Pie Posted January 25, 2017 Group: Members Followers: 3 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 45 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 63 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/18/2017 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/24/1987 Share Posted January 25, 2017 In almost every case I would be against abortion. But as already mentioned when the mother's life is in jeopardy, I don't think we should remove the right for her to make that choice. If she chooses to die for her child, that is one thing. But making her die by removing the option is quite another. Also, in cases whether the mother's life is a major concern.. typically the child's is also. Not always, but typically. So it's possible you could wind up with a dead mother and baby. And for those who are quick to jump to the notion that the mother should die for her child. What if the mother is your 16 year old daughter? Would you want her to die for her child? It's easy as a spectator to judge something we've never had to go through. It's a choice I hope I would never have to make. (Even more so if there's a good chance you both die). To kill your own child for the sake of your own life would be absolutely terrible. But I wouldn't take that right from someone because at that point it involves two lives hanging in the balance. And I don't think we should be able to judge which life is more valuable. That should be up to the mother. But that's just my opinion. I would agree with you on the rape scenario. It's a child. It's innocent. It doesn't need to pay with its life for the mistakes of its father. Adoption is a far better option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTC Posted January 25, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 200 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 2,795 Content Per Day: 0.65 Reputation: 1,502 Days Won: 1 Joined: 06/25/2012 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/26/1952 Share Posted January 25, 2017 There is another reason to consider an abortion that hasn't been mentioned yet. This brings up another issue that is a terrible thing in and of itself. I'm talking about a baby that going to be born addicted and especially to Heroin. There are women that are addicted to heroin and then they go ahead and get pregnant and some do it to then sell the baby. There were posts on a drug board about 4 yrs ago by such a woman. This is how i know. We don't know what kind of life a child born addicted will face but maybe it's not something worth living. Btw, the woman who did this had done it more than once and she intended to keep doing it. She was then banned from that board. But babies that are coming into this world already addicted maybe should be aborted. Because even though the baby is weaned off the drug I wonder if it creates a predisposition in that person for that drug. So if the baby was addicted to Heroin what will happen if as a teenager the person breaks a leg. The Doc gives them some pain killers and then for an unknown reason the person can't stop using opiates. They often say things like they feel like they went home. Maybe it's because since the day they were conceived they had an opiate in their blood. That's a horrible life to live. I also think we need to stop women who do this from ever getting pregnant again. That may sound barbaric but there are so many wonderful women who can't get pregnant. We don't know why these things happen but they do. I just don't like women who allow themselves to get pregnant while they are addicted. They have no respect for life, much less for God. I think we should prevent such women from ever getting pregnant again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 4 minutes ago, JTC said: There is another reason to consider an abortion that hasn't been mentioned yet. This brings up another issue that is a terrible thing in and of itself. I'm talking about a baby that going to be born addicted and especially to Heroin. There are women that are addicted to heroin and then they go ahead and get pregnant and some do it to then sell the baby. There were posts on a drug board about 4 yrs ago by such a woman. This is how i know. We don't know what kind of life a child born addicted will face but maybe it's not something worth living. Btw, the woman who did this had done it more than once and she intended to keep doing it. She was then banned from that board. But babies that are coming into this world already addicted maybe should be aborted. Because even though the baby is weaned off the drug I wonder if it creates a predisposition in that person for that drug. So if the baby was addicted to Heroin what will happen if as a teenager the person breaks a leg. The Doc gives them some pain killers and then for an unknown reason the person can't stop using opiates. They often say things like they feel like they went home. Maybe it's because since the day they were conceived they had an opiate in their blood. That's a horrible life to live. I also think we need to stop women who do this from ever getting pregnant again. That may sound barbaric but there are so many wonderful women who can't get pregnant. We don't know why these things happen but they do. I just don't like women who allow themselves to get pregnant while they are addicted. They have no respect for life, much less for God. I think we should prevent such women from ever getting pregnant again. It is not up to us to decide who will have a life worth living. Abortion is murder pure and simple and there is no justification for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 3 hours ago, Pie said: In almost every case I would be against abortion. But as already mentioned when the mother's life is in jeopardy, I don't think we should remove the right for her to make that choice. Except no abortion has ever been performed to save a woman's life AND we have amazing medical advancements that can save the life of the mother and the baby. For example, surgeons can perform open heart surgery on babies still in the womb. There are so many things doctors can do to address problems early on and save both mother and child. Abortion clinics are a business and they do not serve the best interests of women. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayne Posted January 25, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 107 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 3,820 Content Per Day: 1.30 Reputation: 4,806 Days Won: 2 Joined: 03/31/2016 Status: Offline Share Posted January 25, 2017 I am also opposed to abortion, but there are a few scenarios where I would not be strong and would need great help in making a decision. [1] If I had a 9 or 10 year old granddaughter and she is raped by her father or uncle or cousin and I find out about it either that day or even a week or two later, I am scooping that baby up and ya'll had better get out of my way because if it hasn't already been done, I am taking her to the emergency room to be flushed out - a D & C - if necessary. Pregnancy would not be on my mind, but her health, safety, and the elimination of any potential STD's would be what would motivate me. 8 and 9 year old girls are raped around the world with frequency and many of them have born children. [2] If I and her family did not find out about the rape until she were visibly pregnant, we would NOT nonchalantly nor piously say, "no abortion". This pregnancy would be a devastating thing and the child would need SERIOUS counseling and medical care throughout the entire pregnancy and beyond. Can you imagine a 9-year-old carrying her father's or uncle's child? It happens. Even a grown adult woman who is raped needs tremendous counseling if she decides to carry the baby and put it up for adoption. None of this is black and white. We must be against the killing of babies because it is barbaric and hideous, but we cannot be clinical about it or unconcerned about the mother and the circumstances in which she got pregnant. [3] If I or a friend or family member had an ectopic pregnancy [what we used to call a tubal pregnancy], I would hope that the doctors watched that very guardedly. I have a Christian ob/gyn who does not perform any surgeries anymore because he doesn't want to perform abortions. There are a lot of doctors out there like that. They have given up a lucrative part of their field because of their consciences. But I would hope that a doctor like this would be Christ-like and gentle when the time comes to decide whether the pregnancy is viable or not. Some ectopic pregnancies where the embryo unfortunately escapes the womb, but can get to abdominal organ and attached itself to a quality blood supply are viable and babies have been born that way. But most "tubal" pregnancies will cause eruptions of the Fallopian tubes and could cause life-threatening blood loss. In these cases, as I said, if the doctor were a believer and opposed abortion, I would cling to the LORD and to the counsel of the doctor and when the time came that that the pregnancy could not continue, the fetus would have to be removed with great sadness. [4] I would never waiver if there were something wrong with the baby that could either be corrected or a child could live a life with. Mental retardation, missing limbs, and such would never make me want to destroy an unborn child. God may take a child like that, but the doctor won't. But...... **warning - this last scenario is a little gruesome [5] I had a best friend once who worked for a great Christian man who was an ob/gyn and it was the joy of his life to deliver babies. One night when we were out and about, I noticed that she was very down. I asked her what was wrong. She said that a mother came in that day for an ultrasound and it was discovered that the baby had no head. There was a small stump of what could be considered the base of a brain, but no actual head. It was "normal" looking other than that. She said the whole staff was devastated and the doctor was the most devastated. I said, "What is he going to do?" She said, "I don't know". She did not enjoy the night and we went home early. I never asked what they decided. I do know that if I were the mother, I would very grievously make the decision - only after MANY more pictorial tests - for the doctor to terminate the pregnancy. We would have a memorial service and I would know that that baby was in heaven - whole and sound with a beautiful face. As I said, life is not so cut and dry nor as rigid as we think. We choose life, yes. And sometimes, in rare and painful occasions, a decision has to be made to give that life to God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMatrixHasU71 Posted January 25, 2017 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 21 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,573 Content Per Day: 0.51 Reputation: 723 Days Won: 0 Joined: 12/10/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted January 25, 2017 (edited) On 1/23/2017 at 8:10 PM, Brittany said: Alright, so, I'm against abortion completely. I don't believe a woman should ever have the right to kill her own child. Even in cases of rape, and when the mother's health is affected. I believe that when a woman gets an abortion, she is being selfish and is giving up. Now, I don't hate women who support abortions or have had abortions. But, I hate abortion with a burning passion. I just wanted to open a discussion about this because I was curious about other viewpoints. Do you think abortion is okay at all times? What about when a baby is the result of rape? When the mother's health is in jeopardy? Please also include your reasoning, whether you answer yes or no. Here's my reasoning for being against abortion: God forms us in our mother's womb, and He knows us even before we're born, and has a purpose for us (Jeremiah 1:5; Psalm 139:13). Okay so, what about in cases of rape? Well, sometimes we need to just get over it (although I'm not saying it'll be easy to just, poof, forget the trauma). We are told that there will be tribulations, and that we need to endure to the end. Life on earth isn't going to be perfect. But we can rely on God to get us through at least until we have accomplished our purpose. And as for when a woman's life is in jeopardy, I like to look at John 15:13 to answer this; "Greater love hath no man than this, that he lay down his life for his friends." When a woman is willing to risk her own life to try to birth a baby, she is showing almost the greatest love (I say "almost" because God is the one who showed the greatest love when He sent His Son to die for us). Abortion, therefore, is not a loving decision. I'd like to hear your guys' thoughts! BUT PLEASE REMEMBER TO BE RESPECTFUL TO EACH OTHER, EVEN IF WE HAVE DIFFERING VIEW POINTS. Abortion is murder, pure and simple. There is no good excuse for it. And I say this as a woman. If the woman's life is in danger? A woman should be prepared to give her life to save her child. If the child is severely deformed in the womb and will probably die anyway? Let God take the baby on HIS terms, not yours. It would be an especial indignity to basically 'rub it in' as it were to abort an already dying child through the butchery of an abortion that often involves cutting them up or digesting their insides with caustic substances. If the woman is raped? It would be cruel and heartless to the extreme to punish the baby for the sins of the father. The only time when abortion may be permissible in God's eyes is if a very little girl gets pregnant. Its rare, but not unheard of for girls, 10-11-12 years old to get pregnant, and a girl who is barely more than baby herself is guaranteed to have problems, often fatal ones. While a grown woman or even dare I say, an older teen can be mature enough to be called upon to give her life for her child you cannot lay such a burden on an immature little girl. While abortion is most certainly evil in all circumstances, sometimes the lesser of the two evils has to be weighed in the balance. Edited January 25, 2017 by TheMatrixHasU71 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pie Posted January 25, 2017 Group: Members Followers: 3 Topic Count: 3 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 45 Content Per Day: 0.02 Reputation: 63 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/18/2017 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/24/1987 Share Posted January 25, 2017 (edited) 6 hours ago, shiloh357 said: Except no abortion has ever been performed to save a woman's life AND we have amazing medical advancements that can save the life of the mother and the baby. 1 In the vast majority of abortions done today, I would say you are right. Most abortions are done for convenience. But the claim that "No abortion has ever been performed to save a woman's life," is simply untrue. However, you bring up a good point. We are capable of dealing with a lot more scenarios than we were before. Edited January 25, 2017 by Pie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest shiloh357 Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 16 minutes ago, Pie said: In the vast majority of abortions done today, I would say you are right. Most abortions are done for convenience. But the claim that "No abortion has ever been performed to save a woman's life," is simply untrue. However, you bring up a good point. We are capable of dealing with a lot more scenarios than we were before. No abortion clinic has ever performed an abortion to save a woman's life. That is an incontrovertible truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BacKaran Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 Why is it harder to trust God when a 9 yr old gets raped and pregnant than an 18 or 35 yr old? We don't know how all things will work to Gloryify God but killing a baby at any stage or at age simply wrong for any reason man or woman can give. Don't know what to do? Trust God. Sometimes it's hard but He will never fail anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ezra Posted January 25, 2017 Group: Royal Member Followers: 16 Topic Count: 134 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 8,142 Content Per Day: 2.35 Reputation: 6,612 Days Won: 20 Joined: 11/02/2014 Status: Offline Share Posted January 25, 2017 12 hours ago, markdohle said: However, laws against abortion will not stop this reality but only create a whole new class of criminals. Perhaps. But then they will be subject to criminal charges. Today they go under the pretense of legality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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