Pope calls for worldwide abolition of death penalty

[missmuffet]

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/pope-calls-worldwide-abolition-death-penalty-n523016

VATICAN CITY — Pope Francis on Sunday called for the worldwide abolition of the death penalty, saying the commandment "You shall not kill" was absolute and equally valid for the guilty as for the innocent.

Using some of his strongest words ever against capital punishment, he also called on Catholic politicians worldwide to make "a courageous and exemplary gesture" by seeking a moratorium on executions during the Church's current Holy Year, which ends in November.

"I appeal to the consciences of those who govern to reach an international consensus to abolish the death penalty," he told tens of thousands of people in St. Peter's Square.

[HAZARD]

5 minutes ago, bopeep1909 said:

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/pope-calls-worldwide-abolition-death-penalty-n523016

VATICAN CITY — Pope Francis on Sunday called for the worldwide abolition of the death penalty, saying the commandment "You shall not kill" was absolute and equally valid for the guilty as for the innocent.

Using some of his strongest words ever against capital punishment, he also called on Catholic politicians worldwide to make "a courageous and exemplary gesture" by seeking a moratorium on executions during the Church's current Holy Year, which ends in November.

"I appeal to the consciences of those who govern to reach an international consensus to abolish the death penalty," he told tens of thousands of people in St. Peter's Square.

Its easy to see why this church is in error on many things. He seems to think he knows more than God Himself has revealed. The death penalty is God ordained.

The Old Testament law's have been done away with when they were fulfilled in Christ and after they had served their purpose. "I am come to fulfill the law . . . one jot or tittle shall no wise pass from the law, till all be fuliflled" (Matt. 5:17-18). "The law prophesied untill John" (Luke 16:16). "All things must be fulfilled which was spoken in the law of Moses" (Luke 24:44). "For the priesthood being changed, there is made necessity a change also of the law" (Heb. 7:12).

What about the death penalty for murder? Has this law been done away with, or was it instituted by God for "Perpetual generations," as an "Everlasting Covenant?"

Many followers of Jesus Christ ask themselves, Is the Death penalty lawful in this age? Do men have the right to change some Law's of God? And, Does God condone the Death Penalty.

If we are believers in the Bible, then we must believe that God instituted the death penalty. Here's why.

When God instituted human government by law after Noah's flood, He gave Noah certain laws by which to govern the human race, and man was then held responsible for self-government (Read Gen. 9:1-7).

There are six very important laws which God gave Noah and his decendants. These Laws were:

(1) "Be fruitful and multply, and replenish the earth" (Gen. 9:1, 7).

(2) "Into thine hand are they [animals] delivered" (Gen. 9:2).

(3) "Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have i given you all things" (Gen. 9:4).

(4) "The blood thereof shall ye not eat" (Gen. 9:4).

(5) "WHOSOEVER SHEDDETH MAN'S BLOOD, BY MAN SHALL HIS BLOOD BY SHED: for in the image of God made he him" (Gen. 9:5-6).

And last but not least;

(6) "I have established my covenant with you . . . . . . . . . .. . . . . . . . FOR PERPETUAL GENERATIONS . . . the bow shall be in the cloud; and I will look upon it, that I may remember the "EVERLASTING COVENANT" between God and every living creature of all flesh that is upon the earth" (Gen. 9:8-17).

These few laws have been the basis of all laws of God and man in every age since the flood of Noah.

It was at this time God constituted capital punishment, and God has never revoked this particular law, "Whosoever sheddeth man's blood, BY MAN shall HIS BLOOD BE SHED (Gen. 9:5-6)." This law will continue as an eternal law, and as is revealed in (Isiah 11:4-9; 65:20-25) it will be in force even during the Millennium.

That this law will be in force during the Millennium is plainly reaffirmed in (Rom. 13:1-6), in which the apostle Paul taught that even in this age of grace, law-enforcement officers are ordained of God, and that they are His ministers to bear "not the sword in vain" but that they are supposed to "execute wrath upon him that doeth evil."

It is totally necessary for human governments to punish criminals according to the crimes committed. Human governments are part of the moral government of God. That God has instituted human governments to help Him secure this end is not only clear in Gen. 9 and Rom. 13, but also in many other passages (Dan. 2:21; 4:17-25; 5:21; 1 Pet. 2:13-14).

