The Meaning of Lukewarmness Understood

[Gideon]

15 minutes ago, Not me said:

I remember this story. It would so seem that unbelief did keep them out of the promised land. Than that brings up another question;

What  caused there unbelief? 

Was it, their fear of the giants in the land? Or was it they still, in their hearts wanted to go back to Egypt? 

Which in modern terms would be, still in love with the world. Or  still in love with themselves (self). Which I think would translate,  to still not seeing themselves as fallen in their entirely and in need of a total and complete salvation. 

You do bring up some quite interesting questions?? 

Much love in Christ, Not me

I think it was unbelief. We are told that they could not enter in because of unbelief. Who did finally lead them in? Joshua and Caleb, the two spies who came back with a good report, and frankly, the only two out of 600,000 Israelites who believed that if God had told them that they could take the land, the giants were not an issue.

Blessings dear brother,

Gids

 

[Not me]

4 hours ago, Gideon said:

I think it was unbelief. We are told that they could not enter in because of unbelief. Who did finally lead them in? Joshua and Caleb, the two spies who came back with a good report, and frankly, the only two out of 600,000 Israelites who believed that if God had told them that they could take the land, the giants were not an issue.

Blessings dear brother,

Gids

 

I have no doubt it was for unbelief for the scripture says that’s was the case.

We find in Heb. 3:8 in the retelling of the story, it gives us some more information with  these words “harden not your heart as in the days of provocation, in the days of temptation in the wilderness” meaning that they had harden their hearts torward God. Than Heb3:12 says a “evil heart of unbelief”

So I was wondering if it was “cause and effect.” The hard heart caused the unbelief? 

Was wondering if that too might be the case with the lukewarm, they have harden their hearts leading to their lukewarmness? 

Just kicking some stuff around. ???

much love in Christ, Not me 

Edited May 1, 2018 by Not me

[Gideon]

14 hours ago, Not me said:

We find in Heb. 3:8 in the retelling of the story, it gives us some more information with  these words “harden not your heart as in the days of provocation, in the days of temptation in the wilderness” meaning that they had harden their hearts torward God. Than Heb3:12 says a “evil heart of unbelief”

So I was wondering if it was “cause and effect.” The hard heart caused the unbelief? 

Was wondering if that too might be the case with the lukewarm, they have harden their hearts leading to their lukewarmness? 

Just kicking some stuff around. ???

much love in Christ, Not me 

I am sure you are correct about the ‘cause and effect’ of unbelief. In our case it is sin. We are told to beware the deceitfullness of sin. For a Christian, at least in today’s climate, sin is looked at an a “necessary inconvenience”, meaning it is unavoidable for the most part because of our human condition, but because of grace, it is not something for us to really sweat, because if we do, we get ‘sin conscious’ and lose our peace.

Are we forgiven if we truly repent of our sin and turn back to Him with our whole heart? Absolutely! But here is the problem. Sin comes with a hidden barb. Committed again and again, it hardens hearts. When we first fall into a sin, it truly bothers us, and we turn back to God with tears and genuine repentance. But if we are not shown the way to get free of that sin, and do it enough times, our hearts get coated with a hardness that is not soft towards our God. Faith that He truly forgives is replaced by head knowledge, and grace is cheapened in our eyes, and thus, we begin to take advantage of His mercy.

That is why today, we see increasing numbers of believers saying that no sin can seperate us from God and no matter how much we continue to sin, there is absolutely no danger. We are wrong. We were saved, we are saved, and we will continue to be saved. It is an ongoing process. And as Christ dwells in our hearts by faith and we endure steadfast in the faith, our salvation is assured. 

We must not be ignorant of satan’s devices. We are told that in the last days, men will depart from the faith, meaning they once truly believed. Satan is ultimately not just after getting us to sin, he is after getting our faith removed  out of our hearts by any means possible.

That is why it is so very important that we learn the HOW of walking holy in the Lord, where sins are truly dealt with and left in the dust behind us. True safety comes from us finally leaving the wilderness of unbelief  and entering into... and taking full possession of.... the land of promise.

Why? Here, our good fight of faith leads us to being established in the faith and we are unshakeable. We have dwelt long enough in the wilderness that we were intended to pass though, not live in contentedly, for the real danger to us is that at some point, the grace of God is transformed into lasciviousness... a license to sin with no danger, and no repercussions.

I am praying, as I am sure you are, that all who hear these words of ours  realize that not only is the standard of ‘holiness unto the Lord’ is again being lifted back up, but as well, the faith is being restored to us even now  to believe that God’s grace can and will not only lift us up to meet it, but to then keep us there, safe under the shadow of His wing.

