I'm struggeling to accept hell

[BeauJangles]

6 minutes ago, Wesley L said:

Satan knows that Jesus paid the price. He believes that it is true. But he rejects and hates the idea. 
Only a simple belief that Jesus paid the price for our sins is not the complete gospel.
Not trying to argue, but trying to prevent misconception of the Gospel when other immature christians reads this comment.

From what I gather, it's a brief outline and not something of wordy explanations. Some replies are lengthy and others not so much. 

[enoob57]

15 hours ago, Alive said:

I suggest to anyone to simply ask God, if He is going to torture people endlessly.

Does the Spirit in you think that would be justice?

The Word of God tries the spirits

1 John 4:1

4 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
KJV

The Bible clearly speaks of an eternal punishment and Jesus Himself gave the account of the rich man and Lazarus... thus is the spirit your listening to is saying other than you know to apply the verse above to see spiritually with...

[Wesley L]

On 12/14/2019 at 2:58 AM, Ineedhugs said:

For the last 6 months I've been a christen but after about 10 days of being faithful and sinless I get these strong feelings that hell is just insane and there couldn't possibly be one. That leads to losing my faith temporarily because then I can't trust what the bible says. How can I stay faithful the rest of my life?

Like how could a loving god brutally torture people just cos they had sex or didn't believe in him or they get drunk etc. It's not rational to care so much about those things let alone torture them for eternity. It's hard for me to accept this. If i can't accept hell then why believe anything in the bible you know?

A guy called Bill wiese apparently went to hell for 23 minutes and tries to bring the world to repentance after his experience. He has youtube videos and he said that the reason hell is justified is because who you wrong determines the severity of punishment. Like if I punch my (male) friend its wrong, if I punch my mother its much worse and if I punch the queen its FAR worse. Since god is infinitely greater than us in position then sins against him are worthy of eternal punishment. Like if you bashed the queen of England you would probably be put to death, and you can say but I only bashed her, normally you just get 3 months jail for that....well you would still get put to death.

While I can see what Bill is saying I still have a hard time accepting it. I could never put someone through that especially for 'little sins' that most good people do. Isn't the right thing to give little things little punishments? If someone heard about Jesus but didn't believe because of reasons that made sense to them shouldn't you be understanding as long as they weren't bad people? I thought these are universally the 'right thing'.

I want to be a perfect Christian but these strong gut feelings keep making me lose faith.....any ideas on how to help?  

What I have understood from this post:

How can eternal hell be the truth compared to a loving God? If I doubt hell, that causes me to doubt the complete truth of the bible.
I tried to put hell in perspective. We sin against our Creator. An eternal, holy, almighty and rightious God. The punishment would be parallel to it. But even then it was hard for me to understand hell.
Then I try to put my own understanding into perspective. It is impossible for me to understand God fully. What do we do when we don't understand things fully? We choose to have faith in God.
Do we understand what Trinity means? No way, nobody understands that. We have faith.
Do we understand how God created life? No way, we have faith in that He did.
Do we understand eternity? No way, we have faith that it is.
If we understand all, then there is no room for faith. All that remains is agreement or disagreement.
Actually, I have no good answer for you. In moments of doubt, hang onto our Creator. Hang onto Jesus, persevere, pray to Him that He may strenghthen your faith and give you wisdom. So eventually you will have faith that hell exists and is not contradicting God's nature and the truth.
I don't advice you to put away your question. As satan will use it to attack your faith. If God and the bible is true, you may test it and it will endure any tests.

How can I still sin while being a christian?
It is true that thoughts can be sinfull too. Jesus Himself said, whoever has lust for another woman in his heart, has commited adultry already in his heart. Whoever hates someone, has already committed murder in his heart.
My understanding is, being a born again christian means we are saved, but we are still in our worldly bodies. Our old self died and rose with Christ, but we are still in the flesh. Which means, we still have our sinfull nature. But we also have the promised helper = The Holy Spirit within us.
That you feel troubled by your current sins is a good sign. God hates sin, so should you. Acknowledging your current sins is the way to sanctification with the help of The Holy Spirit within you. It takes time and is sometimes quite a struggle and your faith will be tested. But KNOW that you are saved already, you salvation does not hang onto how good your performance is as a born again christian, but on Christ, Christ alone. (Not acknowledging your sins blocks the road to sanctification.)

(P.S. my personal opinion is that the 23minutes in hell is not the truth, I see Bill Wiese as a false prophet. We can't look inside someone's heart, but the bible teaches us to look at the fruits. Bad trees bare bad fruits, good trees bares good fruits)

 

[Revlori]

On 12/13/2019 at 8:58 PM, Ineedhugs said:

For the last 6 months I've been a christen but after about 10 days of being faithful and sinless I get these strong feelings that hell is just insane and there couldn't possibly be one. That leads to losing my faith temporarily because then I can't trust what the bible says. How can I stay faithful the rest of my life?