All administrators of human government, when they rule contrary to the law of God will be punished in due time by God for mismanagement of their authority. God never sanctions selfish and wicked administration of authority, and if such continues long it will be overthrown. Men are under obligation to obey human government when, and as long as the requirements are not inconsistent with the moral law's of God.

Christians must always obey "every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the King, as supreem; or unto govenors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evil doers, and for the praise of them that do well. For such is the will of God, that with well doing ye may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men" (1 Pet. 2:13-17).

Many Christians argue that it is sinful to partake in politics, that it is contrary to the Bible because human government is maintained by force, and that force is contrary with the spirit of the gospel. These are false theories. Human government was instituted by God as shown above, and Christians are commanded in the New Testament to pay taxes and otherwise support government (Read Rom. 13:1-7; 1 Pet. 2:13-17).

Some argue the commandment, "Thou shalt not kill" (Deut 5:17), prevents government from administering capital punishment. The commandment "Thou shalt not kill" means exactly what it says, that men shall not kill any other human being; but, if a man sheds another mans blood, in other words, if a man ignores Deut 5:17, and commits murder, then the everlasting covenant law, "whosoever sheds man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed," comes into being.

This same principle applies to mobs, insurrections, rebellions, and all wars that endanger the best good of being and of the universe. It is the right of government and all of its subjects, to use every possible means to suppress all rebellion and wars, which are merely crime turned loose on a massive scale. That war is necessary under certain circumstances is clear from the fact that moral law permits it and God has commanded it. Earthly governments are God's ministers to execute law upon the ungodly and to preserve moral law and government for the good of all, and they are under obligation to make war, if this is the only way to preserve the best public good for all. We know that elfish and unjust war is wholesale murder and the administrators of such wars will be punished by God in due time.

God, in replenishing the human race after the flood of Noah instituted human government and capital punishment for serious crime involving murder. He has never changed this "everlasting covenant" and so, this is still God's will for men and human governments.

[thereselittleflower]

10 minutes ago, bopeep1909 said:

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/pope-calls-worldwide-abolition-death-penalty-n523016

VATICAN CITY — Pope Francis on Sunday called for the worldwide abolition of the death penalty, saying the commandment "You shall not kill" was absolute and equally valid for the guilty as for the innocent.

Using some of his strongest words ever against capital punishment, he also called on Catholic politicians worldwide to make "a courageous and exemplary gesture" by seeking a moratorium on executions during the Church's current Holy Year, which ends in November.

"I appeal to the consciences of those who govern to reach an international consensus to abolish the death penalty," he told tens of thousands of people in St. Peter's Square.

I don't think this is possible.

 

[missmuffet]

Question: "What does the Bible say about the death penalty / capital punishment?"

Answer: The Old Testament law commanded the death penalty for various acts: murder (Exodus 21:12), kidnapping (Exodus 21:16), bestiality (Exodus 22:19), adultery (Leviticus 20:10), homosexuality (Leviticus 20:13), being a false prophet (Deuteronomy 13:5), prostitution and rape (Deuteronomy 22:24), and several other crimes. However, God often showed mercy when the death penalty was due. David committed adultery and murder, yet God did not demand his life be taken (2 Samuel 11:1-5, 14-17; 2 Samuel 12:13). Ultimately, every sin we commit should result in the death penalty because the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23). Thankfully, God demonstrates His love for us in not condemning us (Romans 5:8).

When the Pharisees brought a woman who was caught in the act of adultery to Jesus and asked Him if she should be stoned, Jesus replied, “If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her” (John 8:7). This should not be used to indicate that Jesus rejected capital punishment in all instances. Jesus was simply exposing the hypocrisy of the Pharisees. The Pharisees wanted to trick Jesus into breaking the Old Testament law; they did not truly care about the woman being stoned (where was the man who was caught in adultery?) God is the One who instituted capital punishment: “Whoever sheds man's blood, by man his blood shall be shed, for in the image of God He made man” (Genesis 9:6). Jesus would support capital punishment in some instances. Jesus also demonstrated grace when capital punishment was due (John 8:1-11). The apostle Paul definitely recognized the power of the government to institute capital punishment where appropriate (Romans 13:1-7).

