Sermon that made me uneasy

[SIC]

On 6/11/2016 at 8:13 AM, RustyAngeL said:

I would almost be tempted to ask your preacher what characteristic he has?  And as was stated not one of us is perfect.

 

That's the thing that made me uncomfortable. By the way he preached he was kind of implying that he had none of these characteristics. Quite the opposite of Paul who called himself as the chief of sinners

[JohnD]

On 6/8/2016 at 9:49 AM, The_Patriot2016 said:

I think there are times when we all act like Pharisees, to one extent or another. Just food for thought.

fueled most often by overzealous religious fanatic overkill

[JohnD]

Look at creation. Look at the plan of salvation. God is very pragmatic.

[JohnD]

Whipping people up into a frenzy about nothing is easy, the media does it all the time.

Don't be chumped!

[Guest]

On ‎6‎/‎8‎/‎2016 at 4:40 PM, Butero said:

I am saying you would have to hold the position of Pharisee to be a Pharisee, just like you would have to hold the office of President to be the President.  It was an office.  Another problem is that not all Pharisees believed exactly the same and they didn't all teach the same things.  Some even believed in Jesus and others didn't.  I don't see how that is even debatable. 

Pharisee is not an office...............It is a sect.

They preached traditions as though they were doctrines from God. This was not law from the seat of Moses. This tradition of Men, later became oral law. The Talmud is Pharisaic....................

The seat of Moses was AN OFFICE..................Which was to decide the difficult cases that the lower courts could not decide.

The Pharisees in the time of Christ were the Judges...But the sect of the Sadducees were the priests. The seat of Moses spoke no law apart from the agreement of the High priest which stood as chief justice to make law.

Joh 11:49  And one of them, named Caiaphas, being the high priest that same year, said unto them, Ye know nothing at all,
Joh 11:51  And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for that nation;
Joh 18:13  And led him away to Annas first; for he was father in law to Caiaphas, which was the high priest that same year

BTW, there was no office or seat given in Moses law to teach and inform concerning the afterlife, ETC. The rulers in the law were to Judge causes between the people.

[Guest Butero]

31 minutes ago, Joline said:

Pharisee is not an office...............It is a sect.

They preached traditions as though they were doctrines from God. This was not law from the seat of Moses. This tradition of Men, later became oral law. The Talmud is Pharisaic....................

The seat of Moses was AN OFFICE..................Which was to decide the difficult cases that the lower courts could not decide.

The Pharisees in the time of Christ were the Judges...But the sect of the Sadducees were the priests. The seat of Moses spoke no law apart from the agreement of the High priest which stood as chief justice to make law.

Joh 11:49  And one of them, named Caiaphas, being the high priest that same year, said unto them, Ye know nothing at all,
Joh 11:51  And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for that nation;
Joh 18:13  And led him away to Annas first; for he was father in law to Caiaphas, which was the high priest that same year

BTW, there was no office or seat given in Moses law to teach and inform concerning the afterlife, ETC. The rulers in the law were to Judge causes between the people.

THEN spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:  All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do, but do not ye after their works:  for they say, and do not.  Matthew 23:1,2

[Guest]

17 minutes ago, Butero said:

THEN spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:  All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do, but do not ye after their works:  for they say, and do not.  Matthew 23:1,2

Right, they spoke from the seat of Moses as JUDGES in the Sanhedrin. What they DID as a sect was not from that seat. The seat of Moses was stil ruled over by the high priest as Chief Justice. They were to adjudicate law, not legislate law..............