Like how could a loving god brutally torture people just cos they had sex or didn't believe in him or they get drunk etc. It's not rational to care so much about those things let alone torture them for eternity. It's hard for me to accept this. If i can't accept hell then why believe anything in the bible you know?

A guy called Bill wiese apparently went to hell for 23 minutes and tries to bring the world to repentance after his experience. He has youtube videos and he said that the reason hell is justified is because who you wrong determines the severity of punishment. Like if I punch my (male) friend its wrong, if I punch my mother its much worse and if I punch the queen its FAR worse. Since god is infinitely greater than us in position then sins against him are worthy of eternal punishment. Like if you bashed the queen of England you would probably be put to death, and you can say but I only bashed her, normally you just get 3 months jail for that....well you would still get put to death.

While I can see what Bill is saying I still have a hard time accepting it. I could never put someone through that especially for 'little sins' that most good people do. Isn't the right thing to give little things little punishments? If someone heard about Jesus but didn't believe because of reasons that made sense to them shouldn't you be understanding as long as they weren't bad people? I thought these are universally the 'right thing'.

I want to be a perfect Christian but these strong gut feelings keep making me lose faith.....any ideas on how to help?  

Hello,

Perhaps you can look at things this way. As you started out, you believed in God and his son Jesus Christ. To receive Christ as savior you must believe that he is and God's word is true because God describes all the accounts of Christ. Now God made Christ Jesus, and he also made Satan ( he was Lucifer, a beautiful angel) he had fallen. God made Hell for him and the fallen angels that sinned. Now if you believe God's word on Christ and through Christ you have an eternal place in heaven, why would you doubt Hell? God didn't desire anyone to go to Hell. That as why he gives us A way not to go, it's Christ. God don't put anyone in Hell. It's up to you. It's your choice to reject Christ and go to Hell. That is why anyone is in Hell right now, for their own choice to reject Christ as savior.The punishment that one goes through is because of there unforgiven sin. 

God bless ?

[Alive]

1 hour ago, enoob57 said:

The Word of God tries the spirits

1 John 4:1

4 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
KJV

The Bible clearly speaks of an eternal punishment and Jesus Himself gave the account of the rich man and Lazarus... thus is the spirit your listening to is saying other than you know to apply the verse above to see spiritually with...

enoob--please be careful to indict a brother in such a way. This is not good for you.

There is much scriptural evidence available for my view of hell, hades, Sheol, etc.

I would encourage you to do a study of the words Gehenna, hell, hades and Sheol as well.

Here is a definition of the world translated 'perish' and its variants appearing 38 times in the NT.

Mounce Greek Dictionary (Greek Entry)

 

GK G660 | S G622   ἀπόλλυμι   apollymi   90x  

 

to destroy utterly; to kill, Mt. 2:13; to bring to nought, make void, 1 Cor. 1:19; to lose, be deprived of, Mt. 10:42; to be destroyed, perish, Mt. 9:17; to be put to death, to die, Mt. 26:52; to be lost, to stray, Mt. 10:6 → destroy; lose; perish.

 

 

 

Matt. 5:29 If your right eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell. ³⁰ And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.

 

Matt. 8:25 Then His disciples came to Him and awoke Him, saying, “Lord, save us! We are perishing!”

 

Matt. 8:32   And He said to them, “Go.” So when they had come out, they went into the herd of swine. And suddenly the whole herd of swine ran violently down the steep place into the sea, and perished in the water.

 

Matt. 18:14 Even so it is not the will of your Father who is in heaven that one of these little ones should perish.

 

Matt. 26:52   But Jesus said to him, “Put your sword in its place, for all who take the sword will perish by the sword.

 

Mark 4:38 But He was in the stern, asleep on a pillow. And they awoke Him and said to Him, “Teacher, do You not care that we are perishing?”

 

Luke 8:24 And they came to Him and awoke Him, saying, “Master, Master, we are perishing!”

 

Then He arose and rebuked the wind and the raging of the water. And they ceased, and there was a calm.

 

Luke 11:51 from the blood of Abel to the blood of Zechariah who perished between the altar and the temple. Yes, I say to you, it shall be required of this generation.

 

Luke 13:3 I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.

 

Luke 13:5 I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish.”

 

Luke 13:33 Nevertheless I must journey today, tomorrow, and the day following; for it cannot be that a prophet should perish outside of Jerusalem.

 

Luke 15:17   “But when he came to himself, he said, ‘How many of my father’s hired servants have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!

