Limited Atonement

[Robert William]

1 minute ago, shiloh357 said:

God DOES love everybody, even those who, due to their stubborn rejection of Him, abide under His wrath. 

When the wrath of God falls, it will fall with a broken heart.

ALL humans are born enemies and haters of God.

Rom 5:10  For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

[Guest shiloh357]

Just now, Robert William said:

ALL humans are born enemies and haters of God.

Rom 5:10  For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

That does not mean God hates any person.

[Robert William]

3 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

I have already stated that I am not talking about universal salvation.  Try actually reading what I wrote instead of just brushing it aside and offering shallow responses that prove you don't even read what you're responding to.

I did read what you wrote, you said Jesus Atoned for ALL humans, that's a false teaching of universal salvation.

[Guest shiloh357]

Just now, Robert William said:

I did read what you wrote, you said Jesus Atoned for ALL humans, that's a false teaching of universal salvation.

No that is NOT universal salvation.   As I stated earlier, universal salvation pertains to the heresy of Universalism where they believe that everyone will eventually get saved, whether they want to, or not.

You need to get your theological terminology right if you want to have an intelligent conversation about salvation.

[Robert William]

3 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

That does not mean God hates any person.

Where you born a unbeliever, all humans are and are under His wrath.

Joh_3:36  He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

[Guest shiloh357]

Just now, Robert William said:

Where you born a unbeliever, all humans are and are under His wrath.

Joh_3:36  He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Being under God's wrath and being hated by God are not the same thing, no matter how you twist it.  

[Robert William]

2 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

No that is NOT universal salvation.   As I stated earlier, universal salvation pertains to the heresy of Universalism where they believe that everyone will eventually get saved, whether they want to, or not.

You need to get your theological terminology right if you want to have an intelligent conversation about salvation.

You're not cluing in if Jesus Atoned for ALL the sins of ALL humans then nobody can end up in Hell, nobody who's sins have been Atoned for will end up in Hell.

[Guest shiloh357]

Just now, Robert William said:

You're not cluing in if Jesus Atoned for ALL the sins of ALL humans then nobody can end up in Hell, nobody who's sins have been Atoned for will end up in Hell.

That is not how it works.   You really don't understand what the Bible teaches about that.   Jesus paid for every person's sin, but that does not mean that everyone is automatically saved.   Salvation has to be received, which is why it has to be preached.

[Robert William]

Just now, shiloh357 said:

That is not how it works.   You really don't understand what the Bible teaches about that.   Jesus paid for every person's sin, but that does not mean that everyone is automatically saved.   Salvation has to be received, which is why it has to be preached.

You told me that the sins of ALL humans have been Atoned for, that means they are sinless. Perhaps you don't understand the Atonement.

Limited Atonement (Particular Redemption)

Limited Atonement is a doctrine offered in answer to the question, "for whose sins did Christ atone?" The Bible teaches that Christ died for those whom God gave him to save (John 17:9)

Joh 17:9  I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine...  Christ died, indeed, for many people, but not all (Matthew 26:28).  

Mat 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins

Specifically, Christ died for the invisible Church -- the sum total of all those who would ever rightly bear the name "Christian" (Ephesians 5:25).
This doctrine often finds many objections, mostly from those who think that Limited Atonement does damage to evangelism. We have already seen that Christ will not lose any that the father has given to him (John 6:37). Christ's death was not a death of potential atonement for all people. Believing that Jesus' death was a potential, symbolic atonement for anyone who might possibly, in the future, accept him trivializes Christ's act of atonement. Christ died to atone for specific sins of specific sinners. Christ died to make holy the church. He did not Atone for all men, because obviously all men are not saved. Evangelism is actually lifted up in this doctrine, for the evangelist may tell his congregation that Christ died for sinners, and that he will not lose any of those for whom he died!

[Guest shiloh357]

3 minutes ago, Robert William said:

You told me that the sins of ALL humans have been Atoned for, that means they are sinless.

No, it doesn't mean they are sinless.   It simply means that Jesus paid the penalty for sin.  That is what the Atonement did.  The Atonement doesn't eradicate sin.   Paul makes that clear in Galatians five when he speaks of the works of the flesh.   We still have a sin nature and we can still be tempted and we still stumble on occasions in a sincere attempt to serve the Lord.  There is NOTHING in the biblical doctrine of the Atonement that says that Christ's Atonement makes anyone sinless, saved or not.