The Temptation of Jesus in the Wilderness

[Cross Reference]

Can you provide scripture to back up adam foreited due to disobedience please? I have heard this taught before but have been unable to locate a scripture to back it up.

You should not need anything to back it up in addition to the account. Don't you believe God made Adam's dominion, [greater than you have it to be], conditioned upon his obedience? Remember what God purposed for Himself in having created man that only obedience was necessary for fulfilling it. Perhaps me saying Adam was "gifted" instead of promised, contingent upon his obedience, would have helped you.

 

Did God not say in effect, "because you have done this thing you will know my breach of promise"?

Edited June 22, 2014 by Cross Reference

[Cross Reference]

I asked you before what books are you reading???

 

Who told you that when all Satan was trying to do was get her to doubt God so she eat of what, no doubt was a beautiful fruit.  '. .  Hath God said you will surely die?' It wasn't about her wanting to be like God.

 

 

Oh then why did Satan utter the words "to be like God"?

Your understanding is conjectured. It may have had an influence, it may not have had a influence. We don't know except Satan is more than persuasive when dealing with innocence.

The only point to be made is that she ate of something forbidden her to eat of and she did it without a possessing a sinful nature. How, without possessing one, is the question around which you are building your case.

Negative! Thinking and doing is not the same thing. Wouldn't you have concluded it differently had she only thought about it but then, obeyed? Did not even Jesus have to "overcome" His temptations?

 

Your not understanding what motivation is...Lust comes from the Heart, But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. Mat 5:28.. Can you try your logic with what Jesus said?

What lust????? Eve lusted?? More conjecture! She was innocence! Where did this lust come from, do you suppose?

 

 

But all were temptations spoken to Him for His consideration. How did He overcome whereas Eve could be persuaded not to partake? This question deserves an answer.

 

Jesus wasn't naive

 

 

That is no answer. Why wasn't He??

 

 

"Morality of life"? Morality is life. Adam was created innocent. By a series of moral choices he would have been incarnated by the Word, as in "The Word made flesh". How? By eating of the "Tree of Life". Why was he kicked out of the garden?

 

Your confusing morality with mortality...I can make all the good choices in life..if I dont believe in Jesus I dont have life

No confusion here. Seems you are, though. Jesus wasn't born. Adam was intended by God to the Word made flesh. Pay attention. Words do mean something.

 

The promise to Adam was dominion over the earth. God gave him everything except divinity.

 

And heres really the crux of it...How do you expect Adam to rule over his dominion?

Like Satan or Like Our Father? Yet you argue with me on this and tell me I must read my bible correctly...your arrogance is amusing.

Adam was a super-human individual or don't you believe that? Need some evidence?

 

Not really. It's very simple to understand if you lay aside all the stuff you want to factor in that has no bearing on anything __ if you read your Bible correctly.

 

Simple from your choice....however yet here we are debating it...

I have no problem and everything following in the scriptures, fit. You can't claim that.

That is true. They needed no such knowledge at this point is time. God was to be everything they needed for whatever may have come they way from the Devil.

 

"Both you and Cletus seems to rest your defence on the following: adam and eve did not have knowledge of good and evil so it isnt like they knew it was a lie."

 

 

Upon God's satisfaction they were ready for Divinity, they would have stepped over into glorification where ALL knowledge would have been revealed to them and they could have handled it.

 

This is exactly how Jesus [Who had all knowledge], exampled it after having completing all the Father's "work" over Satan before stepping over into glory on the mt transfiguration.

Naivety is not a defence councels, can you imagin our courts adopting such a similar position???...they both KNEW it was GOOD not to eat from the tree..

they knew what Good was CrossReference your logic is completely flawed.

Again, Adam and Eve were given a command to be obeyed. They disobeyed. They were not naive about anything. God was to be their High Tower! Their Fortress! Though they were super-human, they lacked the power of God to come against Satan who no man, of himself, can withstand!

if we are then to adopt your view of Adam and Eve that naivety can be used as a defence...Gods reaction to the event Gen 3:13 Then the LORD God said to the woman,

"What is this you have done?" makes God look naive...since Eve would not of known what she had done...Oh I just ate an Apple God...Geez like whats your problem God....

I was hungry and Im on this diet and like whatever...

 

Really? your going to claim naivety as a defence to your argument?

God asked the question of her to get her to consider her disobedience!! Let's stop playing games for personal advantage.

Edited June 23, 2014 by Cross Reference

[Cross Reference]

InChrist:



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I asked you before what books are you reading???