Deut 17:8  If there arise a matter too hard for thee in judgment, between blood and blood, between plea and plea, and between stroke and stroke, being matters of controversy within thy gates: then shalt thou arise, and get thee up into the place which the LORD thy God shall choose;
9  And thou shalt come unto the priests the Levites, and unto the judge that shall be in those days, and enquire; and they shall shew thee the sentence of judgment:
10  And thou shalt do according to the sentence, which they of that place which the LORD shall choose shall shew thee; and thou shalt observe to do according to all that they inform (teach) thee:
11  According to the sentence (mouth, oral) of the law which they shall teach thee, and according to the judgment which they shall tell thee, thou shalt do: thou shalt not decline from the sentence (mouth, oral) which they shall shew thee, to the right hand, nor to the left.
12  And the man that will do presumptuously, and will not hearken unto the priest that standeth to minister there before the LORD thy God, or unto the judge, even that man shall die: and thou shalt put away the evil from Israel. {and will…: Heb. not to hearken }
13  And all the people shall hear, and fear, and do no more presumptuously.

De 21:5  And the priests the sons of Levi shall come near; for them the LORD thy God hath chosen to minister unto him, and to bless in the name of the LORD; and by their word shall every controversy and every stroke be tried:

Mal 2:7  For the priest’s lips should keep knowledge, and they should seek the law at his mouth: for he is the messenger of the LORD of hosts.

 

The high priests had access to an answer directly from God himself. The urim and thumim could be used to decide the cases to difficult..........

there was absolutely no need for an ORAL LAW, like the Pharisees claim. Rather God Gave oral law through the high priest, from the breastplate of judgment which held  the urim ad thumim.

 

[Guest]

37 minutes ago, Joline said:

Right, they spoke from the seat of Moses as JUDGES in the Sanhedrin. What they DID as a sect was not from that seat. The seat of Moses was stil ruled over by the high priest as Chief Justice. They were to adjudicate law, not legislate law..............

Deut 17:8  If there arise a matter too hard for thee in judgment, between blood and blood, between plea and plea, and between stroke and stroke, being matters of controversy within thy gates: then shalt thou arise, and get thee up into the place which the LORD thy God shall choose;
9  And thou shalt come unto the priests the Levites, and unto the judge that shall be in those days, and enquire; and they shall shew thee the sentence of judgment:
10  And thou shalt do according to the sentence, which they of that place which the LORD shall choose shall shew thee; and thou shalt observe to do according to all that they inform (teach) thee:
11  According to the sentence (mouth, oral) of the law which they shall teach thee, and according to the judgment which they shall tell thee, thou shalt do: thou shalt not decline from the sentence (mouth, oral) which they shall shew thee, to the right hand, nor to the left.
12  And the man that will do presumptuously, and will not hearken unto the priest that standeth to minister there before the LORD thy God, or unto the judge, even that man shall die: and thou shalt put away the evil from Israel. {and will…: Heb. not to hearken }
13  And all the people shall hear, and fear, and do no more presumptuously.

De 21:5  And the priests the sons of Levi shall come near; for them the LORD thy God hath chosen to minister unto him, and to bless in the name of the LORD; and by their word shall every controversy and every stroke be tried:

Mal 2:7  For the priest’s lips should keep knowledge, and they should seek the law at his mouth: for he is the messenger of the LORD of hosts.

 

The high priests had access to an answer directly from God himself. The urim and thumim could be used to decide the cases to difficult..........

there was absolutely no need for an ORAL LAW, like the Pharisees claim. Rather God Gave oral law through the high priest, from the breastplate of judgment which held  the urim ad thumim.

 

De 21:5  And the priests the sons of Levi shall come near; for them the LORD thy God hath chosen to minister unto him, and to bless in the name of the LORD; and by their word shall every controversy and every stroke be tried:

Traditions of men for doctrine.

Mt 23:23  Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

Mt 23:4  For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men’s shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.

Le 16:14  And he shall take of the blood of the bullock, and sprinkle it with his finger upon the mercy seat eastward; and before the mercy seat shall he sprinkle of the blood with his finger seven times.
 

Mt 18:21  Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
Mt 18:22  Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven

Nu 19:4  And Eleazar the priest shall take of her blood with his finger, and sprinkle of her blood directly before the tabernacle of the congregation seven times: