Did God "needed" the original sin?

[listener24]

I've heard some assertions from many siblings in Christ. One of this is like:

A - "God can only create new souls in this world, in its current state. He is waiting to reach the right number of souls before coming back."

Even if it is not always stated this way, many sentences of some siblings imply this belief. 

But if we remember that the world is in the current state because of original sin, then A implies:

B - original sin was "necessary" to God for creating new souls and reaching the number of souls he wanted. (or necessary for other purposes)

 

An alternative to the above sentences A and B would be: 

 

A2: - "God could create souls directly in Heaven or other dimensions, he has no need of the world in its current corrupted state for creating new souls and the only reasons we are here in the world in its corrupted state is original sin, chosen by men."

In this case, A2 is compatible with 

B2 - original sin was NOT necessary, but a mistake.

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So to recap, A is compatible with B, but not with B2, because to state A and B2 makes no logical sense. 

In the same way, A2 is compatible with B2 but not with B.

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What do you think? Are you more oriented on the "necessity" sentences (A,B), or the "mistake" sentences (A2,B2)?

Feel free to add alternatives and describe your position with more details!  

 

 

Edited December 29, 2017 by listener24

[Guest shiloh357]

None of that is scriptural.

[listener24]

4 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

None of that is scriptural.

I've heard both from Christians.

Can you clarify your position on that specific point? Possibly, in a non-contradictory way (like people who believes in A and B2 at the same time, which are 2 contradictory sentences when taken together)

Edited December 26, 2017 by listener24

[listener24]

7 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

None of that is scriptural.

also, original sin is either "necessary" or "not necessary".

Can't be both.

Can you tell me in your opinion, which one is Scriptural? Necessary or not necessary in God's plan.

[Guest shiloh357]

Just now, listener24 said:

I've heard both from Christians.

 

That doesn't mean that it is biblical or that it is sound theology.

Quote

Can you clarify your position on that specific point? Possibly, in a non-contradictory way (like people who believes in A and B2 at the same time, which are 2 contradictory sentences when taken together)

Neither position is mentioned in the Bible.   Both statements demonstrate a fundamental lack of knowledge about the doctrine of original sin.

There is nothing in the Bible about God creating the right number of people that he wants before Jesus can return, much less "needing" original sin to do that.   God doesn't need anything and the Bible doesn't say anything about there needing to be a particular number people on earth before His return.

The questions being asked are really just nonsense and those asking them need to be taught sound biblical doctrine.

[Guest shiloh357]

Just now, listener24 said:

also, original sin is either "necessary" or "not necessary".

Can't be both.

Can you tell me in your opinion, which one is Scriptural? Necessary or not necessary in God's plan.

Original sin is doctrine that we inherit a sin nature from Adam.  It is not a question of it being "necessary."   It is simply a biblical doctrine.

[listener24]

7 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

There is nothing in the Bible about God creating the right number of people that he wants before Jesus can return, much less "needing" original sin to do that.   God doesn't need anything and the Bible doesn't say anything about there needing to be a particular number people on earth before His return.

The questions being asked are really just nonsense and those asking them need to be taught sound biblical doctrine.

1

I agree that A,B that you are mentioning are not Scriptural positions. Just to clarify, they are not mine, and I'm reporting them to discuss.

Yet you can easily find them stated often. 

For instance, some people quote Revelation to affirm that God is waiting "the right number of elects" to born before the other things in Revelation can happen, therefore before coming back.

Edited December 26, 2017 by listener24

[Guest shiloh357]

7 minutes ago, listener24 said:

I agree that A,B that you are mentioning are not Scriptural positions. Just to clarify, they are not mine, and I'm reporting them to discuss.

 

The point is that there isn't anything to discuss.  Everything you quoted in the OP is wrong, period.   I mean, there aren't any valid points in any of that, which would produce a fruitful discussion.

[listener24]

4 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

The point is that there isn't anything to discuss.  Everything you quoted in the OP is wrong, period.   I mean, there aren't any valid points in any of that, which would produce a fruitful discussion.

Can you tell me what is Scripturally wrong in:

25 minutes ago, listener24 said:

A2: - "God could create souls directly in Heaven or other dimensions, he has no need of the world in its current corrupted state for creating new souls and the only reasons we are here in the world in its corrupted state is original sin, chosen by men."

 

We know from Scriptures that God creates angels directly in Heaven.

We also know that the corrupted state of the world is due to original sin from Scriptures.

We know original sin was a men's decision.

Can you tell me what's not Scriptural above?

Edited December 26, 2017 by listener24

[ayin jade]

The notion that God needed original sin to exist is a mormon belief. Are the Christians you are listening to actually mormons? They are not Christians. Their beliefs are not true to the bible.