 

"I read sci-fi books, thrillers…my wife reads a lot of romance novels and recipe books…I hope that helps"

 

OK. Thanks. splains a lot. . .

 

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Your understanding is conjectured. It may have had an influence, it may not have had a influence. We don't know except Satan is more than persuasive when dealing with innocence.

The only point to be made is that she ate of something forbidden her to eat of and she did it without a possessing a sinful nature. How, without possessing one, is the question around which you are building your case.

 

"According to you, you make it sound like Eve had no chance. God effectively set her up for failure."

 

I told you what God expected of them, i.e., obedience. She didn't do it __didn't even call Adam to advise her. Eve relied upon herself to save her. Sound familiar?

 

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"Which contradicts scripture
1 Corinthians 10:13 God is faithful, and he will not let you be tempted beyond your ability."

 

Again, wrong! That was written to Christians indwelt by the Life of Jesus Christ who DID NOT doubt the written word. Except for being successful in creating doubt, and innocent figure has nothing within them [a void to be filled] for which to accuse, nothing in which to draw out to be used by the Devil. Jesus said, "The accuser comes but he has nothing in me for which to accuse me". . . "and he certainly can't get me to doubt My Father."

 

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"If they were innocent and beyond naivety why did they fail? The temptation was therefore beyond their ability as they did not possess a sinful nature and knew nothing about right or wrong? Your logic is muddy….makes no sense."

This is how I understand it. I believe it is accurate:

 

Since, by creation, they did not possess a sinful nature to lust after anything that would 'war' against them should the occasion arise to make a moral choice, God introduced "Vanity" [desires of the flesh/self gratification] into their soul. "For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope," Romans 8:20 (KJV). Notice, at the end it reads "in hope". In hope of what?? In hope that they would immediately run to their "strong high tower"! "The LORD is my rock, and my fortress, and my deliverer; my God, my strength, in whom I will trust; my buckler, and the horn of my salvation, and my high tower." Psalm 18:2 (KJV) This, from David, is the reason God called him a man after His own heart. ". . . , He raised up David to be their king; of him He bore witness and said, I have found David son of Jesse a man after My own heart, who will do all My will and carry out My program fully. Acts 13:22 (AMP) David is a type of Jesus Christ in that regard because He did the same when tempted of the Devil. Can we agree?

 

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"But let’s build my case…as my understanding is clearly “conjecture” but please Pay attention. Words do mean something or is it only when we pick and choose it to mean something to force fit our interpretation? For example "to be like God” but I guess this doesn’t mean anything right? After all God doesn’t waste words, right? Is it a inconvenience to your argument?"

 

Right. It means nothing to me because that was not the problem. You perspective remains skewed.

 

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"When does sin happen? Lets say I murdered someone…is the sin only committed after the deed?
When does sin happen? I stole something…is the sin only committed after the deed?
When does sin happen? I cheated on my wife…only after I slept with another woman, is the sin committed after the deed?"

 

Why don't you want to understand that with Jesus coming on the scene, things changed when considering matters of the heart. A totally new covenant exists since His arrival. His words: If you think the sinful deed to do it, you are guilty.  "Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart." Matthew 5:27-28 (KJV) ___ That was not ever the case in the OT. God also “winked” at a lot of stuff He no longer “winks” at.

 

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"The answer is no…the deed committed is a conclusion of my sin…in order to commit murder one must have intent…inorder to steal something I must have intent…if I commit adultery…I must have intent in order to commit the adultery. Intent involves a conscious decision, from outright premeditation to spontaneous action, even when a crime is not premeditated."

No! Death is the conclusion of sin __all sin!
OMT: If as you believe, the intent had been sufficient, Adam and  Eve would not have needed to actually eat of the forbidden fruit. That should end this part the discussion, though I don't believe it will.

Just a little more to convince you: And to Cain, who was full of hatred for Abel, desiring him dead the Lord said:  "If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him." Genesis 4:7 (KJV). There was a way out for Cain, wasn't there? So it was for Eve, as well. There is no difference between them. No guilt until the act was committed.

 

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"Defined as a desire to commit a specific act in the expectation that it will result in a specific outcome.
Eve had direct intent of her crime which is a desire to commit a specific act in the expectation that it will result in a specific outcome What was Eve’s expectation?

