WHO IS THE BEAST OR WHAT IS THE BEAST AND WHAT IS THE MARK OF THE BEAST?

[Montana Marv]

William

Scripture says he belongs to the seven. (Rev 17:11)

Now here you said from above:  The five who fell were the spiritual authorities over the 5 world-dominating empires before Rome, who all persecuted God's people: Egypt, Assyria, Chaldean Babylon, Persia, and Greece. The "one is," in John's time, was the spiritual ruler of Rome. 

None of these kingdoms were around when 'azazel' was active on earth.  So it is impossible for him to belong to any of them.  Now the abyss is not opened up until the 5th Trumpet.  You yourself are discrediting what you say. If one looks into the book of Job, it is Satan that is the one who destroys. He deceived Eve.  He is the top dog of the fallen angels. (not 'azazel')  Those angels who reside in the abyss are locked up.  Satan is unlocked.  He is able to visit Heaven, he would also be able to visit the abyss.  He (Satan) is their leader.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[JohnD]

 

5. There are two beast shown in Revelation 13. The beast out of the sea is the Antichrist (yet future)

Are you saying that the beast out of the sea is a human?  How is that true when he comes up out of the abyss?

• The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction.  Revelation 17:8a

I can't find any passage that refers to the abyss as a holding place for humans.  Can you?  I only see where it is used in connection with evil spirit beings.

• And Jesus asked him, “What is your name?” And he said, “Legion”; for many demons had entered him. They were imploring Him not to command them to go away into the abyss.  Luke 8:30-31
• And he laid hold of the dragon, the serpent of old, who is the devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years; and he threw him into the abyss, and shut it and sealed it over him.  Revelation 20:2-3a

The beast out of the sea is a fallen angel, the prince of the final world kingdom.

The abyss is that gulf fixed between the place of suffering where the rich man was and the place of comforting where Abraham and Lazarus were in the account of Lazarus and the Rich Man:

Luke 16:19–31 (AV)

19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day:

20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,

21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man’s table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.

22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham’s bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;

23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.

25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.

26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.

27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father’s house:

28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.

29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.

30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.

31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Likewise:

Isaiah 14:12–20 (AV)

12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit**.

16 They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;

17 That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof; that opened not the house of his prisoners?

18 All the kings of the nations, even all of them, lie in glory, every one in his own house.

19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.

20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.

Abusos / Tartarus lowest hell.

**

Deuteronomy 32:22 (AV)

22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell*, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.

* Hebrew = Sheol

Acts 1:25 (AV)

25 That he may take part of this ministry and apostleship, from which Judas by transgression fell, that he might go to his own place.

Remember, Satan entered into Judas. There is a metaphoric reference to Satan entering into the hearts of Ananias and Sapphira (Acts 5:3-4). But there is no other place in scripture where Satan is said to directly enter into possession of a human being other than:

Luke 22:3 (AV)

3 Then entered Satan into Judas surnamed Iscariot, being of the number of the twelve.

John 13:26–27 (AV)

26 Jesus answered, He it is, to whom I shall give a sop, when I have dipped it. And when he had dipped the sop, he gave it to Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon.

27 And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.

Which is a serious charge (leaving his first estate) in the spirit realm:

Jude 6 (AV)

6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

It is from here that Satan / the Beast / Judas Iscariot will be released for a short while:

Revelation 20:1–7 (AV)

1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

(thousand years in the Greek here is meant only to convey a long period of time rather than the precise number of years).

Thus the man of lawlessness has been revealed by scripture which was yet future when the Apostle Paul wrote:

2 Thessalonians 2:1–4 (AV)

1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

John 17:12 (AV)

12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

Edited November 20, 2015 by JohnD

[JohnD]

Why would Satan do this? Enter Judas and be trapped not only in the abyss until released but in the person of Judas forever?

He thought it was go for broke time the night Jesus was arrested and tried and convicted to be crucified. But when he realized he had played right into God's hand (that Jesus was supposed to be sacrificed according to God's plan all along) he tried to stop it by feigning remorse. He went to the priests to recant his testimony. But he'd already done too thorough a job corrupting the priests and they mocked him. The beast threw the silver blood money at the priests and (IMHO) the man Judas could not abide the raging evil in his soul from the defeated Satan, and like the swine that jumped off a cliff when legion entered them, Judas killed himself.

   

[JohnD]

Demon possession is the adulterated mockery of being filled with the Holy Spirit of God.

It is cheap and evil and the imposition of the will of the demon / fallen angel upon the host (human or animal).

God's indwelling is peaceful, loving, maintaining the individuality and sovereignty of the human host. It is always wit the permission of that host that God enters in. And we must choose him and his ways... we can go against his will and sin and live by the flesh and grieve his Spirit even after the indwelling.

Those who are possessed are slaves to the demons that possess them.

[JohnD]

The purpose and timing of the great tribulation is to bring the remnant of official (physical) Israel to faith in Jesus Christ.

Jeremiah 30:7 (AV)

7 Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob’s trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.

This is also why Satan will be released for a short time in the person of Judas who will claim to be the Jewish Messiah and deceive the Jews and nearly everyone on Earth (those who believe in the true Messiah Jesus will not be deceived, and we will be hunted down and executed for our refusal to believe otherwise). That's what the 666 mark is about, exposing all who will not take that mark.

Revelation 13:15–17 (AV)

15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

Revelation 13:5–10 (AV)

5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.