 

John 3:15 that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life. ¹⁶ For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

 

John 6:27 Do not labor for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to everlasting life, which the Son of Man will give you, because God the Father has set His seal on Him.”

 

John 10:28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand.

 

John 11:50 nor do you consider that it is expedient for us that one man should die for the people, and not that the whole nation should perish.”

 

Acts 5:37 After this man, Judas of Galilee rose up in the days of the census, and drew away many people after him. He also perished, and all who obeyed him were dispersed.

 

Acts 8:20   But Peter said to him, “Your money perish with you, because you thought that the gift of God could be purchased with money!

 

Acts 13:41 “Behold, you despisers,

Marvel and perish!

For I work a work in your days,

A work which you will by no means believe,

Though one were to declare it to you.’ ”

 

Rom. 2:12   For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law

 

1Cor. 1:18   For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

 

1Cor. 8:11 And because of your knowledge shall the weak brother perish, for whom Christ died?

 

1Cor. 15:18 Then also those who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished.

 

2Cor. 2:15 For we are to God the fragrance of Christ among those who are being saved and among those who are perishing.

 

2Cor. 4:3 But even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing,

 

2Cor. 4:16   Therefore we do not lose heart. Even though our outward man is perishing, yet the inward man is being renewed day by day.

 

Col. 2:22 which all concern things which perish with the using—according to the commandments and doctrines of men?

 

2Th. 2:10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

 

Heb. 1:11 They will perish, but You remain;

And they will all grow old like a garment;

 

Heb. 11:31 By faith the harlot Rahab did not perish with those who did not believe, when she had received the spies with peace.

 

James 1:11 For no sooner has the sun risen with a burning heat than it withers the grass; its flower falls, and its beautiful appearance perishes. So the rich man also will fade away in his pursuits.

 

1Pet. 1:7 that the genuineness of your faith, being much more precious than gold that perishes, though it is tested by fire, may be found to praise, honor, and glory at the revelation of Jesus Christ,

 

2Pet. 2:12   But these, like natural brute beasts made to be caught and destroyed, speak evil of the things they do not understand, and will utterly perish in their own corruption,

 

2Pet. 3:6 by which the world that then existed perished, being flooded with water.

 

2Pet. 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

 

Jude 11 Woe to them! For they have gone in the way of Cain, have run greedily in the error of Balaam for profit, and perished in the rebellion of Korah.

 

The story that Jesus told of Lazarus and the rich man is a parable and Jesus used it to make several points. There are scriptural problems with considering it literal.

Abraham’s bosom is not heaven (Hebrews 11:8–10, 16).

People in hell can’t talk to those in heaven (Isaiah 65:17).

The dead are in their graves (Job 17:13; John 5:28, 29). The rich man was in bodily form, with eyes, a tongue, etc., yet we know that the body does not go to hell immediately at death. The body remains in the grave, as the Bible says. If you’d like to know more about what happens after death, visit The Truth About Death website.

People are rewarded at Christ’s second coming, not at death (Revelation 22:12).

The lost are punished in hell at the end of the world, not when they die (Matthew 13:40–42). Luke 16:31, the last verse of the story, contains a spiritual lesson, showing that the story is actually a parable. Parables cannot be taken literally. If we took parables literally, then we must believe that trees talk! (See this parable in Judges 9:8–15).

[Alive]

In addition to 'perish' the same greek word is used many times and translated as 'destroy'. In some cases destroy has behind it another word meaning much the same. Notice Matt. 10:28

647. καταλύω; kataluō; future katalusō; 1 aorist katelusa; 1 aorist passive kateluthēn; 1 future passive 3 person singular kataluthēsetai; to dissolve, disunite (see, III. 4); a. (what has been joined together) equivalent to to destroy, demolish: lithous (A.V. throw down), Matt. 24:2; Mark 13:2; Luke 21:6; ton naon, Matt. 26:61; 27:40; Mark 14:58; 15:29; Acts 6:14; oikian, 2 Cor. 5:1; universally opposed to oikodomein, Gal. 2:18 (2 Esdr. 5:12; Homer, Iliad 9, 24f; 2, 117; teuchē, Euripides, Tro. 819; gefuran, Herodian, 8, 4, 4 (2 edition, Bekker)). b. metaphorically, to overthrow, i.e. to render vain, to deprive of success, to bring to naught: t

 

Matt. 2:13   Now when they had departed, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to Joseph in a dream, saying, “Arise, take the young Child and His mother, flee to Egypt, and stay there until I bring you word; for Herod will seek the young Child to destroy Him.”

 

Matt. 5:17   “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill.

 

Matt. 6:19   “Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal; ²⁰ but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal.

 

Matt. 10:28 And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. But rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

 

Matt. 12:14 Then the Pharisees went out and plotted against Him, how they might destroy Him.

