LAWS of Jesus

[mven222]

1 minute ago, John Robinson said:

The site draws legalists like a dog draws fleas.

I've never seen anything like it.

LOl I say always: a dog barks when stone hits it.

Thank you for: I've never seen anything like it.

[mven222]

7 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

So what happens to us if we don't keep the Sabbath day?   Where will we spend eternity?

Read and ponder, my friend. May be you will understand the meaning of the Sabbath as I explained that to you all in my in-depth-analysis above.

Edited December 26, 2017 by mven222

[Guest shiloh357]

1 minute ago, mven222 said:

Read and ponder, my friend. May be you will understand the meaning of the Sabbath as I explained that to you all in my in-depth-analysis above.

Just answer the question.   Do Christians go to Hell if they do not keep the Sabbath day?   All I am asking for is straight answer to a simple question.

[John Robinson]

Come on, Shiloh, you know they'll NEVER answer. Because if they do, the mods will bounce them off this site faster than a bum on a baloney sandwich.

[mven222]

19 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

Just answer the question.   Do Christians go to Hell if they do not keep the Sabbath day?   All I am asking for is straight answer to a simple question.

Let me answer that this way: Do Christians go to hell for sins and sexual immorality? Yes. God proclaimed that in Revelation.

Do Christians go to hell for stealing? Yes.

Do Christians go to hell for killing? Yes.

Do Christians go to hell for lie? Yes.

List the sins which lead to hell.

Or do you not know that wrongdoers

will not inherit the kingdom of God?

Do not be deceived:

Neither the sexually immoral

nor idolaters

nor adulterers

nor men who have sex with men

9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous

will not inherit the kingdom of God?

Do not be deceived:

neither the sexually immoral,

nor idolaters,

nor adulterers,

nor men who practice homosexuality,

10 nor thieves,

nor the greedy,

nor drunkards,

nor revilers,

nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

 

sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality,  idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, 21 envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God?

But now I am writing you not to associate with anyone who claims to be a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a verbal abuser, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat.

 

These are the LAWS of God in the Holy Bible. We have to implement them. What is a sin? Sin is any Violation of God's Laws. Ponder.

 

 

 

 

Edited December 26, 2017 by mven222

[GandalfTheWise]

I think that this topic and question (or at least something close to it) arose in the early church.  See Acts 15:1-30 for the complete story.

5 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.” 6 The apostles and elders met to consider this question.   7 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8 God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9 He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.” Acts 15:5-11 NIV

The final result of this counsel was that the new non-Jewish believers were not asked to keep the law of Moses, but requested to avoid a few things as indicated in verses 19 and 20.    19 It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. 20 Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood.  Acts 15:19-20 NIV

Instead of explicitly telling non-Jewish believers that Jesus was the new Lawgiver and had upheld the Law given through Moses, they said that telling the Gentile converts to follow the law of Moses would be testing God.  They did not ask the Gentile converts to follow the law of Moses, not did they make any such statement that Jesus had endorsed the law of Moses to be followed by all new believers.

Parts of the book of Galatians are related to this issue of keeping the law versus grace.  Being a Christian is NOT about *acting* the right way and keeping the letter of the law to the best of our ability and doing certain things to avoid judgement.  Being a Christian is about God transforming us in a way where we keep the law by nature.

13 You, my brothers and sisters, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the flesh; rather, serve one another humbly in love. 14 For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” 15 If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.  16 So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17 For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.  19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery;20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God. 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit.  Galatians 5:13-24 NIV

The heart and core of the Good News, the Gospel,  is that God is making us into new creations through the redeeming work of Jesus Christ.  Christianity is NOT about working harder to keep God's rules.  It is about being transformed and changed through the work of the Holy Spirit in our lives so that we become people that naturally live holy lives.  Through Jesus Christ, God has forgiven our sins.  His plan for us to leave sin behind is to be transformed through His grace and power.  We need to spend our time and effort as Christians drawing closer to God and learning to know Him more and more.   We do this through consistent prayer, study and reading of scripture, being with other believers, and other such spiritual practices and disciples.  Lack of sin in our lives comes about because we are transformed and changed; not because we work up enough discipline and will-power to avoid breaking any rules.  God is changing us into people who keep His law by our very nature; not into people who force themselves to follow rules to avoid judgement.

 

 

[Guest shiloh357]

2 minutes ago, mven222 said:

Let me answer that this way: Do Christians go to hell for sins and sexual immorality? Yes. God proclaimed that in Revelation.

No, they don't and God did not proclaim that in Revelation.

Quote

Do Christian go to hell for stealing? Yes.

NO

Do Christian go to hell for killing? Yes.

No

Do Christian go to hell for lie? Yes.

No

 

Quote

 

List the sins which lead to hell. Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters, nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men

9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral,nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality,10 nor thieves,nor the greedy,nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality,  idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, 21 envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do2 such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Or do you not know that the unrighteous1 will not inherit the kingdom of God?

But now I am writing you not to associate with anyone who claims to be a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a verbal abuser, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat.

 

Yes, those who do such things will not inherit the Kingdom of God.   But those verses you cite have a specific context.   In I Corinthians 6:9, 10 the issue Paul raised was that the Corinthians should not take their internal disputes before the secular magistrates because: "...neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,  Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God."   He was calling on the Corinthians to settle their disputes in-house, not in front of the world.   Paul was describing the immoral nature of the judges of Corinth and declaring them unfit to judge matters of the Church because they were not going to inherit the Kingdom of God.

