Financial Freedom? (Total Money Makeover)

[GoldenEagle]

First, how would you define financial freedom?

Second, I'm currently reading "Total Money Makeover" by Dave Ramsey. Also going through the book chapter by chapter in a discussion group. It has been a very good read. Has anyone read this book? Here's a description.
 

Radio talk-show host and bestselling author Ramsey (Financial Peace) is less a financial analyst and more of a preacher, which explains both his popularity and the appeal of this book, which just might gain a wide audience. The bedrock of his system is simple: work hard, pay what you owe and stay out of debt. His main commandment is "Pay cash." He first exhorts the reader to take "baby steps," which are designed to build on each other: first, save $1,000 as an emergency fund; then, pay off all debts from smallest to largest; save a larger three-to-six-month emergency fund; finally, start to save for college and pay off your home mortgage. Ramsey understands the difficulty in putting these steps into action, and therefore packs his book with personal testimonials from everyday people who have used his system and have become debt free, with obvious struggles. The key is what Ramsey calls "Gazelle intensity," which is to live a financial life the way a gazelle saves itself from an attacking cheetah-"outmaneuver the enemy and run for your life." While Ramsey provides some helpful charts and graphs so readers can keep track of their efforts to follow his steps, the strength of this book is that it is a straightforward motivational tool. He provides the brutally direct truth about the hard work it takes to become free of debt, and his directness is a great part of the book's charm.

God bless,

GE

[udx]

His methods is a good starting point for beginners, but good investors would never pay in cash. Leveraging is the key to getting good returns.

 

I am currently also reading a financial planning book "Rich Dad Poor Dad". According to his definition of wealth, it is the number of days you could live without working given your projected expenses. The higher the wealth calculated, the more financially free you are. By this definition in can be financially free either by increasing income, income producing assets or by decreasing liabilities.

To be wealthy would would require more income generating assets relative to income decreasing liabilities.

 

According to the author, you shouldn't merely save money because inflation would eat away at the savings but you would need to invest it just to stay even if not get ahead. A fool gets into bad debt (consumption debt), an average person save, a wise person invest. Not all debt (debt taken to acquire income producing assets) are bad though, but for the average amateur, probably better to stay away from it.

[Guest]

His methods is a good starting point for beginners, but good investors would never pay in cash. Leveraging is the key to getting good returns.

 

I am currently also reading a financial planning book "Rich Dad Poor Dad". According to his definition of wealth, it is the number of days you could live without working given your projected expenses. The higher the wealth calculated, the more financially free you are. By this definition in can be financially free either by increasing income, income producing assets or by decreasing liabilities.

To be wealthy would would require more income generating assets relative to income decreasing liabilities.

 

According to the author, you shouldn't merely save money because inflation would eat away at the savings but you would need to invest it just to stay even if not get ahead. A fool gets into bad debt (consumption debt), an average person save, a wise person invest. Not all debt (debt taken to acquire income producing assets) are bad though, but for the average amateur, probably better to stay away from it.

 

 

Wealth:

To Live Well

On The Income

Your Income

Produces

 

Or

 

Wealth:

To Invest Rusty, Moldy

And/Or Moth Eaten Stuff Into Eternal Treasure

 

Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:

 

But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:

 

For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also. Matthew 6:19-21

 

It's More Of A Matter Of The Heart

 

Rejoice evermore.

 

Pray without ceasing.

 

In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you. 1 Thessalonians 5:16-18

 

Than Of The Bank Balance

 

For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? Mark 8:36\

 

As I See It

[OneLight]

Financial freedom has taken on a new face.  To me, the simplicity of Romans 13:8 tells it all "Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law." ... does it really matter how long one can live in comfort on the money they saved?  Not to me.  I will probably work until I can't physically work any longer.   What matters to me is what I do with what He has given me.  In my own little world, I find it hard to watch a family who is really trying to make ends meet, truly doing what they should, but can't get a break for one reason or another.  The financial wizards of the world would have me turn away and harvest all I could for my future, but He who is in me reminds me that I am not guaranteed a tomorrow, and the harvest I have stored up could be a waste.  I find myself closer to what God would do when I extend a hand to others than I could ever from the knowledge that I may have a comfortable tomorrow. 
 
Some studies call this the poor mans thought process, always willing to help others with no regard of tomorrow.  I call this group a rich man, for his rewards are stored where no moth can eat, nor robber steal.

 

This is a personal opinion of my own.  Everyone has the right to hold their own ideas as to what is wise in finances.  In all things, seek His will first.

[udx]

  I find myself closer to what God would do when I extend a hand to others than I could ever from the knowledge that I may have a comfortable tomorrow. 

 

Some studies call this the poor mans thought process, always willing to help others with no regard of tomorrow.  I call this group a rich man, for his rewards are stored where no moth can eat, nor robber steal.

 

This is a personal opinion of my own.  Everyone has the right to hold their own ideas as to what is wise in finances.  In all things, seek His will first.

I don't see how helping the poor and being a shrewd investor and wise with managing finances to plan for the future is mutually exclusive. I know rich people who has done plenty of good with their wealth, got more wealthy and did even more good. Lets not turn this thread into another anti-wealth thread again.

 

1 Timothy 6:17-19New International Version (NIV)

17 Command those who are rich in this present world not to be arrogant nor to put their hope in wealth, which is so uncertain, but to put their hope in God, who richly provides us with everything for our enjoyment. 18 Command them to do good, to be rich in good deeds, and to be generous and willing to share. 19 In this way they will lay up treasure for themselves as a firm foundation for the coming age, so that they may take hold of the life that is truly life.

