Hungry for God, not sermons nor day-old manna

[Guest Butero]

I have a few different thoughts about this:

 

1) The "mystic" person who originally wrote this has been propagating an anti-church message all over facebook. I have a sister who used to be a strong believer but has gone through a lot of changes in her life and and is now struggling - she called me last week all excited to tell me that she was now calling herself a Christian mystic because she found a "minister" on FB who "makes a lot of sense." This person uses general truths about the church's weakened state to slowly introduce a different teaching.

 

2) The American church is weak after so many years of people being screamed at that they're not allowed to "judge." I've had private discussions with pastors who admitted they are under pressure from various stakeholders to keep the attendance up, and the best way to do that is to preach very bland and basic messages. You confront hypocrisy or blatant sin from one of the church's most valuable/popular members, and they just leave the church. You do that enough times, and the wealthy people are gone, so there is no money for extravagant youth programs, and then all the kids leave. Even when a pastor desperately wants to reform their church, they are often outvoted/outranked/outflanked to protect the status quo.

 

3) The symptoms we see of weak churches are happening precisely because no one has respect for a church. It's the attitude of "the customer is always right" applied to our very theology. People are not loyal to a church, they are loyal to themselves, and as soon as they get tired of a church they will leave it. No one calls them out because, hey, what are you gonna do, JUDGE another person?

 

IMO This mystic person needs to be taken with a big heap of salt. It can very quickly lead people to an elitist mindset that they don't have to take churches seriously - and that will just hasten the downfall even more.

You made excellent points about what is going on in the church.  I have seen the same things you have.  Think about what this person is comparing sermons to.  They aren't comparing them to stale bread, but day old manna.  Day old manna stunk and was full of worms.  That is some word picture they are painting of sermons. 

 

I have a lot of problems with the modern church, and they are in agreement with the things you said, but this message was overly critical.

[Dak]

...but this message was overly critical.

I agree. And it's also a wolf in a sheep's clothing, specially designed for the disillusioned...

We must really be vigilant for these false prophets!

[Guest]

Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence. John 18:36

 

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This person uses general truths about the church's weakened state to slowly introduce a different teaching.... The symptoms we see of weak churches are happening precisely because no one has respect for a church. It's the attitude of "the customer is always right" applied to our very theology. People are not loyal to a church.... an elitist mindset that they don't have to take churches seriously - and that will just hasten the downfall even more.

 

~

 

There

 

And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. Matthew 16:18

 

Is No Thing

 

Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth. Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter. Romans 8:33-36
 

Weak About The Church

 

Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Romans 8:37-39

 

Nor About It's

 

See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand. For I lift up my hand to heaven, and say, I live for ever.

 

If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me. I will make mine arrows drunk with blood, and my sword shall devour flesh; and that with the blood of the slain and of the captives, from the beginning of revenges upon the enemy.

 

Rejoice, O ye nations, with his people: for he will avenge the blood of his servants, and will render vengeance to his adversaries, and will be merciful unto his land, and to his people. Deuteronomy 32:39-43

 

Head

 

And the God of peace shall bruise Satan under your feet shortly. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. Amen. Romans 16:20

 

~

 

Be Blessed

 

The LORD bless thee, and keep thee:
The LORD make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee:
The LORD lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.
 

And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them. Numbers 6:24-27

 

Beloved Of The KING

 

For thus saith the high and lofty One that inhabiteth eternity, whose name is Holy; I dwell in the high and holy place, with him also that is of a contrite and humble spirit, to revive the spirit of the humble, and to revive the heart of the contrite ones. Isaiah 57:15

 

Love, Your Brother Joe

[oak]

 

Pray to Him and seek Him (you cannot know one you do not spend time with)...but without knowing the word, one could be confused as to the voice they are following....

 

And then we have churches that talk about God a lot, but never lead you towards encountering God.

 

Religious form is good if there is a heart and soul to it; but what too many people encounter with Christianity is a soul-less form.

 

Why can someone not advocate building up the religious heart and soul without everyone treating this as an attack on the form?

 

No, this is pointing out that the heart and soul need to define the body, not the form.

 

It depends who is doing the defining and why? Considering previous posts by you as well as this one, if I just focus on a real, true, searching for Christ, this is a beautiful thought as well as need to have. However it should stop there. In promoting a way to act - and I have to agree with most of the sentiments I read - the person cornered himself. Perhaps there is a little irony here; a man with his "program" attacking other "'men's programs." Why does this mystic, have to name people, who have found an unquenchable treasure in Christ, as being "peculiar?" Are they a rebellious people?  

 

Now as I said, in another post to you, if you feel something is getting in the way of Christ, by all means leave it and keep searching. I would love some of my friends who have been caught up by "prosperity teachers" to see through them and then leave them. Now, maybe you're thinking that I am on the same page as this mystic. Not at all because I don't think any man can easily characterize people that have the Thirst. It could be a little old lady that teaches Sunday school and suffers a pastor or a priest that is a boring speaker and can't make sense of drug addicts.

 

In the final analysis, I understand what you're saying and I hope you don't see my writing as an attack. I just don't feel the mystic has this quality: "[Love] does not insist on its own way..." 1 Cor. 13:5 And, when we want to find a way we have to seek Christ.

 

Oak