There are those who claim to be Christians, but live the opposite way.   They are not believers simply because they claim to be and if someone's life is not reflective of the teachings of Scripture, we should not have fellowship with that person.  

But that has nothing to do with why people go to Hell.

No one goes to hell for the sins they commit.   They go to Hell because they have rejected the Gospel of Jesus Christ which is the only way to Heaven.   No one goes to Heaven for good works, and no one goes to Hell for the sins they commit. 

Salvation isn't based on how we live, because it was, none of us would ever be saved.   We are declared righteous solely on the merits of Christ and His righteousness.  

 

Quote

 

These are the LAWS of God in the Holy Bible. We have to implement them. What is a sin? Sin is any Violation of God's Laws. Ponder.

 

Where in the NT does it say that the Sabbath is required for salvation?

 

[mven222]

34 minutes ago, GandalfTheWise said:

I think that this topic and question (or at least something close to it) arose in the early church.  See Acts 15:1-30 for the complete story.

5 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.” 6 The apostles and elders met to consider this question.   7 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8 God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9 He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.” Acts 15:5-11 NIV

The final result of this counsel was that the new non-Jewish believers were not asked to keep the law of Moses, but requested to avoid a few things as indicated in verses 19 and 20.    19 It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. 20 Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood.  Acts 15:19-20 NIV

Instead of explicitly telling non-Jewish believers that Jesus was the new Lawgiver and had upheld the Law given through Moses, they said that telling the Gentile converts to follow the law of Moses would be testing God.  They did not ask the Gentile converts to follow the law of Moses, not did they make any such statement that Jesus had endorsed the law of Moses to be followed by all new believers.

Parts of the book of Galatians are related to this issue of keeping the law versus grace.  Being a Christian is NOT about *acting* the right way and keeping the letter of the law to the best of our ability and doing certain things to avoid judgement.  Being a Christian is about God transforming us in a way where we keep the law by nature.

13 You, my brothers and sisters, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the flesh; rather, serve one another humbly in love. 14 For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” 15 If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.  16 So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17 For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.  19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery;20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God. 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit.  Galatians 5:13-24 NIV

The heart and core of the Good News, the Gospel,  is that God is making us into new creations through the redeeming work of Jesus Christ.  Christianity is NOT about working harder to keep God's rules.  It is about being transformed and changed through the work of the Holy Spirit in our lives so that we become people that naturally live holy lives.  Through Jesus Christ, God has forgiven our sins.  His plan for us to leave sin behind is to be transformed through His grace and power.  We need to spend our time and effort as Christians drawing closer to God and learning to know Him more and more.   We do this through consistent prayer, study and reading of scripture, being with other believers, and other such spiritual practices and disciples.  Lack of sin in our lives comes about because we are transformed and changed; not because we work up enough discipline and will-power to avoid breaking any rules.  God is changing us into people who keep His law by our very nature; not into people who force themselves to follow rules to avoid judgement.

 

 

Yes, I know these verses. It seems here that Christians can eat any food and the food even offered to idols because in fact idols do not exist in reality.

But the Son of God does NOT think so...lol:

who taught Balak to put a stumbling block before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed to idols, and to commit sexual immorality.

Revelation 2

 

Christians should be transformed and changed DAILY dying for sins i.e. NOT doing sins to be ready and prepared to pass to the New World. Those who live in sins (sexual immorality or other sins) are in fact NOT born of God (they are sons of devil) as of  1 John 3.

Anyone who continues to live in him (God Jesus) will not sin. But anyone who keeps on sinning does not know him or understand who he is.

No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him.

If anyone says, "I know Him," but does not keep His commandments, he is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
 

Anyone born of God refuses to practice sin, because God's seed abides in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God.
 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 26, 2017 by mven222

[mven222]

I will tell you even MORE: Those pastors who do NOT teach all what God said are GUILTY and He -Jesus- will JUDGE them. As for us, we are teachers as God gave us spiritual gifts, we are preachers, we are prophets explaining the prophecies of God to teach and build the Church up. If we do NOT do that we are GUILTY too. The sin of omission: if we know what is right and we do not do that, this is a sin too. That is why EVERYONE of us has to teach WHAT God said in the Bible...NOT what churches or fake preachers preach in our churches (heresies). What is NOT in the Bible is a heresy.

[mven222]

The other day I watched a movie of Mel Gibson about a seventh day Adventist called “Hacksaw Ridge' (A bloody World War II movie about Desmond Doss, a Seventh-day Adventist and the first conscientious objector to receive the Medal of Honor for his military service. ) Watch it. He belonged to a cult of Adventists. But he was a true believer just deceived by these heretics. Despite of their heresies, he was a godly man who saved in his life (a true story) MANY American soldiers because of his FAITH in God. Even if we are deceived by cults and false teachers in our churches but really believe in God, God will save us. What is IMPORTANT: not what our churches or people teach us but what is WRITTEN in the Holy Scripture...EVERY word of God even NOT taught by anyone except God on the pages on the HOLY Scripture.

Edited December 26, 2017 by mven222