people get confused re: the Unforgivable Sin

[cantankerous5]

I have heard many people say they are worried about having committed the unforgivable sin. That is in part due to the fact that  the part of hte Bible that mentions this sin (I will look it up... thought i had that one memorized!) is easily misunderstood.

 

It stands to reason that the only unforgivable sin is rejecting forgiveness, rejecting Christ.

But rejecting Christ is not explicitly mentioned in the passage I am referring to.  In that psg people in the crowd are saying things to Jesus that clearly indicate they  reject him and THAT is the unforgivable sin, not saying something blashphemous or whatever. If you are living according to Jesus's Words, and put his words and Commandments above your own understanding (not so easily said as done because we humans want to do things our own way) you c an be assured you have not committed the unforgivable sin

Edited May 30, 2019 by cantankerous5

[Who me]

It is a clear case of a little knowledge is dangerous.

How can a Christian who's faith is being held on to by Jesus offend Jesus so much that he will let go of that Christians faith?

What terrible sins that will shock and horrify God can a Christian commit to cause them to loose their salvation.

The question shows how little they understand the holiness, mercy and grace that Jesus floods us with.

[OneLight]

Are you referring to this passage in Matthew?

Matthew 12:31-32

Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.

[cantankerous5]

1 hour ago, Who me said:

It is a clear case of a little knowledge is dangerous.

How can a Christian who's faith is being held on to by Jesus offend Jesus so much that he will let go of that Christians faith?

What terrible sins that will shock and horrify God can a Christian commit to cause them to loose their salvation.

The question shows how little they understand the holiness, mercy and grace that Jesus floods us with.

well, yes, but on  the other hand, as one pastor I know of has written.. can't recall his name but anyway.. he wrote something I have been thinking about for a long time namely that people are always wanting to hear about God's mercy but not his wrath or about Justice. Frankly, maybe i am weird but i like hearing about justice more than mercy. maybe that is because i have been through this and that.. I have seen a lot of injustice in my life time.. but in any case, God is both merciful AND just.. and so.. don't u/stand people focusing on mercy all the time. In the Catholic religion, you are forgiven for your sins as soon as you confess them (sincerely) but you still have to expiate the damage caused to your soul by your sins. I have found in my own life t hat sin indeed damages your soul.. and your mind and heart and everything e lse

[cantankerous5]

1 hour ago, OneLight said:

Are you referring to this passage in Matthew?

Matthew 12:31-32

Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.

yes. Sorry, I forgot to look it up, so thanks for that. I knew it was 12:31, forgot which book..

this psg does make it seem that speaking (against the Holy Spirit) can cause you to lose your salvation forever. It is an unclear psg IMO because everyone knows.. well, you know "talk is cheap" and all. I would think unkind words said to God would be a little less damning than murdering someone.. ?

so anyway, I am familiar with Catholic doctrine which says that the unforgivable sin is to reject salvation in Christ and that is w hat I believe. Nothing else makes sense. I mean, presumably,  there is only ONE unforgivable sin so it has to be that. Maybe it is one thing to be against Jesus and the HOly Spirit who leads us to accept him.. and another thing altogether to speak out against them publicly? I don't know.. I can't say I understand the psg fully. All I know is that there are 1000 different interpretations of any given scripture psg--

[OneLight]

2 minutes ago, cantankerous5 said:

yes. Sorry, I forgot to look it up, so thanks for that. I knew it was 12:31, forgot which book..

this psg does make it seem that speaking (against the Holy Spirit) can cause you to lose your salvation forever. It is an unclear psg IMO because everyone knows.. well, you know "talk is cheap" and all. I would think unkind words said to God would be a little less damning than murdering someone.. ?

so anyway, I am familiar with Catholic doctrine which says that the unforgivable sin is to reject salvation in Christ and that is w hat I believe. Nothing else makes sense. I mean, presumably,  there is only ONE unforgivable sin so it has to be that. Maybe it is one thing to be against Jesus and the HOly Spirit who leads us to accept him.. and another thing altogether to speak out against them publicly? I don't know.. I can't say I understand the psg fully. All I know is that there are 1000 different interpretations of any given scripture psg--