"For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."
Eve’s expectation from hearing these words was to become like God…How do we know this…we read further
When the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was desirable to make one wise, ( which is the specific out come)
Two things to please notice or “pay attention” …the word “Good” and “desirable”….Eve already possessed the knowledge of Good….why all of a sudden was this tree, which I’m sure they have seen countless of times in the Garden all of a sudden becomes “desirable’? The answer was to make one wise….like God, Knowing Good and Evil.
Her motivation was to be like God…Eve had the wrong motivation in the sense she thought buy eating the fruit was going to make her know Good and EVIL….Eating the fruit possessed no such knowledge…..The test itself did possess such a knowledge.
This is further confirmed when God himself says
"The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil.” Gen 3:22
Adam and Eve became like God, knowing good and evil…God here even acknowledges it. God didn’t say they tried to become like God and failed SCRIPTURE clearly shows NOW BECOME LIKE US …however not omniscience…. But like God knowing good And EVIL.
What lust????? Eve lusted?? More conjecture! She was innocence! Where did this lust come from, do you suppose?
She was innocent I tell you…innocennnnceeeee…..oh wait…until proven guilty.
"When the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was desirable to make one wise"
As explained above and also mentioning Adam and Eve knew of this tree but after speaking to satan all of a sudden the fruit was a delight to her eyes (MMMMMM FRUIT, I can picture Eve drooling from the mouth at this point)…. the tree was also desirable (MMMMMM TREEE)… EVE wAnt to bE LiKE GOD, Give mE Treee…Give meeee Fruitttttt, be like God, be wise like Godddd.
The text clearly shows Eve lusted after the Fruit
How do I know this?
Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death. James 1:15"



All irelevant. All misplaced thinking with dots that can never be connected. {Your last sentence has to be  a contradiction to your thinking.]

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"What is the sin? Its called lust,
What is Lust? It is also describes as an overwhelming desire or craving….what did Eve have an overwhelming and craving for?"

 

Lust, vanity, self-gratification __ venues for sin all. Sin couches at their doors.

 

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"What did Jesus say about lust?
But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart."

 

Kindly re-read my above comments to know you are adulterating scripture to say what it doesn't.

 

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Adam was a super-human individual or don't you believe that? Need some evidence?

 

"This is irrelevant to my question…which I will repeat again How do you expect Adam to rule over his dominion? Like Satan or Like Our Father?"

You mean how would I have expected him to rule us had things gone the way God originally intended? Easy.  And Adam, is still the Federal head of the human race. That never changed with or without sin in the mix. He [his fallen nature] still rules, and man, without God, still caves in to the wiles of Self and Satan. There were no other choices until Jesus Christ who is the second Adam, came on the scene to give that needed choice.. Now how would expect Him to rule over His dominion if man does not choose Him and set out to overcome the sin that so easily besets him, that He might to do so? 
cf Heb 12:1.

 

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They needed no such knowledge at this point is time.

 

"This is complete rubbish…..If they needed no such Knowledge, at THAT point in time…why did God put the tree in the Garden in the first place and tell them not to eat of it in the first place? Eating a fruit was not going to give them this knowledge you do understand this right? It’s the concept which was the test….God started teaching them right from the beginning."

 

Could you always explain yourself to your children when you gave them your commands? Did you not expect them to obey simply because you were who you were? So Rubbish, you say when it is so easy to see? How else could God find out from Adam where his allegiance would lie? How else could you?? If with God, then, by His command,  they would have moved on to the next moral choice until God was satisfied Adam could take the reigns of His Government.  He demonstrated this method with Abraham if you got that far in your reading program. . .

 

BTW: What do you suppose God taught them "from the beginning"?

 

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Upon God's satisfaction they were ready for Divinity, they would have stepped over into glorification where ALL knowledge would have been revealed to them and they could have handled it.

 

"Again complete rubbish, they would of learnt Knowledge through the process not magically revealed to them at the end…. One must ask what books your reading???"

 

Mister, you've got to get your head out of those Si-Fi books. Why not ask yourself a few questions like "what would Divinity be like if I was made so?" Answer: "I would suspect I would have ALLLLLLL knowledge and be enabled to handle it all without any errors in judgment".
I believe it would be accurate for you to think that.

 

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they lacked the power of God to come against Satan who no man, of himself, can withstand!

"More rubbish, where you getting this stuff? This is so contradictory towards scripture"

 

Certainly not from Si-Fi books. And you haven't presented any relevant scripture for discussion.

 

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"So God’s test was a set up then? Adam and Eve had no chance? Yet scripture tells us that tHAT is not God’s nature to do so".

Yes, they were set up to make a choice and you say:  - - - - "Yet scripture tells us that tHAT is not God’s nature to do so".

