Daniel & Revelation Reveal The Antichrist

[Guest shiloh357]

Shiloh,

Great post!

I can't add much of anything to your knowledge, but I did want to ask.........

When Paul states that his desire is that all Israel be saved, how in the world can anyone translate that to mean the Church?  How silly does that sound?  He'd give his life to save the saved Church?

I can't see how this is even an issue, but I see that the RCC has taught it for years and look at the errors there.........still electing "priests" to hear confessions, to lead the people, to act as a mediator, replacing the work of Christ.

Replacement theology puts an ugly cloud over the convenants, confusing old and new and trying to join the two, it causes so many doctrinal errors and, you're right, it's a cancer.

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You're right Wordsower! The logic doesn't follow does it? Thus "all the "Church" SHALL be saved?" If the Church is Israel and is made up of saved people, then they are already saved. No reason to speak in the future tense. Two verses down Paul says that "Israel" became enemies of the gospel for the sake of the Gentiles. How can anyone assert that the Church, made up of Gentiles predominantly, became enemies of the Gospel for the sake of the Gentiles? But that is the ridiculous logic you get if you follow replacement theology through to its illogical conclusion.

Replacement theology makes God out to be a liar and promise breaker. The replacement theologians have God in the OT sending His prophets to Israel, making promises to them about their future, and then in the NT, He breaks His promises, and redefines "Israel" as the church, and takes all that He promised to natural Israel and gives it away to someone else. If God was not faithful to the Jews, to keep His Word, then how would we have any basis for faith in the promises He makes to us? How do we know that He wont take the promises made to the Church and give them away to another people?

God cannot be just, honest and fair, and make covenants with a certain people, only to transfer those covenants to someone else. That is not how covenants work. God cannot go back on His Word.

[BibleStudent]

BibleStudent,

Are you referencing Ted Noel's book and/or are you Ted Noel?

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Both.

[BibleStudent]

Kevin,

Before you rush off in

[JesusisGod2]

Hi Biblestudent,

Please understand that I am not out to gain any "triumph" save that triumph over death that comes through Jesus Christ at the resurrection.

I come to these boards to gain understanding and to fellowship with believers who share in the same joy salvation through the Lord Jesus! Let us lift Him up!!!!!

As far the work you suggest and the pattern you suggest I follow, I have done that and understand how a sentence is structured and I believe that Romans is pretty clear on the issue.

To disagree on an issue is no big deal, however, rudeness is never acceptable.

In Jesus

Kevin

[nebula]

Before we continue, it might be of interest to insert a note about the heart and ministry of this Board's founder:

Project Hear O Israel

Worthy Ministries launched its Project Hear O'Israel project in September 2003! Scripture tells us that Messiah will not return until His people say - "Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord." (Matthew 23:39) But how can Israel hear of their Messiah unless those who are called are sent?

How shall they (we) preach, except they (we) be sent? (Romans 10:15)

Our vision for Project Hear O' Israel is to be a beacon of light in the land of Israel where the majority is secular and less than 3% of the population are believers.

Project Hear O' Israel is three dimensional; we want to meet the needs of Israelis spiritually, emotionally and physically.

First, spiritually, we want to help reap God's great harvest within Israel.

Pray ye therefore the Lord of the harvest, that he will send forth labourers into his harvest. (Matthew 9:38)

God has given Worthy Ministries a desire to bless and love the people of the Israel, both Jew and Gentile alike. We hope to bring unity among the two and allow the love of Messiah to unite them as one. May Jerusalem become a lamp of salvation that burns with the truth of Messiah!

For Zion's sake will I not hold my peace, and for Jerusalem's sake I will not rest, until the righteousness thereof go forth as brightness, and the salvation thereof as a lamp that burneth. (Isaiah 62:1)

Second, emotionally -- Can you imagine living in a society where war is a daily part of life? We want to be available for those who've been hurt, whose families have been broken, and the many who suffer from fear and depression. We want to comfort them in this time of great need.

Comfort ye, comfort ye my people, saith your God. (Isaiah 40:1)

Last but not least, physically -- Worthy Ministries desires to provide humanitarian aid to the needy. With the decline of tourism and the faltering economy of Israel, more than ever, humanitarian aid is vital to the land. According to the latest official reports, over 1/4 of Israeli children and teenagers live under the poverty line. Many have lost fathers, mothers, sisters and brothers, and are in need of food and clothing. We want to be able to reach out to these and allow the Gospel to go forth through our giving.

And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me. (Matthew 25:40)

[sandy]

Thank you Nebula for sharing that with us !! My heart is in complete agreement with these statements.

I would add -- let us remember to pray for the peace of Jerusalem !!!

[JesusisGod2]

Thank you Nebula for sharing that with us !!  My heart is in complete agreement with these statements.

I would add -- let us remember to pray for the peace of Jerusalem !!!

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Hear! Hear!

I am in agreement as well, and also agree that we need to remember to pray for Her

In Jesus

Kevin

[wordsower]

If we are going to throw stones, I

[JesusisGod2]

If we are going to throw stones, I

[Guest shiloh357]

QUOTE

(Shiloh) The theme of Romans is "Justification by Faith." In the 1st Century it was a mystery to some Jewish believers how a Gentile could be saved and still remain a Gentile. They actually had a debate on that subject in Acts chapter 15. Today, the debate has been stood on its head. Now the big mystery is how Jews can be saved and still be allowed to remain kosher and so forth.

That is a good point. But that does not exclude the fact that Paul discussed numerous subjects that are somewhat peripheral to his main point. He uses them as supporting arguments.

QUOTE

Paul's point, in Romans 9-11, is being Jewish in and of itself, offers no hope where salvation is concerned.

Well stated.

QUOTE

He is not trying to redefine "Israel" by teaching that Israel has been replaced by the Church.

Of course not. But the assumption in your statement is that the definition of Israel he is using is necessarily genetic. And it