The daughter of Babylon

[unworthydude]

13 hours ago, Last Daze said:

How can the blood of all who have been slain, let's start with Abel, be found in Jerusalem?  As you quoted earlier:

• And in her was found the blood of prophets and of saints and of all who have been slain on the earth.”  Revelation 18:24

Unless you can explain how the blood of Abel is found in Jerusalem then yes, you need to look deeper, perhaps behind the scenes at the source.

Babylon is the kingdom of Satan, the destroying mountain, that influences the human race in rebellion and ungodliness.  Every once in a while a city epitomizes that and is allegorically referred to as "Babylon".  Think of it like magma under the earth's crust that wells up and produces a volcano that spews magma everywhere.  The volcano would be "Babylon" and the magma, Satan's influence.

 

Great critique! I've given a long answer but if you don't want to read it all, at least read the last section at the bottom. It answers your question.

I think this can be explained by harmonizing the texts and understanding how God views and exemplifies Israel. Look at Matthew. Here, Jesus is referring to the leaders of Jerusalem. He personifies them as Jerusalem.

• Mat 23:29-38  "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you build the tombs of the prophets and decorate the monuments of the righteous, (30)  saying, 'If we had lived in the days of our fathers, we would not have taken part with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.' (31)  Thus you witness against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. (32)  Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers. (33)  You serpents, you brood of vipers, how are you to escape being sentenced to hell? (34)  Therefore I send you prophets and wise men and scribes, some of whom you will kill and crucify, and some you will flog in your synagogues and persecute from town to town, (35)  so that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah the son of Barachiah, whom you murdered between the sanctuary and the altar. (36)  Truly, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation. (37)  "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often would I have gathered your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing! (38)  See, your house is left to you desolate.

I agree with you that Jesus is referring to Satan's offspring here. Especially when He says, "you are sons of those who murdered the prophets."  and "You serpents, you brood of vipers."  This can also be seen in Isa 14:12-22...

Isa 14:12-22   (12)  "How you are fallen from heaven, O Day Star, son of Dawn! How you are cut down to the ground, you who laid the nations low!  (13)  You said in your heart, 'I will ascend to heaven; above the stars of God I will set my throne on high; I will sit on the mount of assembly in the far reaches of the north;  (14)  I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will make myself like the Most High.'  (15)  But you are brought down to Sheol, to the far reaches of the pit.  (16)  Those who see you will stare at you and ponder over you: 'Is this the man who made the earth tremble, who shook kingdoms,  (17)  who made the world like a desert and overthrew its cities, who did not let his prisoners go home?'  (18)  All the kings of the nations lie in glory, each in his own tomb;  (19)  but you are cast out, away from your grave, like a loathed branch, clothed with the slain, those pierced by the sword, who go down to the stones of the pit, like a dead body trampled underfoot.  (20)  You will not be joined with them in burial, because you have destroyed your land, you have slain your people. "May the offspring of evildoers nevermore be named!  (21)  Prepare slaughter for his sons because of the guilt of their fathers, lest they rise and possess the earth, and fill the face of the world with cities."  (22)  "I will rise up against them," declares the LORD of hosts, "and will cut off from Babylon name and remnant, descendants and posterity," declares the LORD (23)"And I will make it a possession of the hedgehog, and pools of water, and I will sweep it with the broom of destruction," declares the LORD of hosts.  (24)  The LORD of hosts has sworn: "As I have planned, so shall it be, and as I have purposed, so shall it stand,  (25)  that I will break the Assyrian in my land, and on my mountains trample him underfoot; and his yoke shall depart from them, and his burden from their shoulder."  (26)  This is the purpose that is purposed concerning the whole earth, and this is the hand that is stretched out over all the nations.  (27)  For the LORD of hosts has purposed, and who will annul it? His hand is stretched out, and who will turn it back?  (28)  In the year that King Ahaz died came this oracle:  (29)  Rejoice not, O Philistia, all of you, that the rod that struck you is broken, for from the serpent's root will come forth an adder, and its fruit will be a flying fiery serpent.  (30)  And the firstborn of the poor will graze, and the needy lie down in safety; but I will kill your root with famine, and your remnant it will slay.  (31)  Wail, O gate; cry out, O city; melt in fear, O Philistia, all of you! For smoke comes out of the north, and there is no straggler in his ranks.  (32)  What will one answer the messengers of the nation? "The LORD has founded Zion, and in her the afflicted of his people find refuge."

That last verses after Isa 14:22-32 are very interesting because he again brings up Babylon in the context of Satan's offspring. You can see that God is going to destroy Babylon and all her children by "the Assyrian" who comes out of the north then get's trampled on Israel's mountains.  This is exactly the same scenario we see all throughout scripture revealing the anti-christ. Ezek. 38 lines up to this amazingly.

These evil children are always in reference to Israel. Not to say that Satan doesn't have children who are gentiles. A matter of fact many evil gentiles were those who attacked Israel but Israel was still the main focus. Scripture deals mainly with Israel's responsibility. These children of the devil go back in history. Look up "Children of Belial".

Keep in mind that Jesus's main priority and scripture's emphasis has always been Israel. Gentiles are a secondary people in His spiritual plan.

• Mat_2:6  "'And you, O Bethlehem, in the land of Judah, are by no means least among the rulers of Judah; for from you shall come a ruler who will shepherd my people Israel.'"
• Mat_15:24  He answered, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel."

There are two people groups in Israel from God's perspective. The spiritual and the carnal. He even calls one of them the 'Synagogue of Satan'.

• Rom 2:28-29  For no one is a Jew who is merely one outwardly, nor is circumcision outward and physical.  (29)  But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God.
• Rom_9:6  ... For not all who are descended from Israel belong to Israel,

My main argument here is that Jesus is still referring to the actual Jewish people and to their city Jerusalem when He calls them Babylon. They are the people that God has told his story from.

The book of Revelation is inspired by the same Spirit who wrote the rest of scripture and so we must see all that was written on the issue and harmonize it.

Through the Old and New Testament, the emphasis was on Israel and distinguishing between God's kingdom and Satan's kingdoms on earth. Jerusalem was meant to be a holy city, Zion, a people of God. His kingdom on earth. Instead, it became a leader in the devil's kingdom who murdered the Son of God and His offspring.

How much more Satanic can you get in murdering the Son of God?

• Act 7:51-52  "You stiff-necked people, uncircumcised in heart and ears, you always resist the Holy Spirit. As your fathers did, so do you.  (52)  Which of the prophets did your fathers not persecute? And they killed those who announced beforehand the coming of the Righteous One, whom you have now betrayed and murdered,

The Satanic children can be best represented by those of Israel who reject God. These represent the whore of Babylon. Ezekiel 16.

• Eze 16:38  And I will judge you as women who commit adultery and shed blood are judged, and bring upon you the blood of wrath and jealousy.

Israel is God's chosen people and when they rejected Him, He is going to judge them as Satan's children and not His.  All their guilt of unbelief will be paid back to them.

• Joh_8:44  You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father's desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks out of his own character, for he is a liar and the father of lies.
• Mat 8:11-12  I tell you, many will come from east and west and recline at table with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven, (12)  while the sons of the kingdom will be thrown into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

If they don't want to inherit God's blessings then they will inherit the Devil's reward. Anybody who goes to hell inherits the guilt of 'all who have been slain' on the earth by the very fact that they all go to the same place. It's only Israel's sin that is being focused in scripture.

• Mat_25:41  "Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

The history of Israel is documented from God's perspective. We see their struggle to be faithful and eventually their stories confirm Israel is a major part in God's salvation plan on earth. His judgment and restoration of them will signify the climax of the end of the world as we know it. A city can epitomize Satan but Israel epitomizes us sinners in the Biblical theology found in scripture. Their sin and fulfillment from law covenant to grace covenant is the basis for establishing the spiritual teachings of the New Testament.