 

Here is a scripture that should give you pause:
"And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham,
and said unto him, Abraham: and he said, Behold, here I am". Genesis 22:1 (KJV)



 

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God asked the question of her to get her to consider her disobedience!!

 

"No God asked her what she had learnt….how else does one gain knowledge as a free gift?, just like that? Here I thought knowledge was learnt"

Good Grief!!! <is there no end> What were God’s words to Eve that you should conclude that?

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"The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom, and knowledge of the Holy One is understanding.
Something I also want to get back to which you mentioned and which I missed
And wrong conclusion. Eve possessed no intimate relationship with God as Lucifer to suggest such a motivation.
No intimate relationship with God as Lucifer….yOu sure about that? The very fact God tests them shows he desired an intimate relationship with them…the fact they even hid from God shows how close the relationship was, the fact  they had shame shows they had an intimate relationship with God….The fact God never Killed them after eating the fruit shows God had an intimate relationship with them. You don’t have these types of emotions with someone that you don’t have an intimate relationship with, you have these type of relationships with someone YOU HAVe and intimate relationship with…
Your entire logic is beyond flawed, contradictory to scripture and makes no sense."

Was it indeed like Lucifer's? Was sin found in her as it was in Lucifer that destroyed his relationship with God? That is the question I asked.

Mister,  I am sorry but, you need to learn how to read for understanding. You have no insight and I am afraid that is not going happen until you become born again and Baptized with the baptism of Jesus Christ by which the "Comforter" He sent will be of great value to you.

Question: Do you have access to youtube where you are? I suppose it to be England? May I send you a link?

Edited June 23, 2014 by Cross Reference

[Cross Reference]

Mister,  I am sorry but, you need to learn how to read for understanding. You have no insight and I am afraid that is not going happen until you become born again and Baptized with the baptism of Jesus Christ by which the "Comforter" He sent will be of great value to you.

Question: Do you have access to youtube where you are? I suppose it to be England? May I send you a link?

 

Wow that is some exemplary example of how one acts as a Christian....accuse another Christian to be reborn because one has a difference of opinion on scripture. Thats a new level of arrogence

 

I’m sorry I had no idea you alone hold the authority of interpreting scripture. Please get of high horse.

 

 You win. You have convinced me you have no resources by which you might understand the scriptures. The Bible is a dead book to you __ science fiction, perhaps but, nothing more. I can't fight that. I'm finished here.

Edited June 23, 2014 by Cross Reference

[other one]

I wish you guys would learn to use the quote feature on the board........   your posts are not worth the time to decipher then.

[Cross Reference]

 

 

Can you provide scripture to back up adam foreited due to disobedience please? I have heard this taught before but have been unable to locate a scripture to back it up.

You should not need anything to back it up in addition to the account. Don't you believe God made Adam's dominion, [greater than you have it to be], conditioned upon his obedience? Remember what God purposed for Himself in having created man that only obedience was necessary for fulfilling it. Perhaps me saying Adam was "gifted" instead of promised, contingent upon his obedience, would have helped you.

 

Did God not say in effect, "because you have done this thing you will know my breach of promise"?

so then, you cannot provide scripture to back up your claim? God didnt say in effect, He said man would work by the sweat of his brow and the ground would bring forth thorns and thistles, and we would eat the herb of the field. Nothing there about no more dominion. If TheBook dont say it I remain skeptic.

 

All that Adam personally was as a super-human creation was forfeited by him. You do know, of course, that he was "super-human"?

 

Clue: 'From now on you will be faced with performing hard work to survive.'  "In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return." Genesis 3:19 (KJV). Adam was full of soul power, something that is now forbidden by God for man to exercise.

You are forgetting Adam named all the animals. He never sweated. Work was non existent. Doctors and hospitals were not necessary. Healing of tissue? Forget it! All was pleasure. Even Eve would have painlessly popped out babies like nickles from a slot machine. All forfeited. Now, where do you want to take this?? Still need a specific scripture to persuade you?

 

Edited June 24, 2014 by Cross Reference

[other one]

 

I wish you guys would learn to use the quote feature on the board........   your posts are not worth the time to decipher then.

 

Lol my embarressment...I just noted the quotes in the tool bar section....on how to do it

 

Anyways in summary Cross Reference Contends that if we test or tempt or the temptations of God or Jesus then he cant be God and so forth. However this is not the case, as we can see on a number of occasions  Israel tested God when wondering in the desert for 40 years. This did not diminish God's omnipotence.

