I finished Revelations and have two questions

[Coliseum]

1 hour ago, Sonshine said:

From BibleRef:

The angel said to John: "Let the evildoer still do evil, and the filthy still be filthy, and the righteous still do right, and the holy still be holy" (Revelation 22:11). The point being made here is not that evil is to be encouraged. Rather, the angel's words are a statement of inevitability: people can do as they choose, but God will not change His plans. 

In the context of death and the end times, this is a dire warning. Unbelievers who reject the gospel do not receive a second chance to be saved if they die. Eternity does not change anyone's status. The person who dies in an unsaved condition will be unsaved throughout eternity, and the saved person will be saved throughout eternity. 

When Jesus returns, He will reward the righteous but punish the unrighteous. Daniel 12:10 states that in the end time "Many shall purify themselves and make themselves white and be refined, but the wicked shall act wickedly." Someday it will be too late for the unsaved to change their destination by repenting and believing in Jesus. Hebrews 3:15 implores: "Today, if you hear his voice., do not harden your hearts."

     

I wonder Sonshine---and this is purely a question---should this mean that the hard of heart should not be prayed for while they remain alive, or does the  Proverb, "A live dog is better than a dead lion," not apply? What are your thoughts, sister. 

[BeauJangles]

12 minutes ago, Sister said:

Hi Repose

This scripture is at the end of Revelation - the end of the book. 

Every single man on this earth is called to repentance, and to change, but after over 2000 years of preaching there comes a cut off point where the gospel is preached and the door is closed.  Whatever we have done with the book of life given to us, whether good or bad - when the door is closed, we shall all continue in that same path we walked according to our spirit.

I believe that cut off point is just before the tribulation starts.  If we have not come out of this world by that time, and still joined to the world (as we were warned in Rev 18:4) - we will "still" walk into that tribulation in the same state of our spirit which we had before ....reaping what we have sowed, and this could make a difference between a fiery trial, and not only that but receiving the plagues that are coming, or a trial with a little help to be delivered from those plagues and our adversaries.  Everyone will stand in their own lot.

Let me see if I understand you correctly. For instance, if a Christian backslides and continues to struggle in their walk before the Lord and stumbles, they won't make the Second Coming. They go through the tribulation because they weren't serving God to the best of their abilities? 

[Sister]

13 hours ago, Repose said:

Second, I was reading the description of the New Jerusalem, specifically of the foundations. They describe each one being adorned with a gem stone. I was thinking that these referred to the breastpiece on the robe Aaron would wear, with the twelve stones for the twelve tribes. Did I catch that right?

Yes that would be symbolic of the future.  The twelve walls of the city symbolise the 12 tribes, and yes all their names will be recorded on those walls. That's a good thing you picked up there!  A little more of an insight.

[Sister]

4 minutes ago, BeauJangles said:

Let me see if I understand you correctly. For instance, if a Christian backslides and continues to struggle in their walk before the Lord and stumbles, they won't make the Second Coming. They go through the tribulation because they weren't serving God to the best of their abilities? 

Hi BeauJangles.

Yes exactly.  We are given ample time to repent and give our whole hearts to the Lord. He has been so patient with us.  If we did not manage this "change" in the space of time he has given us, then obviously we have not been following his commandments.  Unfortunately we will be seen as hypocrites and will share in Babylon's sins, and her plagues.

We all have to make it to the second Coming.  We have to endure to the end or our end.  The tribulation will test who is walking in the Lord and who is not.

Revelation 18:4   And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

The ungodly and the unloyal will receive the plagues.

 

[johnthebaptist]

On 11/4/2019 at 3:11 PM, Repose said:

I finished up Revelations and I have two things. The first is what this line of scripture means:

Revelations 22:11 - "He that is unjust, let him be unjust still. He that is filthy, let him be filthy still. He that is righteous, let him be righteous still. He that is holy, let him be holy still".

Second, I was reading the description of the New Jerusalem, specifically of the foundations. They describe each one being adorned with a gem stone. I was thinking that these referred to the breastpiece on the robe Aaron would wear, with the twelve stones for the twelve tribes. Did I catch that right?

For your first question, off the top of my head, it might mean: Let people choose to do what they will, and then let them experience the consequences of what they have done. It is a good learning experience.

[johnthebaptist]

On 11/4/2019 at 3:11 PM, Repose said:

I finished up Revelations and I have two things. The first is what this line of scripture means:

Revelations 22:11 - "He that is unjust, let him be unjust still. He that is filthy, let him be filthy still. He that is righteous, let him be righteous still. He that is holy, let him be holy still".

Second, I was reading the description of the New Jerusalem, specifically of the foundations. They describe each one being adorned with a gem stone. I was thinking that these referred to the breastpiece on the robe Aaron would wear, with the twelve stones for the twelve tribes. Did I catch that right?

For your second question, I tend to believe New Jerusalem is the peace of mind that descends on us when we repent of our sin.

[Dennis1209]

On 11/4/2019 at 5:11 PM, Repose said:

I finished up Revelations and I have two things. The first is what this line of scripture means:

Revelations 22:11 - "He that is unjust, let him be unjust still. He that is filthy, let him be filthy still. He that is righteous, let him be righteous still. He that is holy, let him be holy still".

