Prophetic Sign Post: 666

[JohnD]

On 7/25/2017 at 11:22 AM, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

Introduction: 666 or 616?

I listened to an interesting discussion today regarding the number 666 and referring the number to man (mankind, humankind, etc.) and the beast of Revelation 13:18.  If you accept the number as 666, what does that mean?

We are carbon-based life forms.  Carbon is a chemical element made up of 6 protons, 6 electrons and 6 neutrons in its atomic structure.  Life is carbon-based.  We are all carbon-based life forms.  If the number of the beast is also 666, that would mean the beast (antichrist) is human (demonically possessed).

Is this analysis true to Biblical prophesy?  We must remember that John explained what he saw in Revelations in the best way he could, and that it wouldn't be fully understood until the last days.  Of course there are other ways to understand Revelation 13:18.  And what if the number is really 616?  This is a fascinating subject that I believe can only be understood by the Bible and Science.  I don't have answers here, just questions and directions for further, deeper study.

The 616 number / interpretation is only to obfuscate the issue. If you can't wow 'em with your wit baffle 'em with your bull**! -- Devil's Guide on How to Oppose God 101.

These kinds of "coincidences" the 6-6-6 make up of mankind are extrabiblical prophetic indications (like when Jesus said the rocks would cry out, or the heavens declare the glory of God). I am reassured by these signs, and at times use them to try to reason with unbelievers (like the biogenesis argument which sends atheists and humanists fleeing for their mommies). But the prophetic hardcopy is in the Bible.

Because we can get bogged down by the extrabiblical and obscure the biblical interpretation / clarification as to what 666 actually is.

Counting numbers (gametria and all sorts of puzzles) is typically the chiefest extrabiblical tail chase on the subject. However, we are explicitly told:

Revelation 22:18–19 (AV)
18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:
19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

This book.

Revelation alone?

Dr. Chuck Missler used to teach that he recommends Revelation as a superb book for novices to begin studying the Bible:

because it forces you into the rest of all scripture to understand and properly interpret its symbolism.

So even if Revelation alone is specified here, you need the entire Bible to understand it.

As my signature has said for years: the Bible is its own best commentary... interpretation.

So what 666 is (by Bible definition)?

Clearly it is a mark.

The number of man (or a man).

And it is to be counted. ← but that does not mean any old way you choose to count.

One way to count this number is the date the two Jewish Temples were destroyed (Tisha b'Av) 586 BCE  /  70 CE:

The first date is of biblical record the second of biblical prophecy...

...took place exactly 666 years apart using the prophetic calendar of 30 day months / 360 day years. To the day / date.

Is this just another marker for 666 like the protons, neutrons, and electrons?

Possibly.

But in Revelation 13:18 we are essentially instructed to count the number of his name. A name we are not actually given.

Apparently to prevent that counting to be gamatria  / picking out a name like Ronald Wilson Reagan etc.

And we are also warned to stay within the covers of the Bible to do so.  

Continued...

[JohnD]

Did you know there are only three verses in the entire Bible that even have 666 in them?

2 Chronicles 9:13 (AV)
13 Now the weight of gold that came to Solomon in one year was six hundred and threescore and six talents of gold;

1 Kings 10:14 (AV)
14 Now the weight of gold that came to Solomon in one year was six hundred threescore and six talents of gold,

Revelation 13:18 (AV)
18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

[JohnD]

Here is wisdom. Who does the Bible say was the wisest man?

Him who has understanding. Same guy according to scripture.

Builder of the first Jewish Temple.

Solomon (whose name means peace...) as in:

Jeremiah 6:14 (AV)
14 They have healed also the hurt of the daughter of my people slightly, saying, Peace, peace; when there is no peace.

Jeremiah 8:11 (AV)
11 For they have healed the hurt of the daughter of my people slightly, saying, Peace, peace; when there is no peace.

To whom the so-called Star of David can be historically traced. At least to date, nothing historically unearthed or written

links the (actual) Seal of Solomon with king David.

Solomon is spoken of in scripture as having built pagan temples for his many wives. He conscripted pagan artisans to work on the Jewish Temple.

And Solomon had been influenced by pagans enough to use this symbol as his seal (signate). The origin of this symbol predates Solomon (and Judaism if memory serves).

As you can clearly see it is a 6 point star with a 6 sided center with 6 triangles surrounding.