 

Then the subject dived deep into the temptation of Adam and Eve and in summary Cross Reference contends that Adam and Eve had no Godly soul....However my view  is that is simply incorrect as God made Adam and Eve good in fact very Good, God made them in His Image therefore God made Adam and Eve Godly good infact very Godly Good, they would therefore also have a good soul infact a very Good soul and if they were made in Gods Image they would of Had also God's image of his soul a Godly soul.

 

Because Cross Reference is of the view that Adam and Eve never had a Godly soul, therefore had no chance against Satan but yet were still left with a choice if they used God's words or used God as their "high Tower to combat Satan as Eve never "warred" against God's words....My view is this is a contradiction in itself and incorrect...Scripture clearly shows Eve used God's words and was at war with God's words therefore she would of had a chance against Satan.

 

Cross Reference is of the view, Eve could not have been Naive about the temptation....My view is Eve was clearly Naive about the temptation due to the fact she was under the impression by Satan that if she eat the apple she would become like God, knowing Good and Evil and God's divinity and would not die...as we can see Eve was clearly wrong.

 

Cross reference is of the view that because they had no Godly soul and yet was innocent only committed sin after Eve atethe Fruit....In my view Eve sinned before she at the apply as Eve not only lusted/ desired after the fruit but also co conspired with Satan to eat the fruit..What is interesting is Cross reference injected the notion that God implanted Vanity into Adam and Eve which again contradicts or undermines Cross reference entire argument...Whether it was lust or Vanity is really semantics...if indeed it was Vanity as Eve wanted to be like God knowing Good and Evil, Eve was actually coveting then to be like God, which then clearly shows Eve sinned before she Ate the Fruit. 

 

Cross reference is under the impression or view that God's test was due to dont eat the fruit as this displays discipline....However there is nothing wrong with that view it still misses the point of the test or temptation...In my view the temptation was really about how we handle the situation, the motives behind our decision to make the right or wrong choices. Are we doing things with the right motives or with the wrong motives. 

 

 

We've had several threads that pertained to this subject and it's kind of long so I really don't want to go back and see if I have put in my two cents so I'll do it again.

 

We know from Pauls writing that we saints will be judging the angels.  God to be fair made mankind unable to do this as when created Adam and Eve both did not know Good from Evil.......   I think that would be the same as saying right from wrong.....     they knew that God told them not to eat of the tree, but really didn't understand the ramifications of doing so.    I do really believe that God expected Adam to eat of the fruit from the start thus making Satan himself responsible for giving mankind the knowledge of good and evil, thus making us qualified judges.

 

If you just take the Bible at it's word, the only thing that changed was that Adam and Eve learned of the knowledge of good and evil and thier bodies were doomed to death at some time.    Spiritually nothing changed for God still came to see them in the Garden and they interfaced just as they had before eating....   God kicked them out of Eden for thier own good or they would have eaten of the tree of life and would have had to spend eternity with the act of disobedience standing between mankind and God.

To go past this to me is an exercise in metaphysics and can result in things that may or may not be true.  I don't see anything in the Bible that states any real change in Adam or Eve's state of being other than they realized that they were not what they should have been.   Understanding that they were naked is just the simple way of telling us that they understood good and evil beyond the one thing God told them not to do.  Fully understanding right from wrong........    and you would spend a very long time trying to convince me that it wasn't Gods plan all along for judging the angels is too important to just be an after thought resulting in the failure of Adam....   

 

"OH well, I guess I can task them with the duty of Judging the Angels since they decided to know good and evil" doesn't fit well in my personal view of our Lord.

 

Anyway, that's my personal view of that part of Genesis, and as with a lot of other things in Gods word, it seems to me that some folks try to make a lot more out of it than is really there.  

 

It's simply showing that God let Satan be responsible for qualifying mankind to judge angels.   But you can only come to that conclusion by taking in the entirety of the Bible.   What we will be doing beyond that, I believe the Word tells us that we really can't comprehend in the state of being that we are in today.

[enoob57]

I wish you guys would learn to use the quote feature on the board........   your posts are not worth the time to decipher then.

 

Lol my embarressment...I just noted the quotes in the tool bar section....on how to do it

 

Anyways in summary Cross Reference Contends that if we test or tempt or the temptations of God or Jesus then he cant be God and so forth. However this is not the case, as we can see on a number of occasions  Israel tested God when wondering in the desert for 40 years. This did not diminish God's omnipotence.

 

Then the subject dived deep into the temptation of Adam and Eve and in summary Cross Reference contends that Adam and Eve had no Godly soul....However my view  is that is simply incorrect as God made Adam and Eve good in fact very Good, God made them in His Image therefore God made Adam and Eve Godly good infact very Godly Good, they would therefore also have a good soul infact a very Good soul and if they were made in Gods Image they would of Had also God's image of his soul a Godly soul.

 

Because Cross Reference is of the view that Adam and Eve never had a Godly soul, therefore had no chance against Satan but yet were still left with a choice if they used God's words or used God as their "high Tower to combat Satan as Eve never "warred" against God's words....My view is this is a contradiction in itself and incorrect...Scripture clearly shows Eve used God's words and was at war with God's words therefore she would of had a chance against Satan.

 

Cross Reference is of the view, Eve could not have been Naive about the temptation....My view is Eve was clearly Naive about the temptation due to the fact she was under the impression by Satan that if she eat the apple she would become like God, knowing Good and Evil and God's divinity and would not die...as we can see Eve was clearly wrong.

 

Cross reference is of the view that because they had no Godly soul and yet was innocent only committed sin after Eve atethe Fruit....In my view Eve sinned before she at the apply as Eve not only lusted/ desired after the fruit but also co conspired with Satan to eat the fruit..What is interesting is Cross reference injected the notion that God implanted Vanity into Adam and Eve which again contradicts or undermines Cross reference entire argument...Whether it was lust or Vanity is really semantics...if indeed it was Vanity as Eve wanted to be like God knowing Good and Evil, Eve was actually coveting then to be like God, which then clearly shows Eve sinned before she Ate the Fruit. 

 

Cross reference is under the impression or view that God's test was due to dont eat the fruit as this displays discipline....However there is nothing wrong with that view it still misses the point of the test or temptation...In my view the temptation was really about how we handle the situation, the motives behind our decision to make the right or wrong choices. Are we doing things with the right motives or with the wrong motives.

Thank you OO for bringing back a community shared project of thought where one did not need to invest

the precious time God has given us to find out who said what... an inChrist for the decipher! We will see how

well you did by CF's response to this

[enoob57]

We've had several threads that pertained to this subject and it's kind of long so I really don't want to go back and see if I have put in my two cents so I'll do it again.

 

We know from Pauls writing that we saints will be judging the angels.  God to be fair made mankind unable to do this as when created Adam and Eve both did not know Good from Evil.......   I think that would be the same as saying right from wrong.....     they knew that God told them not to eat of the tree, but really didn't understand the ramifications of doing so.    I do really believe that God expected Adam to eat of the fruit from the start thus making Satan himself responsible for giving mankind the knowledge of good and evil, thus making us qualified judges.

 

If you just take the Bible at it's word, the only thing that changed was that Adam and Eve learned of the knowledge of good and evil and thier bodies were doomed to death at some time.    Spiritually nothing changed for God still came to see them in the Garden and they interfaced just as they had before eating....   God kicked them out of Eden for thier own good or they would have eaten of the tree of life and would have had to spend eternity with the act of disobedience standing between mankind and God.

To go past this to me is an exercise in metaphysics and can result in things that may or may not be true.  I don't see anything in the Bible that states any real change in Adam or Eve's state of being other than they realized that they were not what they should have been.   Understanding that they were naked is just the simple way of telling us that they understood good and evil beyond the one thing God told them not to do.  Fully understanding right from wrong........    and you would spend a very long time trying to convince me that it wasn't Gods plan all along for judging the angels is too important to just be an after thought resulting in the failure of Adam....   

 

"OH well, I guess I can task them with the duty of Judging the Angels since they decided to know good and evil" doesn't fit well in my personal view of our Lord.

 

Anyway, that's my personal view of that part of Genesis, and as with a lot of other things in Gods word, it seems to me that some folks try to make a lot more out of it than is really there.  

 

It's simply showing that God let Satan be responsible for qualifying mankind to judge angels.   But you can only come to that conclusion by taking in the entirety of the Bible.   What we will be doing beyond that, I believe the Word tells us that we really can't comprehend in the state of being that we are in today.

OO with your permission I would like to participate in another thread called "The examination of original sin" and discuss this further with you and others... using this as first statement of yours here toward directive parameters (?) Let me know your decision by starting it in doctrinal issues

[OneLight]

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This "IPB skin by IPBForumSkins Community Forum Software by IP.Board

 

is the "pits".

 

I have not had any issue with using the quote feature, or even coding quote ... /quote to break up a paragraph or quote.   If you need help using the boards, PM me and I will assist you.  No need to diss the site because you are having a hard time.