A question about Jude 1:9

[plo1988]

Here's Jude 1:9,

But even the archangel Michael, when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not himself dare to condemn him for slander but said, "The Lord rebuke you!"

Who is "The Lord" referring to in this verse?

[JoeChan82]

7 minutes ago, LeeGreenForest said:

Who is "The Lord" referring to in this verse?

Are you asking who the Lord is here or who the Lord was rebuking? 

If you are asking who the Lord is, I agree with Yowm, no question about it.

If you are asking who the Lord was rebuking, the answer is the devil.  Michael was contending with the devil.  Instead of directly rebuking the devil, Michael said to the devil, "The Lord rebuke thee".  

[plo1988]

5 minutes ago, JoeChan82 said:

Are you asking who the Lord is here or who the Lord was rebuking? 

If you are asking who the Lord is, I agree with Yowm, no question about it.

If you are asking who the Lord was rebuking, the answer is the devil.  Michael was contending with the devil.  Instead of directly rebuking the devil, Michael said to the devil, "The Lord rebuke thee".  

I was asking who the Lord is here.

Here's another question. In this verse, are the words "The Lord" referring directly to Jesus?

[Mike 2]

3 hours ago, LeeGreenForest said:

Here's Jude 1:9,

But even the archangel Michael, when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not himself dare to condemn him for slander but said, "The Lord rebuke you!"

Who is "The Lord" referring to in this verse?

I think if we do a bit of deductive reasoning we will note that Jesus had not come on the scene yet and in the Old Testament (when Michael would have been contested by the devil) God was referred to as The Lord.

Something to keep in mind though is that God is made up of The Father, The Son and The Holy Spirit and is not some 4th entity.  The Son, whom we see in the physical as Jesus in the New testament, had not yet been fully revealed in the Old Testament although we do see him manifesting in different ways.

[Jayne]

4 hours ago, LeeGreenForest said:

I was asking who the Lord is here.

Here's another question. In this verse, are the words "The Lord" referring directly to Jesus?

I'm going to have to say yes, it is talking about Jesus.  

As Yown has said, the Greek word here is "kyrios or kurios" - and other than the master [as in over a slave] definition, I find in two different lexicons that it means, "God, the Messiah".

Here are a examples where the word is literally referring to Jesus Christ only.  There are way more than just this.  Tons more.

• Romans 10:9 - "...if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord [κύριος] and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."
• Philippians 2:11 - "and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord [κύριος] to the glory of God the Father."
• 1 Corinthians 8:6 - "yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord  [κύριος], Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him."

The same Greek work is used only a few times in the New Testament to define God, the Father only.

• Luke 1:32 - "He [Jesus] will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High. And the Lord [κύριος] God will give to him [Jesus] the throne of his father David..."

Based on those stats, I would say that when Michael said, "The Lord rebuke you!" that he was referencing Jesus Christ who IS God as well as functions as the Son.  So in actuality -it's both.

I can't see a defense based on the root of the word and the bulk of its use to mean the Father alone without the Son.

 

Edited May 25, 2018 by Jayne