The Battle of Gog and Magog

[Spock]

7 hours ago, Marilyn C said:

World War 3

 

Ezekiel predicts that Russia will mount a massive military attack in the Middle East.

 

 President of Russia ... prepare yourself and all the companies that are assembled about you; and you be a commander for them ... you will think an evil thought, you will go into the Land of Israel, to take a spoil and a prey. (summary of Ezekiel 38:3-12)

 

Bible predictions are very meticulous and accurate. It is not the Soviet Dictator i.e. Gorbachev; but the President of the Russian Republic who is to assume command.

The Prophet Joel (2:1-20) also foretells this invasion. In terms meaningful to his contemporary audience, he graphically describes all the modern implements of a mechanised army in action. He depicts tanks, armoured carriers, guns, flame throwers and masses of planes.

Russia claims to want peace. However, it is of interest to note that the Russian word for "Peace" is "MEER". The same word means "The World". When they claim to want peace, are they in fact wanting the world? Russia's policy has always been world dominion. This is the core of their "New World Order"

 

The strategic advantage of involvement in the Middle East, and the economic wealth accruing from controlling the world distribution of crude oil has been a Soviet prime objective for years.

 

 

This was exposed by the Israeli army in 1982.

 

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs for the State of Israel reports, inter alia:-

"During the operation "Peace for Galilee", as the Israeli forces advanced through Lebanon in July 1982, they made an amazing discovery. Around the Village of Saida, the largest secret military base in the world was uncovered. It consisted of miles of steel reinforced bunkers tunnelled out of the hillside. Inside was crammed massive quantities of Soviet made arms and ammuni­tion. It exceeded by far the highest previous intelligence esti­mates. I.D.F. units gathered 4170 tons (some 1,500 truckloads) of ammunition; hundreds of combat-vehicles; tanks and ar­moured carriers; thousands of weapons, artillery and rocket launchers, plus other sophisticated devices. These arms and stores were far in excess of P.L.O. requirements. Secret documents and maps found in the Com­mand Post clearly revealed that the Soviets planned invasion of the Middle East on the 4th August 1982. The I.D.F. averted this Soviet invasion by just a few weeks"

 

However, there is an appointed time predicted. Russia will certainly invade the Middle East. World War 3 will have commenced.

 

 

Time-slot for the Invasion

 

Daniel provides an indication of the time-slot in his vision:-

"When the Bear starts its move ... it has three ribs in its mouth". (Daniel 7:5)

Metaphorically this represents 3 nations who have not previously been incorporated within the Bear i.e. The Iron Curtain. These now join this move into the Middle East. Ezekiel, in his predicted military confederacy, records exactly three such countries. They precisely conform to the prerequisites.

 

"Persia (Iran), Ethiopia and Libya" (Ezekiel 38:5)

 

Watch these countries: Marilyn.

 

 

 

 

 

Marilyn,

you are writing some very realistic thoughts as you are interpreting the scriptures. You may not be right, but at least it appears to me you can make a great case for its support. I really enjoy reading and pondering your words.

On a side note, You are an AWESOME sister in Christ and I love and appreciate you to pieces. You are a large part as to why I hang out here at Worthy. I love fellowshipping with people like you. 

Spock

[Marilyn C]

8 hours ago, Spock said:

Marilyn,

you are writing some very realistic thoughts as you are interpreting the scriptures. You may not be right, but at least it appears to me you can make a great case for its support. I really enjoy reading and pondering your words.

On a side note, You are an AWESOME sister in Christ and I love and appreciate you to pieces. You are a large part as to why I hang out here at Worthy. I love fellowshipping with people like you. 

Spock

Hi Spock,

You are a very encouraging gentle -man. I am nearly at a loss for words. (for once.) I so do hope & pray that it is only what is true of God`s word that will reside in people`s hearts. I also know that I have been taught many, many things that are different from what others have been taught, thus I do expect some flack, misunderstanding, attacks etc & also good discussions. However when I get such very kind words I am really floored. It actually made me cry with tears of gratitude to the Lord for showing me, even in part that His truth is slowly, in these areas, is at least, being thought though, which is quite necessary - to study carefully.

You are a such a blessings & good example here to all, dear bro in the Lord.

Bless you & your family. Marilyn. 

 

 

 

[Serving]

The strongest indicator that Ezekiel 38 Gog & Magog can not be before the millennium is the "at rest" :

Ezekiel 38:11 And thou shalt say, I will go up to the land of unwalled villages; I will go to them that are at rest, that dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates,

The few times Israel has been at rest in the past all met the same criteria to be considered "at rest", which today's Israel does not meet, this is this rule :

1 Kings 5:4 But now the LORD my God hath given me rest on every side, so that there is neither adversary nor evil occurrent.