7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.

10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

[JohnD]

Think about it. A man comes back from the grave who can scientifically substantiate he lived 2000 years ago.

It would take something of that magnitude to convince all the people of earth. Atheists, skeptics, people of other religions, etc.

Revelation 13:1–4 (AV)

1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.

4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?

[JohnD]

The chapter begins and ends with prophetic Hebrew references:

Revelation 13:1 (AV)

1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

The Greek text says "standing on the sand by the sea" which is why some translations say John the Revelator was standing on the sand by the sea and others say the beast was standing on the sand by the sea.

God told Abraham he would multiply his seed like the stars of heaven and like the sand by the seashore (Genesis 22:17). Setting aside the distinction between the spiritual heirs and the physical heirs of Abraham in this passage, the reference to the sand by the sea is clearly about the Jewish people in Revelation 13:1.

The ending verse is clear reference to Solomon-like traits:

Revelation 13:18 (AV)

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

• Here is wisdom.
• Let him that hath understanding
• count the number of the beast:
• for it is the number of a man;
• and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

Two of the four times 666 appears in scripture refer to Solomon. He is said in scripture to be the wisest man with understanding second to none. Also the first and second Temples were destroyed 666 prophetic years apart to the day.

Also:

2 Thessalonians 2:3–4 (AV)

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

He will build the third Temple (which is what official Israel is looking for in a messiah today).

 

 

 

 

[JohnD]

These things are not just speculation. The more I study them and the longer I put them to the test, I find they are biblical. The passages of scripture persist. And I have solicited opposing interpretations. Some have suggested other prophecies which have to do with the settings of the time of the end, but when it is all said and done (comparing scripture with scripture under the guidance of the Holy Spirit) their actual opposition is over personal interpretations and opinions about those superficial elements of prophetic settings. 

My point is NOT that I am right. God is right and at best I and others like me are mere tools in God's hand. I am no more significant than the computer keyboard I am typing on now.

And since this appears to be biblical (and few if any others are getting the message out) we must all (all who are convinced by these things) get the word out. Leaving just in this thread in this forum as a "nicety" or a "nice to know" tid bit of information would be a mistake. For lots of reasons. We should post it in all the forums we belong to and make hard copies to disperse  should our computers and internet be taken away. Even if only for profit of greedy people our freedoms are being stripped away all the time and held for ransom (higher prices / more money). It does not have to be some dictatorial confiscation of our computers / internet service... and it will serve the same purpose.

And IF (note I say IF) these things are all true, then believers need to prepare for a persecution unlike any known to man. There will be a rapture, but it will not happen until approximately half way through the 70th Week of Daniel.

Daniel 12:11–12 (AV)

11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

 

[Last Daze]

Think about it. A man comes back from the grave who can scientifically substantiate he lived 2000 years ago.

It would take something of that magnitude to convince all the people of earth. Atheists, skeptics, people of other religions, etc.

Revelation 13:1–4 (AV)

1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.

4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?

I've likewise thought of the possibility of a "Judas raised from the dead" false prophet.  This verse gives a hint that it could be someone from the past.

• ^{The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and o to destruction.And those who dwell on the earth, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, will wonder when they see the beast, that he was and is not and will come.  Revelation 17:8}

Part of what intrigues people is that the beast "was".  That's a reference to prior activity, prior to when John wrote Revelation.

[*Zion*]

 Check out talks by  Walid Shoebat on Christian Prophecy and the mark of the beast. 

Sorry, I think it's made up. I think the number of the beast is that of the name of a man. Also unfortunately it seems Islam converts to Christianity lie a lot, which than becomes publicly known. The problem is that even when they change faith, the habit or culture of lying stays. It is because Islam permits lying unlike fBuddhism or Christianity. But maybe because they start to lie a little less it becomes easily obvious. So when it becomes obvious it looks bad for the image of converts in all. But they cannot leave their  culture entirely, it's in their names, their language that they continue to speak at home or read in it. But of course muslims lie to the end,    like the female terrorist in Paris, when she was asked 'Where is your boyfriend?' She would answer'He is not my boyfriend' several times and than she blew up herself. And when Obama was asked about the 5 American detainees in Iran he said 'its not like I'm happy they are detained' and than he made a long pause almost smiling I call this a problematic pause when someone is lying, he has two or three versions of the world in himself and he needs time to switch in between

 Check out talks by  Walid Shoebat on Christian Prophecy and the mark of the beast. 

Sorry, I think it's made up. I think the number of the beast is that of the name of a man. Also unfortunately it seems Islam converts to Christianity lie a lot, which than becomes publicly known. The problem is that even when they change faith, the habit or culture of lying stays. It is because Islam permits lying unlike fBuddhism or Christianity. But maybe because they start to lie a little less it becomes easily obvious. So when it becomes obvious it looks bad for the image of converts in all. But they cannot leave their  culture entirely, it's in their names, their language that they continue to speak at home or read in it. But of course muslims lie to the end,    like the female terrorist in Paris, when she was asked 'Where is your boyfriend?' She would answer'He is not my boyfriend' several times and than she blew up herself. And when Obama was asked about the 5 American detainees in Iran he said 'its not like I'm happy they are detained' and than he made a long pause almost smiling I call this a problematic pause when someone is lying, he has two or three versions of the world in himself and he needs time to switch in between

Be careful.  Only the Lord can discern the heart.