This would NOT qualify for example:

 

 

Extrabiblical? Yes, but certainly inferred. Solomon's pagan practices were such that God would have split the Kingdom in his reign (which he did in the reign of Solomon's son) had it not been for David.  His paganism and influence by them ARE biblical. But the symbol is actually extrabiblical but in full display as the modern symbol for the GOVERNMENT of Israel.

 

 

 

[JohnD]

Isaiah 66:1–5 (AV)
1 Thus saith the LORD, The heaven is my throne, and the earth is my footstool: where is the house that ye build unto me? and where is the place of my rest?
2 For all those things hath mine hand made, and all those things have been, saith the LORD: but to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word.
3 He that killeth an ox is as if he slew a man; he that sacrificeth a lamb, as if he cut off a dog’s neck; he that offereth an oblation, as if he offered swine’s blood; he that burneth incense, as if he blessed an idol. Yea, they have chosen their own ways, and their soul delighteth in their abominations.
4 I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears upon them; because when I called, none did answer; when I spake, they did not hear: but they did evil before mine eyes, and chose that in which I delighted not.
5 Hear the word of the LORD, ye that tremble at his word; Your brethren that hated you, that cast you out for my name’s sake, said, Let the LORD be glorified: but he shall appear to your joy, and they shall be ashamed.

God condescended to deal with Israel through the Temple system once it was built anyway (and he commanded its REbuilding after the exile). But God did not command the Temple be built in the first place.

1 Kings 8:18–19 (AV)
18 And the LORD said unto David my father, Whereas it was in thine heart to build an house unto my name, thou didst well that it was in thine heart.
19 Nevertheless thou shalt not build the house; but thy son that shall come forth out of thy loins, he shall build the house unto my name.

2 Samuel 7:12–13 (AV)
12 And when thy days be fulfilled, and thou shalt sleep with thy fathers, I will set up thy seed after thee, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I will establish his kingdom.
13 He shall build an house for my name, and I will establish the throne of his kingdom for ever.

Zechariah 6:12–13 (AV)
12 And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD:
13 Even he shall build the temple of the LORD; and he shall bear the glory, and shall sit and rule upon his throne; and he shall be a priest upon his throne: and the counsel of peace shall be between them both.

 

[JohnD]

16 minutes ago, JohnD said:

Isaiah 66:1–5 (AV)
1 Thus saith the LORD, The heaven is my throne, and the earth is my footstool: where is the house that ye build unto me? and where is the place of my rest?
2 For all those things hath mine hand made, and all those things have been, saith the LORD: but to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word.
3 He that killeth an ox is as if he slew a man; he that sacrificeth a lamb, as if he cut off a dog’s neck; he that offereth an oblation, as if he offered swine’s blood; he that burneth incense, as if he blessed an idol. Yea, they have chosen their own ways, and their soul delighteth in their abominations.
4 I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears upon them; because when I called, none did answer; when I spake, they did not hear: but they did evil before mine eyes, and chose that in which I delighted not.
5 Hear the word of the LORD, ye that tremble at his word; Your brethren that hated you, that cast you out for my name’s sake, said, Let the LORD be glorified: but he shall appear to your joy, and they shall be ashamed.

God condescended to deal with Israel through the Temple system once it was built anyway (and he commanded its REbuilding after the exile). But God did not command the Temple be built in the first place.

1 Kings 8:18–19 (AV)
18 And the LORD said unto David my father, Whereas it was in thine heart to build an house unto my name, thou didst well that it was in thine heart.
19 Nevertheless thou shalt not build the house; but thy son that shall come forth out of thy loins, he shall build the house unto my name.

2 Samuel 7:12–13 (AV)
12 And when thy days be fulfilled, and thou shalt sleep with thy fathers, I will set up thy seed after thee, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I will establish his kingdom.
13 He shall build an house for my name, and I will establish the throne of his kingdom for ever.

Zechariah 6:12–13 (AV)
12 And speak unto him, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Behold the man whose name is The BRANCH; and he shall grow up out of his place, and he shall build the temple of the LORD:
13 Even he shall build the temple of the LORD; and he shall bear the glory, and shall sit and rule upon his throne; and he shall be a priest upon his throne: and the counsel of peace shall be between them both.

 

The Messiah is that Son of David that the scriptures indicate was God's choice to build for him a house.

Matthew 16:18 (AV)
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

1 Corinthians 3:16 (AV)
16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

The living Body of Christ (believers in Jesus) are the Temple God intended to be "built." Not some cold, dead replication of the once living tabernacle which God DID in fact tell Moses to erect.

[JohnD]

Notice:

Hebrews 8:5 (AV)
5 Who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make THE TABERNACLE: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount.

No mention of any of the Temples (Solomon's, Zerubbabel's or Herod's).

God did in fact instruct Zerubbabel to REbuild the temple (since Israel had gone down that path). Like the monarchy. Once Israel went down that path, there was no turning back.

 

[dprprb]

THANK YOU for posting all the Scriptures that you found relevant to the topic. I was trying to remember the talents of gold to Solomon. I read everything again at lunch today but nothing jumps out at me... There is the Queen of Sheba verse just prior to that when Solomon gives her everything she asks for and that might make the Babylon woman of Revelations her antithesis...perhaps one should expect (666) to be demonstrably parallel but unexplained nonetheless...and leave it at that. 

[Ed J]

On 7/27/2017 at 9:46 AM, JohnD said:

in Revelation 13:18 we are essentially instructed to count the number of his name. A name we are not actually given.

Apparently to prevent that counting to be gamatria...

Hi John D,

"Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast:
for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six." (Rev 13:18)
Here we see the number 666 with the words: Let him that hath understanding "Count The Number"

"And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory
over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name,
stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God." (Revelation 15:2)

"over the beast"(140),
"over his image"(131),
"over his mark"(139),
"over the number of his name"(256),

140 + 131 + 139 + 256 = 666

____________
God bless
Ed J

[Ed J]

Hi Abdicate,

Then you agree that Muhammad is the false prophet of the book of Rev, correct?

____________
God bless

Ed J

 

 

Edited July 30, 2017 by Ed J

[Zoltan777]

16 hours ago, Abdicate said:

666 is a myth... it's not in Revelation 13:18. It's an attempt to understand what is not understandable without wisdom. I was once told I couldn't speak of numbers pointing to God on this site (despite a book called Numbers in the word of God) because I was told it was numerology. Well, 666 is in fact numerology. The fact is in the original, "666" or "six hundred three score and six" as so translated is actually just three Greek letters: χξς which isn't a word in Greek and holds no discernible meaning no more than TRG means anything in English, so is treated as a number. Why? Because the Greeks have no number characters, but use their letters as numbers, A=1, B=2, C=3. So does Hebrew. So when the translators came to χξς they didn't how to translate it or what to do with it. So they did gematria (numbers for character values). The problem is that, no where in the scriptures does it do this. Whenever a number is used in the word of God, it spells it out: one, two three, not 1, 2, 3 or A, B, C. This is why mega theories abound what it is, and yet, we've actually seen it on the news. John was told to write what he saw, so he did. But when the scribes came and didn't recognize what John wrote, and since the rest of the book is in Greek, they transcribed it using approximate Greek letters. This also explains a long line in the hand written text of Rev 13:18 that doesn't have an explanation either.

This is the hand written image. The red box are these 3 Greek letters in question:

I copied the image above, mirrored the letter Xi (ξ) with the line and rotated it. I then gave it to three people I knew, who are not Christians, but are from Iraq, Bahrain, and Egypt. All three told me the grey image below I rotated and mirrors from the hand written bible, said "Bismillah"which means in English "In the name of Allah". I extracted an Islamic prayer with Bismillah in it, excised it, and put it next to my rotated-mirrored image. Here it is:

Did you know that Muslims are awaiting the Beast and for his mark? Yes, they look forward to the mark of the beast. Now you understand why John warned not to change anything about the book he wrote. No other writer warned such a thing - at least not in the plain text of the word of God. 

Ok, so this only explains 2 of the 3 characters. The first letter Chi (χ) is the symbol of Islam - no not the crescent moon, but the crossed swords and the rehals - the stand that is used to hold the qu'ran.  

 

 

Notice the mark on their foreheads...

 

 

It's the Shahada - the prayer that makes you a muslim. 

But as Thayer said about this verse ... "the meaning of which is the basis of much vain speculation."

I think John saw the bismillah and wrote it, but because none knew Arabic of today, they thought it to be the three Greek letters because they closely resembled it. And isn't it amazing that even in the error of men, God still got His message through!

 

That was a very interesting post to read. Please, could you explain more about the beast that the muslims are waiting for? 

....

Maybe it doesn't belong to the topic but seeing the last picture, did you know that Hitler was friend of muslims and made the whole Arabic word to turn against the allies? Also, he made a statement about islam as political and religious ideology. 

Edited July 30, 2017 by Zoltan777