"Neither adversary" - nor - "Evil occurent" .. think about that .. we certainly don't see that today .. now expand on that :

Joshua 21:44 And the LORD gave them rest round about, according to all that he sware unto their fathers: and there stood not a man of all their enemies before them; the LORD delivered all their enemies into their hand.

The conditions of todays Israel being "at rest" are just not met nor can they be until Christ Himself fulfils it during the millennium & not before .. seeing Israel can not be considered at rest until all her enemies are not only made powerless against her like in each of the past examples according to God's definition of being "at rest", but also dare not even challenge her during those periods of rest .. again, the only way that criteria (rest) can be met is by Christ Himself securing Israel's complete and utter safety for 1000 years for the millennium where "peace & stability" will be the sign of His time.

And since Israel only ever achieved rest through direct intervention on God's behalf, and each rest has only been given to an OBEDIENT Israel and never to a REBELLIOUS Israel, which Israel is today and even up to the coming, REBELLIOUS towards their Messiah, then this criteria likewise is not met by todays Israel nor can be until ALL Israel turns to the Lord Jesus the Christ .. again, that only happens after His 2nd coming and not before .. God does not give rest to a rebellious house simple as that .. which rebellious house Israel will REMAIN until they say, "Blessed is He that cometh in the Name of the Lord" .. and that only happens during the 2nd coming event.

And not only rebellious, but also desolate .. spiritually desolate that is, which is what Daniel meant here :

Daniel 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

The consummation ONLY happens at the 2nd coming period .. thus Israel can NEVER fulfil ANY SORT OF REST before Christ's return since they will remain (spiritually) DESOLATE right up to the coming.

To make Ezekiel 38 work at all before the 2nd coming, there are only a few choices in regards to the "at rest" .. either ignore it and carry on with all these contradictory (to each other) doctrines .. or face it and find harmony in just ONE doctrine that AGREES every time .. that Gog & Magog is AFTER the millennium just like John declares .. it's really that simple.  

[WilliamL]

2 hours ago, Serving said:

To make Ezekiel 38 work at all before the 2nd coming, there are only a few choices in regards to the "at rest" .. either ignore it and carry on with all these contradictory (to each other) doctrines .. or face it and find harmony in just ONE doctrine that AGREES every time ...

Which doctrine is, the earth has been depopulated during the Wrath of the 7 Trumpets before the final Armageddon battle.

Is. 13:11 Thus I will punish the world for its evil
And the wicked for their iniquity;
I will also put an end to the arrogance of the proud
And abase the haughtiness of the ruthless.

12 I will make mortal man scarcer than pure gold
And mankind than the gold of Ophir.

13 Therefore I will make the heavens tremble,
And the earth will be shaken from its place
At the fury of the LORD of hosts
In the day of His burning anger.

17:9 In that day their [Jacob's] strong cities will be like forsaken places in the forest,
Or like branches which they abandoned before the sons of Israel;
And the land will be a desolation.

This is why the armies ride on flesh-and-blood horses, and the people of the land of Israel are dwelling in villages.

This is after the Rapture, but before the Battle of Armageddon. A period of MANY years.

[Serving]

8 hours ago, WilliamL said:

Which doctrine is, the earth has been depopulated during the Wrath of the 7 Trumpets before the final Armageddon battle.

Is. 13:11 Thus I will punish the world for its evil
And the wicked for their iniquity;
I will also put an end to the arrogance of the proud
And abase the haughtiness of the ruthless.

12 I will make mortal man scarcer than pure gold
And mankind than the gold of Ophir.

13 Therefore I will make the heavens tremble,
And the earth will be shaken from its place
At the fury of the LORD of hosts
In the day of His burning anger.

17:9 In that day their [Jacob's] strong cities will be like forsaken places in the forest,
Or like branches which they abandoned before the sons of Israel;
And the land will be a desolation.

This is why the armies ride on flesh-and-blood horses, and the people of the land of Israel are dwelling in villages.

This is after the Rapture, but before the Battle of Armageddon. A period of MANY years.

Hi William,

Firstly, our bibles do not speak the same word on this because your bibles verse 12 is different than the KJV authorized versions v12 which says this :

12 I will make a man more precious than fine gold; even a man than the golden wedge of Ophir.

Which interpretation matches nicely with other prophecies to do with the 2nd coming period of whose context & spoken word both speak the same thing with each other, to show an entirely different picture than what you are currently showing .. like this for example (keeping the above verse in mind) :

Be it silver :

Malachi 3:2-3

2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

3 And he shall sit as a refiner and purifier of silver: and he shall purify the sons of Levi, and purge them as gold and silver, that they may offer unto the LORD an offering in righteousness.

Or gold :

Zechariah 13:9  And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.

Be it either silver or gold, when God makes those of His righteous, He enacts a process for the receiving or "grafting in" of the inner growing and Holy Spirit, and as I'm sure you'd know & agree, He calls that process refining .. amongst a few other terms .. He likens it to a purifying .. which is exactly what He does to us, when we grow in Spirit too, He refines us & purifies us just as gold is refined & purified, as it were.

So I can not agree with your bibles rendering of v12 .. though I can understand now as to why you'd say what you said because of that wording in your bible which is different to "mine" .. and this is why Wescott & Hort should never have been allowed to open the flood gates to all these contradictory bibles we see today .. exactly for this reason .. our written word no longer speaks the same voice .. now we have confusion, this is not an attack on you either bro, but on the different bibles out there.

Anyway, putting that aside, we can still sort out what Isaiah was speaking about regardless of that verse when we look at the whole context, and from my discernment, the context even disagrees with you on this brother .. please take a look and please do not take this as an attack, just a brotherly discussion okay?

 

Continued >>

 

[OakWood]

On 01/09/2015 at 3:06 AM, Ezra said:

We should endeavor to keep the battle of Armageddon distinct from the battle of Gog and Magog. There are some similarities, but there are also major differences.

The Battle of Armageddon is NOT the Ezekiel 38-39 war, nor is it the Gog, Magog war of the book of Revelation. They are three distinct battles.

1/ Ezekiel 38-39: An attempt to attack and plunder Israel which fails due to God's intervention.

2/ Armageddon: A battle between good and evil at the close of the Tribulation.

3/ Revelation Gog, Magog: Final battle at the end of the Millennium.

 

[Serving]

Continued >>

Quote

WilliamL said:

Which doctrine is, the earth has been depopulated during the Wrath of the 7 Trumpets before the final Armageddon battle.

Is. 13:11 Thus I will punish the world for its evil
And the wicked for their iniquity;
I will also put an end to the arrogance of the proud
And abase the haughtiness of the ruthless.

12 I will make mortal man scarcer than pure gold
And mankind than the gold of Ophir.

13 Therefore I will make the heavens tremble,
And the earth will be shaken from its place
At the fury of the LORD of hosts
In the day of His burning anger.

17:9 In that day their [Jacob's] strong cities will be like forsaken places in the forest,
Or like branches which they abandoned before the sons of Israel;
And the land will be a desolation.

This is why the armies ride on flesh-and-blood horses, and the people of the land of Israel are dwelling in villages.

This is after the Rapture, but before the Battle of Armageddon. A period of MANY years.

This is what I see ..

Isaiah 13

9 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.

That is the timing .. but is it the actual and literal day of the Lord being spoken of?

10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

There you go, yes .. that verse is the confirmation of verse 9's implied timing .. that day .. on the day of the 7th trumpet, where the whole world is darkened on that same day for Christ's actual and 'physical' return.

11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

There it is bro .. that is who is being punished, the whole world .. not just Israel .. Israel actually gets saved on that day FROM their punishments which were already in effect before the return .. that day of the coming is when Israel's punisments are COMPLETED and FULFILLED .. on that very same day and not before .. which verse 11 flows smoothly & uninterrupted into this :

12 I will make a man more precious than fine gold; even a man than the golden wedge of Ophir.

And it is amongst those of that group, "the world" (Israel INCLUDED), who will eventually learn righteousness after Christ returns (again, Israel INCLUDED) with no other doctrine/religion to challenge His word/teaching since Christ WILL be ruling the whole world with a rod of iron .. sure men can IGNORE His teaching / law, but they can no longer POLLUTE IT with contrary doctrines .. so it is then, after His 2nd coming when His WORD will "cover the earth like the sea" that He will start refining men to make them precious as fine gold (righteous/pure) .. otherwise how can Israel fulfil what is prophesied concerning Israel? That THEY will become MINISTERS of the LORD during the millennium? .. Ministers need 'students' to teach, otherwise Ministers they are not.

13 Therefore I will shake the heavens, and the earth shall remove out of her place, in the wrath of the LORD of hosts, and in the day of his fierce anger.