Blessings, 

Gideon

[Not me]

The “deceitfulness of sin.” We have been warned by words and by examples. Oh that the entire Body of Christ would give heed to those words. God’s bar of righteousness can not, will not ever be changed. His standard of “be ye perfect as your Heavenly Father is perfect” still stands as the bar of measurement. Anything other than that, has disorder or wickedness in it. Disorder/wickedness will absolutely cause a believer to stop growing in Christ. Not to mention they lose their joy and peace in Christ. There is nothing so miserable as a person who possesses the New Creation yet chooses to live in the Old. Seem to be that believer has two choices. One, they can harden their hearts,  thereby silencing the voice of God in their innermost being. Or cry out to God for deliverance from the Old Creation. But if a believer doesn’t realize how to appropriate that deliverance, that is a most painful and frustrating place to be. Scripture says to “pray to the Lord of the harvest that He would send laborers to the harvest”. That He would send laborers that knew what our salvation in Christ consisted of, from the eternal ground. That you, I, all believers everywhere could come to know by experience what Christ’s death bought for us. Would not our hearts melt before Him in love,  if we could get but a glimpse of what His death bought for us, in all “reality and all truth”?  Oh! that our eyes could be opened,  that we might see.  Much love to Him, from His body. 

Wishing all in increase in Christ, Not me

[Gideon]

4 hours ago, Not me said:

The “deceitfulness of sin.” We have been warned by words and by examples. Oh that the entire Body of Christ would give heed to those words. God’s bar of righteousness can not, will not ever be changed. His standard of “be ye perfect as your Heavenly Father is perfect” still stands as the bar of measurement. Anything other than that, has disorder or wickedness in it. Disorder/wickedness will absolutely cause a believer to stop growing in Christ. Not to mention they lose their joy and peace in Christ. There is nothing so miserable as a person who possesses the New Creation yet chooses to live in the Old. Seem to be that believer has two choices. One, they can harden their hearts,  thereby silencing the voice of God in their innermost being. Or cry out to God for deliverance from the Old Creation. But if a believer doesn’t realize how to appropriate that deliverance, that is a most painful and frustrating place to be. Scripture says to “pray to the Lord of the harvest that He would send laborers to the harvest”. That He would send laborers that knew what our salvation in Christ consisted of, from the eternal ground. That you, I, all believers everywhere could come to know by experience what Christ’s death bought for us. Would not our hearts melt before Him in love,  if we could get but a glimpse of what His death bought for us, in all “reality and all truth”?  Oh! that our eyes could be opened,  that we might see.  Much love to Him, from His body. 

Wishing all in increase in Christ, Not me

I love you, my brother. Your words ring true and I know are spoken in love. That is plainly evident.  Satan has had us, His church, blinded to the second half of the gospel, that He will not only forgive us, but will also take full responsibility to change us into His likeness if we but admit we truly do need His new natures He has for us in order to walk pleasing to Him. 

Listen. Those that are in the flesh cannot please Him. They may truly want to, just as Paul said in Romans 7, “to will is present with me, but how to perform it, I find not.” And neither can we, even by trying our hardest to walk as He walked. There is one way to escape Romans 7 and truly walk in the power of the resurrected life of Romans 8. We must agree to let our old nature, the one that has brought misery and heartache to us all the days of our lives, die. 

But how can we do that? How do we die to self? Praise  God, He has made a way where there is no way! He took us down with Him in death, so that His death was also ours. Glory to God! He bought for us brand new natures that are pure through and through.

When we finally awake to the futility of ever trying to change ourselves, realizing that the flesh cannot.... will not... crucify the flesh, and we ‘put off’ our old corrupt natures by faith, hating even the garment stained by sin and our failing, fleshly efforts, we are finally ready to be clothed anew and truly come to understand the depth of the term “born from above”. Born again is was never meant to be a religious catch phrase.  God means it in the truest sense of the word, and when we finally see it, it is flat out mind blowing. 

When we finally humble ourselves, believing that God can and will do in us, through these new natures, what we could never do, walk in true obedience to Him. and simply step out in faith, believing that the old us has been dead ever since the day we were first saved, we can finally understand that all these years we see we have been, as Paul said, beating the air, trying to fight something that no longer exists. 

Guys, I can get no more serious. We... you... me... all saints everywhere that now walk the earth, are the blessed generation that is destined to awaken to what has been hidden from our eyes for over 1900 years. This is what powered the early church to take the world by storm. This is what caused them to walk as one, one with the Lord, one with one another. It is not ‘new age”, it is not cultish, it is not to be feared. 

What needs to be feared is us walking even one day further in a carnal nature that God has already delivered us from. Do not fear that your faith is too weak, or what He is asking you to believe is too improbable, too impossible, to good to be true. Your faith is just enough. Your weakness is your strength.

Can the gospel really be this good?  Of course! This is the God we serve. This is our destiny, and it is for every single person who loves the Lord, who wants to see light win the battle their  heart, so that God can reign supreme.. 

We have been fighting the black dog we have believed inescapable long enough. Do we get it? The black dog is dead. It is up to us to believe it. That and that alone is our part. Believe Him! Once we do that, I promise you, God will make sure we will not fail..... ever. Once He plants our feet on the highway of holiness, know this. There is no evil beast found on that highway. The weak there are strong. “And a man, though he be a fool, shall not err therein.” 