I don't see it as unclear at all.  Consider what was going on.  After Jesus healed the blind and mute man, the Pharisee's accused Jesus of casting out demons through Beelzebub, the ruler of the demons (verse 24).  At that point, the Pharisee's were rejecting the Holy Spirit, not Jesus.  There is no recorded miracles in scripture until after the Holy Spirit came down to Him and filled Jesus.  Like us, Jesus, being man, needed the Holy Spirit to perform miracles, and when the Pharisees rebuked Jesus for the miracle He preformed, they were actually rebuking the Holy Spirit, which is why Jesus went on to say what He said in verses 31 and 32. 

[cantankerous5]

2 minutes ago, OneLight said:

I don't see it as unclear at all.  Consider what was going on.  After Jesus healed the blind and mute man, the Pharisee's accused Jesus of casting out demons through Beelzebub, the ruler of the demons (verse 24).  At that point, the Pharisee's were rejecting the Holy Spirit, not Jesus.  There is no recorded miracles in scripture until after the Holy Spirit came down to Him and filled Jesus.  Like us, Jesus, being man, needed the Holy Spirit to perform miracles, and when the Pharisees rebuked Jesus for the miracle He preformed, they were actually rebuking the Holy Spirit, which is why Jesus went on to say what He said in verses 31 and 32. 

yes but they were likely condemned BEFORE manifesting their condemnation by saying what they did. In other words, out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks. they said those things (rejecting Jesus) because they had already .. um.. committed the unforgivable sin?

but again, if there is only one unforgivable sin, it would be totally rejecting Jesus and forgiveness. Maybe I am tired but something is not clicking here.. (no maybe to it, I do feel tired.. and disturbed.. long story why)

 

[cantankerous5]

Just now, cantankerous5 said:

yes but they were likely condemned BEFORE manifesting their condemnation by saying what they did. In other words, out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks. they said those things (rejecting Jesus) because they had already .. um.. committed the unforgivable sin?

but again, if there is only one unforgivable sin, it would be totally rejecting Jesus and forgiveness. Maybe I am tired but something is not clicking here.. (no maybe to it, I do feel tired.. and disturbed.. i have a lot on my mind, etc)

 

 

[OneLight]

16 minutes ago, cantankerous5 said:

yes but they were likely condemned BEFORE manifesting their condemnation by saying what they did. In other words, out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks. they said those things (rejecting Jesus) because they had already .. um.. committed the unforgivable sin?

but again, if there is only one unforgivable sin, it would be totally rejecting Jesus and forgiveness. Maybe I am tired but something is not clicking here.. (no maybe to it, I do feel tired.. and disturbed.. long story why)

Don't worry, rejecting Jesus is rejecting the Holy Spirit as it is the Holy Spirit that convicts us of our sins.  If we reject His conviction, we will never accept the need for salvation through Jesus.  What Jesus is saying, in a nutshell, is when the Holy Spirit does a work, and you claim it is not from God but Satan, that is blasphemy against the Spirit.  I have not ever heard of a believer in Christ do this, as He would check them before making such a claim.

[cantankerous5]

22 minutes ago, OneLight said:

Don't worry, rejecting Jesus is rejecting the Holy Spirit as it is the Holy Spirit that convicts us of our sins.  If we reject His conviction, we will never accept the need for salvation through Jesus.  What Jesus is saying, in a nutshell, is when the Holy Spirit does a work, and you claim it is not from God but Satan, that is blasphemy against the Spirit.  I have not ever heard of a believer in Christ do this, as He would check them before making such a claim.

ok, that  helps. I go through life with too many things on my mind at any given time of the day--  so that's why "something"  was not clicking.. I get it (about the Holy Spirit), but don't always know how to articulate what i "get" in words. In other words, I know I am correct that rejecting Jesus is the one and only unforgivable sin, but didn't (probably still do not) know how to "extract" such from that psg..? We need experts to interpret the Bible. And of course, a lot of us are very cautious about whom we call an expert

Edited May 30, 2019 by cantankerous5