 

According to this verse, you can be both rich and lay up treasure in heaven. Besides, I consider each and everyone who has electricity, internet access and clean water already rich as far as the world's standard is concerned.

[OneLight]

I find myself closer to what God would do when I extend a hand to others than I could ever from the knowledge that I may have a comfortable tomorrow. 

 

Some studies call this the poor mans thought process, always willing to help others with no regard of tomorrow.  I call this group a rich man, for his rewards are stored where no moth can eat, nor robber steal.

 

This is a personal opinion of my own.  Everyone has the right to hold their own ideas as to what is wise in finances.  In all things, seek His will first.

I don't see how helping the poor and being a shrewd investor and wise with managing finances to plan for the future is mutually exclusive. I know rich people who has done plenty of good with their wealth, got more wealthy and did even more good. Lets not turn this thread into another anti-wealth thread again.

 

It all depends on where the heart is.  Many rich have no heart for the poor, which is why Jesus said "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

[udx]

 

 

I find myself closer to what God would do when I extend a hand to others than I could ever from the knowledge that I may have a comfortable tomorrow. 

 

Some studies call this the poor mans thought process, always willing to help others with no regard of tomorrow.  I call this group a rich man, for his rewards are stored where no moth can eat, nor robber steal.

 

This is a personal opinion of my own.  Everyone has the right to hold their own ideas as to what is wise in finances.  In all things, seek His will first.

I don't see how helping the poor and being a shrewd investor and wise with managing finances to plan for the future is mutually exclusive. I know rich people who has done plenty of good with their wealth, got more wealthy and did even more good. Lets not turn this thread into another anti-wealth thread again.

 

 

It all depends on where the heart is.  Many rich have no heart for the poor, which is why Jesus said "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

 

Yes. Then there are the second two verses.

 

And they were greatly astonished, saying among themselves, “Who then can be saved?” But Jesus looked at them and said, “With men it is impossible, but not with God; for with God all things are possible.”

 

Whether Wealth in Christianity is okay or not has already been discussed and debated in this thread (), there is no need to clone all these things again. Please don't derail the thread and go back to the OP.

[OneLight]

I find myself closer to what God would do when I extend a hand to others than I could ever from the knowledge that I may have a comfortable tomorrow. 

 

Some studies call this the poor mans thought process, always willing to help others with no regard of tomorrow.  I call this group a rich man, for his rewards are stored where no moth can eat, nor robber steal.

 

This is a personal opinion of my own.  Everyone has the right to hold their own ideas as to what is wise in finances.  In all things, seek His will first.

I don't see how helping the poor and being a shrewd investor and wise with managing finances to plan for the future is mutually exclusive. I know rich people who has done plenty of good with their wealth, got more wealthy and did even more good. Lets not turn this thread into another anti-wealth thread again.

 

It all depends on where the heart is.  Many rich have no heart for the poor, which is why Jesus said "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

Yes. Then there are the second two verses.

 

And they were greatly astonished, saying among themselves, “Who then can be saved?” But Jesus looked at them and said, “With men it is impossible, but not with God; for with God all things are possible.”

 

Whether Wealth in Christianity is okay or not has already been discussed and debated in this thread (), there is no need to clone all these things again. Please don't derail the thread and go back to the OP.

I know of the discussion/debate, and don't need to rely on what others think of the subject. Worthy discussions/debates do not over ride scripture.

I depend on the teachings of Christ, which you seem to quickly bypass to find a rebuttal, which is not a rebuttal at all, but a clarification of His working on the inner man. If you would take the time to review what I had stated, you will see that I said it is what is in the heart of man that will determine what they do with their riches. If the heart is toward God, he will do His will. If not, he will fatten his resources and live with the results.

You will also notice that I clearly stated this was my opinion. You could of just taken it as such and moved on, yet you chose to discuss. Because you chose to discuss, I find it odd you are so quick to throw in another thread and state there is no need to rehash the subject. If that were the case, why the reply?

[GoldenEagle]

His methods is a good starting point for beginners, but good investors would never pay in cash. Leveraging is the key to getting good returns.

 

I am currently also reading a financial planning book "Rich Dad Poor Dad". According to his definition of wealth, it is the number of days you could live without working given your projected expenses. The higher the wealth calculated, the more financially free you are. By this definition in can be financially free either by increasing income, income producing assets or by decreasing liabilities.

 

To be wealthy would would require more income generating assets relative to income decreasing liabilities.

 

According to the author, you shouldn't merely save money because inflation would eat away at the savings but you would need to invest it just to stay even if not get ahead. A fool gets into bad debt (consumption debt), an average person save, a wise person invest. Not all debt (debt taken to acquire income producing assets) are bad though, but for the average amateur, probably better to stay away from it.

UDX you point out an interesting concept in defining financial freedom in Rich Dad, Poor Dad. I wasn't aware Dave recommends investors to pay cash? Please explain further.

I agree Dave Ramsey's stuff is good for beginners. That said a lot of what he teaches is just common sense. I particularly like the 7 baby steps:

Currently on Chapter 5 of the book. If anyone is on Facebook let me know if interested in joining the discussion group on Total Money Makeover.

God bless,

GE

 

[Wildstar]

Is it easier to give 20 dollars away or 20 million?  If that's all you had?  Now I don't think you should go homeless or wearing second rate clothing, but no need to go overboard and buy insane mansions and what not.  I just think managing money should be something that you speak to God about.