pre trib rapture is fake true or false

[Montana Marv]

1 hour ago, Last Daze said:

How can you be so sure that your imagined end-time scenario is how things will play out?  Prophecy will be fulfilled according to the will of God, not the imaginations of men.

Prophecy will be fulfilled because of the will of God.  It has already been proclaimed in Scripture, so it is already set in concrete.  God cannot go back on what has been prophesied.  Now it will be the carrying out process as it was was Proclaimed in Scripture.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Montana Marv]

Now have any of you heard about "blockchain".  The digital transfer of monies instantly.  Just saw it financial news today.  They have been trying it out.  Something to think about.

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Last Daze]

34 minutes ago, Montana Marv said:

It has already been proclaimed in Scripture, so it is already set in concrete.  God cannot go back on what has been prophesied.  Now it will be the carrying out process as it was was Proclaimed in Scripture.

Absolutely.  And may we all be open to the Holy Spirit's guidance.

• But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come.  John 16:13

 

[n2thelight]

On 5/1/2016 at 9:55 AM, Montana Marv said:

n2thelight

What you posted describes some of the daily walk for the Believer.  This has been going on since Pentecost.  So what is your point.

From your last sentence It appears that you are unable to witness to Unbelievers,  either you are a Secret Service type of believer, or you are an Unbeliever and not controlled by the Holy Spirit.  Start by handing out Bibles in a School, you will probably arrested and booked by the police, then you will appear before a Judge, Here is your chance.

In Christ

Montana Marv

You got it twisted,the next time true tongues will be spoken is when the elect are delivered up...Everybody on here should have a Bible,yet they still don't know the truth....

You don't understand what Im saying,it's more than just handing out bible's,heck you can find them in hotel rooms...

 

When I appear before the judge(synagouges) of satan that's when the Spirit shall speak through me,in other words when that time come,it will be just like then,meaning though I'll speak in my tongue(english)all shall hear me in their native language,thats the evidence of the Holy Spirit....

 

All I see from rapturist is them wanting to escape,yet Christ told me to endure till the end,which I shall...

[coheir]

20 minutes ago, n2thelight said:

You got it twisted,the next time true tongues will be spoken is when the elect are delivered up...Everybody on here should have a Bible,yet they still don't know the truth....

You don't understand what Im saying,it's more than just handing out bible's,heck you can find them in hotel rooms...

 

When I appear before the judge(synagouges) of satan that's when the Spirit shall speak through me,in other words when that time come,it will be just like then,meaning though I'll speak in my tongue(english)all shall hear me in their native language,thats the evidence of the Holy Spirit....

 

All I see from rapturist is them wanting to escape,yet Christ told me to endure till the end,which I shall...

Quote] When I appear before the judge(synagouges) of satan [Quote

believers do not stand before Satan for judgement

[Esther4:14]

13 minutes ago, coheir said:

Quote] When I appear before the judge(synagouges) of satan [Quote

believers do not stand before Satan for judgement

"And ye shall be brought to the governors and kings for my sake, in witness to them, and to the Gentiles.

19 But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that hour, what ye shall say.

20 For it is not ye that speak, but the spirit of your Father which speaketh in you" (Matthew 10:18-20)

[n2thelight]

3 hours ago, coheir said:

Quote] When I appear before the judge(synagouges) of satan [Quote

believers do not stand before Satan for judgement

Keep up,nowhere did I say that,but since you don't know...

Mark 13:11 "But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost [Spirit]." This will be the next time true tongues shall be spoken

[coheir]

8 hours ago, coheir said:

9 hours ago, n2thelight said:

You got it twisted,the next time true tongues will be spoken is when the elect are delivered up...Everybody on here should have a Bible,yet they still don't know the truth....

You don't understand what Im saying,it's more than just handing out bible's,heck you can find them in hotel rooms...

 

When I appear before the judge(synagouges) of satan that's when the Spirit shall speak through me,in other words when that time come,it will be just like then,meaning though I'll speak in my tongue(english)all shall hear me in their native language,thats the evidence of the Holy Spirit....

 

All I see from rapturist is them wanting to escape,yet Christ told me to endure till the end,which I shall...

you did say it in the sentence that starts with the word WHEN

[Omegaman 3.0]

On 5/1/2016 at 7:26 AM, Montana Marv said:

How attainable is it for one to reach a Post-Trib rapture.  Very, very, very few if any will reach it.

Yet for a Pre 70th Week Rapture, it is very attainable for all.

Well, Jesus said if those days were not cut short, no flesh would survive (Matt 24:22), so yes, sounds like not so many will make it through the great tribulation. Of course, that does not matter, since those believers who would die in the trib, will be there with Jesus in the clouds (1 Thess 4:15) before those raptured will be (which itself sounds like pretrib is not possible).

The Pre 70th Week Rapture would be attainable for many, only under one condition, and that condition is that such an early rapture would have to actually exist. So far as I can see, no one has ever posted a verse or passage anywhere on this entire forum, that demonstrates that will be the case.

Pre-tribbers often seem to think that the pre-trib rapture is the blessed hope, My hope is Jesus Himself, at His appearing (which just happens to be after the trib, according to scripture), or should we think all believers who have died so far, including Paul who was looking forward to the blessed hope, are excluded from that hope. Do you think that only one generation of believers will have a blessed hope?

[Omegaman 3.0]

52 minutes ago, Cletus said:

it actually says in that passage for the elects sake.  meaning not been raptured yet.  and still on earth.  Mat 24:22  And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

also would like to point out that when you see the words those days, look into the greek and hebrew words.  it speaks on a very specific time. 

It sure does say that Cletus. In these discussions, there is disagreement in what that means, what is meant by "the elect"?

Pre-tribbers often assert that there is  Jewish context in that passage, and therefore, the elect is a reference to God's chosen people, the Jews. 

If this were the only thing we had to do on, I could agree with their assessment, or at least say it had merit. However, even if that were true, that does not assure us of a pre-trib rapture, that idea still remains one, not introduced to us in scripture, and if we agreed that it means the Jews, then all that implies is that Matt 24 is less persuasive as a post-trib proof test. That seems to be the main thrust of the pre-trib position though - if it doesn't say it is not pre-trib, then pre-trib must be true. Pre-tribism is essentially a collection of arguments from silence,  speculations, wishful thinking, and redefining of terms, mixed with unfounded inferences and verses out of context, but other than these small issues, it has a lot to recommend it.

Of course, I see no compelling reason why the elect in Matt 24, cannot mean the elect, as it is used in the rest of the New Testament, where it refers to those chosen in Christ, to inherit salvation. Seen in that way, it still harmonizes with all of the other passages that at face value, indicate that the rapture, occurs at Jesus' visible return pictured in Matt 24 where we are informed that:

 “Therefore when you see the ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION which was spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand), then those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains. “Whoever is on the housetop must not go down to get the things out that are in his house. “Whoever is in the field must not turn back to get his cloak. “But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! “But pray that your flight will not be in the winter, or on a Sabbath. “For then there will be a great tribulation, such as has not occurred since the beginning of the world until now, nor ever will.

and . . .

“But immediately after the tribulation of those days THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. “And then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the SON OF MAN COMING ON THE CLOUDS OF THE SKY with power and great glory. “And He will send forth His angels with A GREAT TRUMPET and THEY WILL GATHER TOGETHER His elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other.

You are right, that this speaks to a specific time, Jesus pointed us to the book of Daniel, where we see the abomination spoken of, and the time of trouble, that will be unequaled in all of history or the future.

Also, I never noticed before, but it says the will gather HIS elect . . .

that sounds also, like Christians, not the chosen people, Israel, just an observation