Another confirmation for which day is being spoken .. it is only on that day itself, the 2nd coming, that the great earthquake of the likes never before seen on planet earth occurs which correlates with this other Isaiah prophecy :

Isaiah 24:20 The earth shall reel to and fro like a drunkard, and shall be removed like a cottage; and the transgression thereof shall be heavy upon it; and it shall fall, and not rise again.

So we see that the gold being mentioned above is to do with the process God intends to initiate when His Son comes in His POWER to RULE the whole world in righteousness where His doctrine will "cover the earth like the sea" .. and those who accept Him, will indeed become as fine gold .. "fine gold purified in the fire" actually.

So one last time :

11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

12 I will make a man more precious than fine gold; even a man than the golden wedge of Ophir.

This is millennial talk .. before the millennium comes into effect & even on that actual day of the coming .. punishments, then .. then comes the refining/purifying as fine gold during the millennium.

I'll leave that with you to ponder on.

Serving.

 

[Montana Marv]

The Gog Magog war of the Ezk 38, 39 war is not the Gog - Magog war at the end the Mill.  If one notices in the Gog -Magog war of Ezk 38,39 those of Israel are employed for 7 months to bury the dead and cleanse the land.  They burn the weapons of war for 7 years.  Now compare to the Gog - Magog war with Satan after the Mill.  All are destroyed,  in Ezk 38, 39 only 5/6 are killed.  Also after the Mill the New Heaven and the New Earth occur so why bury the dead for 7 months or burn the weapons of war for 7 seven years.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[WilliamL]

7 hours ago, Serving said:

Firstly, our bibles do not speak the same word on this because your bibles verse 12 is different than the KJV authorized versions v12 which says this :

12 I will make a man more precious than fine gold; even a man than the golden wedge of Ophir.

The KJV is not a perfect translation by any means. Those translators (as all translators) had their own biases, both doctrinal and eschatological. Regarding the word in question, here is what two different lexicons say:

Strong's: yâqar, yaw-kar'; a primitive root; properly, apparently, to be heavy, i.e. (figuratively) valuable; causatively, to make rare

Gesenius' Hebrew-Chaldee Lexicon: Hiphil...to make rare...Isa. 13:12

The verb is in fact in the Hiphil tense (first person common singular), which is causative, a tense peculiar to Hebrew.

[WilliamL]

6 hours ago, Serving said:

This is what I see ..

Isaiah 13

9 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.

That is the timing .. but is it the actual and literal day of the Lord being spoken of?

10 For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.

There you go, yes .. that verse is the confirmation of verse 9's implied timing .. that day .. on the day of the 7th trumpet, where the whole world is darkened on that same day for Christ's actual and 'physical' return.

11 And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogancy of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.

There it is bro .. that is who is being punished, the whole world .. not just Israel .. Israel actually gets saved on that day FROM their punishments which were already in effect before the return .. that day of the coming is when Israel's punisments are COMPLETED and FULFILLED .. on that very same day and not before .. which verse 11 flows smoothly & uninterrupted into this :

12 I will make a man more precious than fine gold; even a man than the golden wedge of Ophir.

And it is amongst those of that group, "the world" (Israel INCLUDED), who will eventually learn righteousness after Christ returns...

The Day of the Lord = the time of God's Wrath (Is. 13:9 above), which begins at the 6th Seal. The Father and Son appear, the elect are raptured, and the Wrath begins. That Wrath includes the Trumpets and Bowls. Everything you have quoted above out of Isaiah 13 refers to this period: first the earth's sky/heavens are darkened by the physical cataclysms, including volcanic eruptions, when "every mountain and island [is] moved out of its place," Rev. 6:14 --

Rev. 6:12 I looked when He opened the sixth seal, and behold, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became like blood.

-- then "every eye" (Rev. 1:7) sees the Father on his throne with the Son, and most of the earth's unbelievers are struck with fear:

Rev. 6:15 And the kings of the earth, the great men, the rich men, the commanders, the mighty men, every slave and every free man, hid themselves in the caves and in the rocks of the mountains, 16 and said to the mountains and rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! 17 For the great day of His wrath has come, and who is able to stand?”

During the 4th Seal, "power was given to them [Death and Hades] over a fourth of the earth, to kill with sword, with hunger, with death, and by the beasts of the earth."

During the 6th Trumpet alone, "... the four angels, who had been prepared for the hour and day and month and year, [are] released to kill a third of mankind."

This is how and when earth becomes depopulated, and why a mortal becomes rare upon the earth.