Salty Posted July 21, 2014 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,665 Content Per Day: 0.46 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/11/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted July 21, 2014 Salty, You wrote, "In that time everyone... absolutely everyone... will KNOW... Christ Jesus is Lord." I am not sure exactly what you mean. It is written that "every knee will bow," is that what you mean - that some will really KNOW Him as in being a child of God, but all the rest will know Him as head knowledge - they will know who He is? I understand you think this second resurrection is only inferred. I don't think that is what John is telling us at all. I don't think anyone who has been in hell will ever get a chance later to accept Jesus. They are in hell because that is the place they chose: God sends no one to hell. Your theory is complete myth. Heb. 9 27 And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment I know "ultimate salvation" is being preached as truth, when it is a lie from the pit. But then, so is postrib being preached, and it came from the same place. LAMAD It can be found in the OT prophets. It's presented in the sense that you won't have to ask your neighbor if they've heard of The LORD, everyone from the least to the greatest will know Him in that time. For the wicked of course it will be in the bowing sense, and not in the "first resurrection" sense. All will recognize Christ Jesus as Lord of lords, and King of kings in that time. Peter said God is longsuffering, not wishing for anyone to perish, but for all to come to repentance. Good thing judgment unto condemnation belongs to Christ and not us, because I don't think any man could be as fair as our Heavenly Father and His Son. As for your idea that none in hell can ever be brought out by Christ, read about the "spirits in prison" in 1 Pet.3 & 4, compared with Isaiah 42:7. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamlamad Posted July 21, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,272 Content Per Day: 2.07 Reputation: 689 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/09/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted July 21, 2014 Salty, You wrote, "In that time everyone... absolutely everyone... will KNOW... Christ Jesus is Lord." I am not sure exactly what you mean. It is written that "every knee will bow," is that what you mean - that some will really KNOW Him as in being a child of God, but all the rest will know Him as head knowledge - they will know who He is? I understand you think this second resurrection is only inferred. I don't think that is what John is telling us at all. I don't think anyone who has been in hell will ever get a chance later to accept Jesus. They are in hell because that is the place they chose: God sends no one to hell. Your theory is complete myth. Heb. 9 27 And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment I know "ultimate salvation" is being preached as truth, when it is a lie from the pit. But then, so is postrib being preached, and it came from the same place. LAMAD It can be found in the OT prophets. It's presented in the sense that you won't have to ask your neighbor if they've heard of The LORD, everyone from the least to the greatest will know Him in that time. For the wicked of course it will be in the bowing sense, and not in the "first resurrection" sense. All will recognize Christ Jesus as Lord of lords, and King of kings in that time. Peter said God is longsuffering, not wishing for anyone to perish, but for all to come to repentance. Good thing judgment unto condemnation belongs to Christ and not us, because I don't think any man could be as fair as our Heavenly Father and His Son. As for your idea that none in hell can ever be brought out by Christ, read about the "spirits in prison" in 1 Pet.3 & 4, compared with Isaiah 42:7. If course, Jesus Himself escaped from hell, of course Lazarus, and as you mentioned, all those in the paradise side of hell were taken to planet heaven when Jesus rose from the dead. However, there was a great gulf fixed between paradise and the fire side of hell. Not until the final resurrection after the 1000 years will any human escape from this fire side of hell. LAMAD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneLight Posted July 21, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 22 Topic Count: 1,294 Topics Per Day: 0.21 Content Count: 31,762 Content Per Day: 5.22 Reputation: 9,763 Days Won: 115 Joined: 09/14/2007 Status: Offline Share Posted July 21, 2014 Now a break to remind everyone of the following: Abuse of other posters is not allowed. This includes, but is not limited to, name calling, insulting, harassing, threatening or in any way invading the privacy of another poster. We also strongly discourage giving out personal information such as email addresses, physical addresses and phone numbers on the public boards. Any information given out in private is at your own discretion and risk. (Eph. 4: 29) Debate the subject, not the person. It is possible to disagree about a doctrine or subject under discussion without insulting the person with whom you are debating. Also remember that the fact that a person disagrees with you does not mean they are attacking you as a person. Respect each other in the love of God! This is the main reason that threads get stopped, shut down, and even deleted! Users that cannot respect others will be banned. (Lev. 19:18) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENOCH2010 Posted July 21, 2014 Group: Senior Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 907 Content Per Day: 0.20 Reputation: 382 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/03/2011 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/07/1866 Share Posted July 21, 2014 planet heaven ????