• Rev 18:24  And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

Remember, Israel was a physical representation of spiritual realities. They had prophetic types and shadows that had spiritual fulfillment in Christ. Their physical restoration is a picture of our spiritual restoration. Their guilt is a picture of all guilt.

• Jas 2:10  For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

Anybody who dies under the law is guilty of it all. Even "all the slain on earth." We know that it was Israel's specific sin in wanting to remain under law. They were self righteous and refused to receive the gift of God in Christ by faith..

• Rom_10:3  For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

Praise God he will deliver us from our sins as He will also deliver them!

• Rom_10:4  For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
• Gal 4:31  So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 10, 2016 by unworthydude

[MorningGlory]

3 hours ago, simplejeff said:

https://www.thebereancall.org/content/january-2004-q-and-a-5

"Question:  Why does Revelation:18:24

And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

say that in her (the Roman Church) was found the blood of prophets, and of saints and of all that were slain upon the earth ? Clearly some people were slain by robbers, wild animals, Muslim terrorists, etc.

Answer:  Christ makes a similar statement: “That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth...all...shall come upon this generation” (Mt 23:35,36). Why would one generation be considered guilty for all the murders committed against the “righteous”? For the same reason that by simply partaking of the forbidden fruit, Adam and Eve were cast out of the Garden, and death came upon all mankind. No matter how small their “crime” may seem, it was rebellion against God—and that is the essence of all sin.

Moreover, Christ is not speaking of one particular generation of people living at any particular time in history. He used “generation” in a descriptive sense: “generation of vipers” (Mt 23:33); “faithless and perverse generation” (Mt 17:17; Mk 9:19; Lk 9:41); “wicked generation” (Mt 12:45); “evil and adulterous generation” (Mt 12:39), etc. Those who are characterized by unbelief, evil, and rebellion against God are guilty of every sin. Thus James says, “whosoever shall...offend in one point [of the law] he is guilty of all”(Jas 2:10). Breaking even one of the Ten Commandments in any way is rebellion against God, which could not be forgiven by a righteous, holy God except by Christ’s payment for sin upon the cross. Thus it cannot be said that Christ only died for the sins of certain people and not for others. He had to pay for Adam’s sin, that is, for sin itself.

Consequently, the false church, which has promulgated a false gospel that sends to eternal damnation those who believe it, is guilty of the death of everyone (i.e., of death itself). Just as Adam’s sin brought death upon all, so the denial of the only remedy by the false church maintains the power of that universal death."

 

 

Do you HAVE to bring the RCC into EVERYTHING?  This topic is not about Rome!  Good grief.

[MorningGlory]

29 minutes ago, Davida said:

Unfortunately, it's unavoidable as many think it could be about the Rcc .  

[other one]

http://skywatchtv.com/2016/01/07/new-age-superstar-deepak-chopra-believes-petrus-romanus-can-become-the-holy-man-of-the-world-in-2016-through-manifesting-a-third-form-of-jesus/

[thereselittleflower]

47 minutes ago, Davida said:

Unfortunately, it's unavoidable as many think it could be about the Rcc .  

Given Jesus' words, it's pretty darn clear it's Jerusalem.

 

    

[thereselittleflower]

3 minutes ago, Davida said:

I don't think for one moment it is Jerusalem.

We'll have to agree to disagree.

 

[other one]

12 minutes ago, Davida said:

Wow, what demonic garbage....and back in the early 90's I shamefully attended some of his lectures before I was Born again in Christ.  Thanks and all Praise to God the FATHER of our blessed Lord Jesus Christ He opened my eyes and saved me out of bondage!

just showing an example of some of those who put this on the pope.

[thereselittleflower]

     

25 minutes ago, other one said:

just showing an example of some of those who put this on the pope.

How is linking to a New Ager helping anything?

 

[other one]

7 minutes ago, thereselittleflower said:

     

How is linking to a New Ager helping anything?

 

I'm not at all sure how to answer that question...

[Ezra]

Babylon is neither Rome nor Jerusalem. Why can't we accept the fact that all three cities are against Christ and all will be judged? And all three will play a part in the schemes of the Antichrist.