Second, I was reading the description of the New Jerusalem, specifically of the foundations. They describe each one being adorned with a gem stone. I was thinking that these referred to the breastpiece on the robe Aaron would wear, with the twelve stones for the twelve tribes. Did I catch that right?

When I read Revelation, I had [and still do] many more questions than two! Below is a brief explanation I agree with on Revelation 22:11.

Verse 11. He that is unjust, let him be unjust still. This must refer to the scenes beyond the judgment, and must be intended to affirm an important truth in regard to the condition of men in the future state. It cannot refer to the condition of men this side the grave, for there is no fixed and unchangeable condition in this world. At the close of this book, and at the close of the whole volume of revealed truth, it was proper to declare, in the most solemn manner, that when these events were consummated everything would be fixed and unchanging; that all who were then found to be righteous would remain so for ever; and that none who were impenitent, impure, and wicked, would ever change their character or condition. That this is the meaning here seems to me to be plain; and this sentiment accords with all that is said in the Bible of the final condition of the righteous and the wicked.

As for your second question, and it's just my opinion and it's from memory and could be wrong. But yes, the high priests breastplate and stones are symbolic and was prescribed by God. I'm thinking they have something to do with each of the twelve tribes? The twelve gates are representative of the twelve tribes of Israel, and the twelve foundations represent the Apostles. In light of the context and where Revelation 21:11 is positioned, I'm thinking this is a visual description by John of what the exterior of the New Jerusalem looks like?

Revelation 21:11 (KJV) Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;

[Michael37]

On 11/5/2019 at 12:11 PM, Repose said:

I finished up Revelations and I have two things

Hi Repose, 

There are blessings for those who read the Book of Revelation, which is singular BTW, it is one complete Revelation or "uncovering" (see definition below).

There are also blessings for those who hear the words of prophecy which are found in the Book of Revelation.

Yet again there are also blessings for those who keep the things written in the Book of Revelation.

Keep reading Revelation, Repose, keep going to it and be wonderfully blessed.

Rev 1:3
(3)  Blessed is he who reads and those who hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written in it; for the time is near.

apocalypse

[əˈpɒkəlɪps]

NOUN

the Apocalypse (noun) · apocalypses (plural noun)

1. (the Apocalypse)

   the complete final destruction of the world, as described in the biblical book of Revelation.

   "the bell's ringing is supposed to usher in the Apocalypse"

   • (the Apocalypse)
     (especially in the Vulgate Bible) the book of Revelation.
2. an event involving destruction or damage on a catastrophic scale.

   "the apocalypse of World War II"

 

ORIGIN

Old English, via Old French and ecclesiastical Latin from Greek apokalupsis, from apokaluptein ‘uncover, reveal’, from apo-‘un-’ + kaluptein‘to cover’. [Oxford Dictionary Online]

[Tzephanyahu]

Shalom @Repose

You finished Revelation and only have TWO questions? Hehe, I have many.   The more I read it the more I find! 

Someone may have answered you sufficiently in this thread already but, if not, here is my understanding on the matter.

On 11/4/2019 at 11:11 PM, Repose said:

Revelations 22:11 - "He that is unjust, let him be unjust still. He that is filthy, let him be filthy still. He that is righteous, let him be righteous still. He that is holy, let him be holy still".

This seems to be a principle that runs throughout Scripture.  Not even will repent, not everyone will be saved.  I see this statement as a supportive statement, basically saying "Look, let those who wish to be cruel and unclean remain in their error, even if they seem prosperous.  But let those who seek to do righteously and live holy lives stand firm".  

Hopefully this should remind you of the the Lord Yahushua (Jesus Christ) when He said that He spoke to the people in parables so that the Kingdom of God would be hidden from those with a darkened heart - lest they should turn and He would heal them.

On 11/4/2019 at 11:11 PM, Repose said:

Second, I was reading the description of the New Jerusalem, specifically of the foundations. They describe each one being adorned with a gem stone. I was thinking that these referred to the breastpiece on the robe Aaron would wear, with the twelve stones for the twelve tribes. Did I catch that right?

There is a theory that when describing coloured lights, the ancient scribes compared them them to gemstones (i.e. red light = ruby).  So perhaps New Jerusalem doesn't not necessarily have those physical stones but comparable coloured stones of light.

However, the comparison you have made with Aaron's breastplate is both wise and insightful. 

 There remains a "problem" though in the fact that the precious gemstones have had their name changed a few times in Greek and Hebrew, and others have lost names, making it very difficult to say for certainty what stones are what.  But I think you have got the idea, praise Yahweh.

How did you feel after reading Revelation?

Love & Shalom

[Repose]

2 hours ago, Tzephanyahu said:

How did you feel after reading Revelation?

This is the second time I've read it, but as it is with scripture, it's like you pick up on different things each time.

If anything, it just reinforces the idea that I could and probably should be doing more. I don't attend church. I don't know where to start there, not to mention being nervous around other people, and just not quite being at a point where I could hold my head high. There's probably a ton of things I could or should be doing and things I could not or should not be doing. I'm in a bit of a stasis of sorts, really - and that's not life, it's just momentum carrying me from one day to the next, and it's not good.