished them because they were not commandments of God.

 

we are told He will make a new heaven and a new earth, will He be required to make them just like the old earth and old heaven, or will He be allowed to make them different in a better way

 

 

Jesus Christ is God , and God tells us that He will make a new earth and a new heaven , but also tells us that the Law is forever :

 

" Faithful are all His commandments , They stand fast for ever and ever , done in truth and uprightness. Sent redemption to his people, for ever he has commanded his covenant " (Psalm 111.7-9 )

 

" From your decrees I have known for some time that has established forever " (Psalm 119 ( 118 ) , 152) .

If God said His commandments are forever , how is that in the scriptures there are two different laws ? This is my concern. I await your answers.

Edited October 4, 2013 by Porque77

[Fez]

Love, Agape Love.

 

That's all.

 

It is a command, not a request.

 

Get that right and all else pales.

[Porque77]

So, do you believe that God did not give the Mosaic covenant and law?

 

 

Hello, Qnts2.  The Mosaic covenant and law were given by God, but after the years and centuries, the prophets tell us that the scribes changed the law of God. So tell us the prophets:

 

"Woe to those who give wicked laws and scribes who write tyrannical prescriptions to set aside the poor and violate the rights of the underdog of my people, to rob widows and orphans" (Isaiah 10.1 -2)

"And the land is defiled under its inhabitants, because they have transgressed the laws, changed the commandments, broken the everlasting covenant" (Isaiah 24:5-6).

"He says, therefore, the Lord : Because this people draw near me with their mouth, and honor me with their lips, but their heart is far from Me, and their fear of me is a commandment of men which have been taught" (Isaiah 29.13).

And Jesus Christ, remembering the words of the prophet Isaiah, also told the scribes and Pharisees who were teaching the commandments of men :

"Hypocrites, well did Isaiah prophesy of you, saying,

This people honors me with their lips;

But their heart is far from me.

But in vain they do worship me,

Teaching for doctrines commandments of men" (Matthew 15.7-9

 

Dear friend, this is what I think happened, what the prophets tell us: that God's law was changed by the scribes. This is for what the Old Testament Law is direrente to the commandments of Jesus Christ.

 

[Porque77]

To answer the original question...the Law of God that existed in the Old Testament, is the same Law that exists in the New Testatment........

..........The statues and judgements are not all done away but they were specifics that helped the Jews understand how to keep the 10 Commandments. The letter of these laws may change with the times, but the spirit of these laws are still intact.

 

So what was done away? The ceremonial laws relating to the death of Christ. All sacrifices, all commandments contained in ordinances are done away along with the penalty.

 

I see that the laws are not the same, because "an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth" is not the same as turning the other cheek to those who hurt us.

 

Some religions say that God gave to men different covenants in different times, but I do not see Jesus say that, because when Jesus gives us the Law, we read:

 

"All things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you , do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets." ( Matthew 7:12 )

 

I think this is the Law that God gave to men from the beginning. And this is the law forever.   God does not contradict.

 

Thanks, my friend.