Yes, you can put this off for another day. But I pray the Holy Spirit gives you no rest until you listen to His still small voice and it grows to a deafening roar that you can no longer ignore. God is about to make us true overcomers, totally and completely victorious over the world, the flesh and the devil.

This is our birthright. It is our high calling. If we run away, He will follow us, unrelentingly, because love does that. He will not give up until we say “Yes, Lord”, I believe”.  And when we finally do, prepare to be amazed. God is about to awaken us to the truth of who we are, who we always have been, and we, His church, is about to blow Satan out of the water. About time.

Blessings to you, my dear friend. And to you all, my brothers and sisters in Christ, 

Gideon

[Not me]

26 minutes ago, Gideon said:

I love you, my brother. Your words ring true and I know are spoken in love. That is plainly evident.  Satan has had us, His church, blinded to the second half of the gospel, that He will not only forgive us, but will also take full responsibility to change us into His likeness if we but admit we truly do need His new natures He has for us in order to walk pleasing to Him. 

Listen. Those that are in the flesh cannot please Him. They may truly want to, just as Paul said in Romans 7, “to will is present with me, but how to perform it, I find not.” And neither can we, even by trying our hardest to walk as He walked. There is one way to escape Romans 7 and truly walk in the power of the resurrected life of Romans 8. We must agree to let our old nature, the one that has brought misery and heartache to us all the days of our lives, die. 

But how can we do that? How do we die to self? Praise  God, He has made a way where there is no way! He took us down with Him in death, so that His death was also ours. Glory to God! He bought for us brand new natures that are pure through and through.

When we finally awake to the futility of ever trying to change ourselves, realizing that the flesh cannot.... will not... crucify the flesh, and we ‘put off’ our old corrupt natures by faith, hating even the garment stained by sin and our failing, fleshly efforts, we are finally ready to be clothed anew and truly come to understand the depth of the term “born from above”. Born again is was never meant to be a religious catch phrase.  God means it in the truest sense of the word, and when we finally see it, it is flat out mind blowing. 

When we finally humble ourselves, believing that God can and will do in us, through these new natures, what we could never do, walk in true obedience to Him. and simply step out in faith, believing that the old us has been dead ever since the day we were first saved, we can finally understand that all these years we see we have been, as Paul said, beating the air, trying to fight something that no longer exists. 

Guys, I can get no more serious. We... you... me... all saints everywhere that now walk the earth, are the blessed generation that is destined to awaken to what has been hidden from our eyes for over 1900 years. This is what powered the early church to take the world by storm. This is what caused them to walk as one, one with the Lord, one with one another. It is not ‘new age”, it is not cultish, it is not to be feared. 

What needs to be feared is us walking even one day further in a carnal nature that God has already delivered us from. Do not fear that your faith is too weak, or what He is asking you to believe is too improbable, too impossible, to good to be true. Your faith is just enough. Your weakness is your strength.

Can the gospel really be this good?  Of course! This is the God we serve. This is our destiny, and it is for every single person who loves the Lord, who wants to see light win the battle their  heart, so that God can reign supreme.. 

We have been fighting the black dog we have believed inescapable long enough. Do we get it? The black dog is dead. It is up to us to believe it. That and that alone is our part. Believe Him! Once we do that, I promise you, God will make sure we will not fail..... ever. Once He plants our feet on the highway of holiness, know this. There is no evil beast found on that highway. The weak there are strong. “And a man, though he be a fool, shall not err therein.” 

Yes, you can put this off for another day. But I pray the Holy Spirit gives you no rest until you listen to His still small voice and it grows to a deafening roar that you can no longer ignore. God is about to make us true overcomers, totally and completely victorious over the world, the flesh and the devil.

This is our birthright. It is our high calling. If we run away, He will follow us, unrelentingly, because love does that. He will not give up until we say “Yes, Lord”, I believe”.  And when we finally do, prepare to be amazed. God is about to awaken us to the truth of who we are, who we always have been, and we, His church, is about to blow Satan out of the water. About time.

Blessings to you, my dear friend. And to you all, my brothers and sisters in Christ, 

Gideon

Wow! Very, very well said, about how and what,  Romans 6&7 are all about. That should be shouted from the roof tops. It is so, so true. The understanding of this, sets a person free. Truly free, like a believer never imagined possible.

Would to God that what you see coming, is of the Lord. For I see only,  a Christian Church that is walking a victorious Christian life, is one that would be pleasing to Him, and pleasing to Him is where all Christians should want to be. Holiness in it’s highest meaning, is what Christ’s death bought for us. That we, His body might walk in newness of life, to experience His salvation on His terms. Oh, that He would rule in all our hearts and “self” would be “reckoned dead” your words are “spirit and life.” As you know “flesh and blood has not revealed these truths to you, but your Father who is in heaven”. Bless His Holy name. That He may increase and we, His body might decrease. 

Much love in Christ, Not me