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Posted July 22, 2014 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,665 Content Per Day: 0.46 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/11/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted July 22, 2014 Salty, You wrote, "In that time everyone... absolutely everyone... will KNOW... Christ Jesus is Lord." I am not sure exactly what you mean. It is written that "every knee will bow," is that what you mean - that some will really KNOW Him as in being a child of God, but all the rest will know Him as head knowledge - they will know who He is? I understand you think this second resurrection is only inferred. I don't think that is what John is telling us at all. I don't think anyone who has been in hell will ever get a chance later to accept Jesus. They are in hell because that is the place they chose: God sends no one to hell. Your theory is complete myth. Heb. 9 27 And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment I know "ultimate salvation" is being preached as truth, when it is a lie from the pit. But then, so is postrib being preached, and it came from the same place. LAMAD It can be found in the OT prophets. It's presented in the sense that you won't have to ask your neighbor if they've heard of The LORD, everyone from the least to the greatest will know Him in that time. For the wicked of course it will be in the bowing sense, and not in the "first resurrection" sense. All will recognize Christ Jesus as Lord of lords, and King of kings in that time. Peter said God is longsuffering, not wishing for anyone to perish, but for all to come to repentance. Good thing judgment unto condemnation belongs to Christ and not us, because I don't think any man could be as fair as our Heavenly Father and His Son. As for your idea that none in hell can ever be brought out by Christ, read about the "spirits in prison" in 1 Pet.3 & 4, compared with Isaiah 42:7. If course, Jesus Himself escaped from hell, of course Lazarus, and as you mentioned, all those in the paradise side of hell were taken to planet heaven when Jesus rose from the dead. However, there was a great gulf fixed between paradise and the fire side of hell. Not until the final resurrection after the 1000 years will any human escape from this fire side of hell. LAMAD Then I guess you missed this prophecy... Rev.6:8 8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth. And most likely this also... Rev.22:14-15 14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. 15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamlamad Posted July 22, 2014 Group: Royal Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 23 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 8,272 Content Per Day: 2.07 Reputation: 689 Days Won: 4 Joined: 06/09/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted July 22, 2014 planet heaven ????? Many have been taken from earth to heaven, and as they approached heaven, they SAW it as a planet. One man was taken in a flying machine of some kind, like a cable car without the cable. An angel was the pilot. They circled the planet before they landed. He saw mountains, rivers, forests, fields, etc. Many have said they saw the earth getting smaller and smaller, they passed the moon, then the sun and then left our solar system, and flew past stars at a great speed. Heaven is a long ways away. These are our brothers and sisters in Christ. The rest of what they say about heaven fits what the bible tells us exactly, so I see no reason to discount what they have said. Several of them have been allowed to talk with some of the Old Testament saints, such as Adam, Eve, Jonah, and Abraham. Many have also been taken to hell, and shown the many horrors there. Should we just IGNORE all these personal testimonies? LAMAD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ENOCH2010 Posted July 22, 2014 Group: Senior Member Followers: 8 Topic Count: 6 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 907 Content Per Day: 0.20 Reputation: 382 Days Won: 0 Joined: 11/03/2011 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/07/1866 Share Posted July 22, 2014 yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Posted July 22, 2014 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,665 Content Per Day: 0.46 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/11/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted July 22, 2014 The heavenly dimension is a whole other dimension of reality, it is not far away on some other planet in the universe simply because another planet is in the 'same' material dimension as our earthly dimension. When Paul was "caught up" to Paradise, to the third Heaven, his flesh body didn't go anywhere, his spirit did, as God allowed him to see into the Heavenly dimension (2 Cor.12). It was the same with Isaiah in Isaiah 4, and John in Revelation, and Ezekiel in Ezekiel 40 through 48. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marilyn C Posted July 23, 2014 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 30 Topic Count: 269 Topics Per Day: 0.07 Content Count: 13,239 Content Per Day: 3.49 Reputation: 8,520 Days Won: 12 Joined: 12/21/2013 Status: Offline Birthday: 10/06/1947 Share Posted July 23, 2014 Hi iamlamad, Those so-called experiences are not true. The first above area, heaven, from the earth is our atmosphere where the birds fly, aeroplanes, clouds etc. The second above area from the earth is the celestial heavens where the planets are. Now the third heaven is where we see the throne of God, the angels & where the Body of Christ will be seated with Christ. (Rev. 3: 21) It is was there before our celestial/universe was created. it does not have animals, plants, etc but is of a spiritual substance. Thus those people did not `visit` heaven. That is just a delusion & deceit of the enemy. Those Old Testament saints & those who died but are in the Body of Christ are all in the General Assembly, waiting in turn for their inheritance that was promised. `you have come to ....the general assembly & church of the first-born who are enrolled in heaven, .....& to the spirits of righteous men made perfect,....` (Heb. 12: 23) The third heaven is not a planet of this universe, as I said it was there before this creation. Christ has a glorious body that can go through walls & different dimensions. We will have that sort of body also. This body does not need this earths attention, cleaning, eating, sleeping etc. It is a spiritual body that is made for the realm that we will inhabit. Don`t settle for man`s/Satan`s ideas of another planet. Don`t be tricked out of your true inheritance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Posted July 23, 2014 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 8 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,665 Content Per Day: 0.46 Reputation: 512 Days Won: 3 Joined: 05/11/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted July 23, 2014 Actually, I believe the third heaven of 2 Cor.12 was the third heavenly age, God's future eternity. Per 2 Pet.3 there are 3 world ages revealed, 'the world that then was', 'the heavens and the earth which are now', and the future 'new heavens and a new earth'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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