How should a Christian view the death penalty? First, we must remember that God has instituted capital punishment in His Word; therefore, it would be presumptuous of us to think that we could institute a higher standard. God has the highest standard of any being; He is perfect. This standard applies not only to us but to Himself. Therefore, He loves to an infinite degree, and He has mercy to an infinite degree. We also see that He has wrath to an infinite degree, and it is all maintained in a perfect balance.

Second, we must recognize that God has given government the authority to determine when capital punishment is due (Genesis 9:6; Romans 13:1-7). It is unbiblical to claim that God opposes the death penalty in all instances. Christians should never rejoice when the death penalty is employed, but at the same time, Christians should not fight against the government’s right to execute the perpetrators of the most evil of crimes.

http://www.gotquestions.org/death-penalty.html

[other one]

Well, I personally don't have a problem with doing away with the death penalty, but he should get his Bible strait.  It says thou shalt not murder, not kill.

I think he will have a lot more problem with Islam than he will with us.

[thereselittleflower]

This is what I struggle with concerning the death penalty.

God wants all to be saved.

When one is executed, then one has had their chance to be saved ended by other men in the name of justice.

I think it is commendable to want them to have the opportunity to repent until God takes their life, and if we can, as christians do so, we should, for this is eternity we are talking about.

 

 

[missmuffet]

18 minutes ago, thereselittleflower said:

This is what I struggle with concerning the death penalty.

God wants all to be saved.

When one is executed, then one has had their chance to be saved ended by other men in the name of justice.

I think it is commendable to want them to have the opportunity to repent until God takes their life, and if we can, as christians do so, we should, for this is eternity we are talking about.

 

 

But what does the Bible say? Not what we want or think should be done but what does God want?

It comes down to....Do we listen to the Pope or do we go by what the Bible says? They definitely are not on the same page.

[thereselittleflower]

51 minutes ago, bopeep1909 said:

But what does the Bible say? Not what we want or think should be done but what does God want?

It comes down to....Do we listen to the Pope or do we go by what the Bible says? They definitely are not on the same page.

The scriptures about the death penalty were given when God also said  "an eye for an eye" "a tooth for a tooth".

Jesus takes us beyond that.  Jesus said:

• Love Your Enemies
  _{Matt 5}   38"You have heard that it was said, 'AN EYE FOR AN EYE, AND A TOOTH FOR A TOOTH.' 39"But I say to you, do not resist an evil person; but whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also 40"If anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, let him have your coat also. 41"Whoever forces you to go one mile, go with him two  42"Give to him who asks of you, and do not turn away from him who wants to borrow from you. 43"You have heard that it was said, 'YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR and hate your enemy.' 44"But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven; for He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous.

This principle does not fit at all with the  "an eye for an eye" principle which the death penalty goes hand in hand with.

 

 

[junobet]

 

The Pope is absolutely right!

The Old Testament laws about the death penalty, that you’ve quoted here eagerly as Pharisees, are in the same category as Deuteronomy 24:1 as quoted in Matthew:

“It was because of your hardness of heart that Moses allowed you …” (Mt 19:8)

Reevaluating these laws in the light of Christ makes it absolutely clear to me that they are overruled by another: “Do not take revenge, my dear friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay," says the Lord.” (Rom 12:19)

That’s all the death penalty is about: revenge. But Christ told us taught us about mercy, forgiveness and giving sinners second chances.

Love,

junobet

Edited February 21, 2016 by junobet

[thereselittleflower]

5 minutes ago, junobet said:

 

The Pope is absolutely right!

The Old Testament laws about the death penalty, that you’ve quoted here eagerly as Pharisees, are in the same category as Deuteronomy 24:1 as quoted in Matthew:

“It was because of your hardness of heart that Moses allowed you …” (Mt 19:8)

Reevaluating these laws in the light of Christ makes it absolutely clear to me that they are overruled by another: “Do not take revenge, my dear friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay," says the Lord.” (Rom 12:19)

That’s all the death penalty is about: revenge. But Christ told us taught us about mercy, forgiveness and giving sinners second chances.

Love,

junobet

Even in the Old Testament there were cities of refuge.  If one made it to one of those cities, even the death penalty didn't apply to them.