 

Matt. 21:41   They said to Him, “He will destroy those wicked men miserably, and lease his vineyard to other vinedressers who will render to him the fruits in their seasons.”

 

Matt. 22:7 But when the king heard about it, he was furious. And he sent out his armies, destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.

 

Matt. 26:61 and said, “This fellow said, ‘I am able to destroy the temple of God and to build it in three days.’ ”

 

Matt. 27:20   But the chief priests and elders persuaded the multitudes that they should ask for Barabbas and destroy Jesus.

 

Matt. 27:40 and saying, “You who destroy the temple and build it in three days, save Yourself! If You are the Son of God, come down from the cross.”

 

Mark 1:24 saying, “Let us alone! What have we to do with You, Jesus of Nazareth? Did You come to destroy us? I know who You are—the Holy One of God!”

 

Mark 3:6 Then the Pharisees went out and immediately plotted with the Herodians against Him, how they might destroy Him.

 

Mark 9:22 And often he has thrown him both into the fire and into the water to destroy him. But if You can do anything, have compassion on us and help us.”

 

Mark 11:18   And the scribes and chief priests heard it and sought how they might destroy Him; for they feared Him, because all the people were astonished at His teaching.

 

Mark 12:9   “Therefore what will the owner of the vineyard do? He will come and destroy the vinedressers, and give the vineyard to others.

 

Mark 14:58 “We heard Him say, ‘I will destroy this temple made with hands, and within three days I will build another made without hands.’ ”

 

Mark 15:29   And those who passed by blasphemed Him, wagging their heads and saying, “Aha! You who destroy the temple and build it in three days,

 

Luke 4:34 saying, “Let us alone! What have we to do with You, Jesus of Nazareth? Did You come to destroy us? I know who You are—the Holy One of God!”

 

Luke 6:9 Then Jesus said to them, “I will ask you one thing: Is it lawful on the Sabbath to do good or to do evil, to save life or to destroy?”

 

Luke 9:25 For what profit is it to a man if he gains the whole world, and is himself destroyed or lost?

 

Luke 9:56 For the Son of Man did not come to destroy men’s lives but to save them.” And they went to another village.

 

Luke 12:33 Sell what you have and give alms; provide yourselves money bags which do not grow old, a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches nor moth destroys.

 

Luke 17:27 They ate, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and the flood came and destroyed them all.

 

Luke 17:29 but on the day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all.

 

Luke 19:47   And He was teaching daily in the temple. But the chief priests, the scribes, and the leaders of the people sought to destroy Him,

 

Luke 20:16 He will come and destroy those vinedressers and give the vineyard to others.”

 

And when they heard it they said, “Certainly not!”

 

John 2:19   Jesus answered and said to them, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.”

 

John 10:10 The thief does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy. I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly.

[enoob57]

43 minutes ago, Alive said:

The story that Jesus told of Lazarus and the rich man is a parable and Jesus used it to make several points. There are scriptural problems with considering it literal.

It is not parable or it would be lie... to name one in an event and it not be so is lie. Parables are not specific- Lazarus and the rich man are! Even so what Jesus said must be true parable or no!

[Alive]

2 minutes ago, enoob57 said:

It is not parable or it would be lie... to name one in an event and it not be so is lie. Parables are not specific Lazarus and the rich man are! Even so what Jesus said must be true parable or no!

I understand. Many sons think this way. I am offering an alternative with many scriptures to consider.

I have pasted many, but there are many more. There are also scriptures such as those in Revelation talking about the Lake of Fire and Hell being cast into it.

Those can be taken in more than one way. A great many true hearted believers think Revelation is all allegory. This does not make them false.

I think hell is not a literal place, but rather an illustration of death and destruction and separation from God.

There will indeed be suffering for every unredeemed soul. For certain at the judgement day and possible some after in relative fashion.

We must always remember context. Understand how the Jews related to Gehenna, Sheol, etc. Jesus was speaking to those Jews.

Gehenna--a dump where refuse and dead babies were burned.

Sheol--the grave.

Hades---now there is one to study on.

Eternal punishment can mean a 'perishing' that has no end. Once done its done. Forever separated from God and any inheritance of Christ that the Father offered.

Eternal physical and mental torture? This is not the character of the God I have come to know.

[enoob57]

2 minutes ago, Alive said:

I understand. Many sons think this way. I am offering an alternative with many scriptures to consider.

I have pasted many, but there are many more. There are also scriptures such as those in Revelation talking about the Lake of Fire and Hell being cast into it.

Those can be taken in more than one way. A great many true hearted believers think Revelation is all allegory. This does not make them false.

I think hell is not a literal place, but rather an illustration of death and destruction and separation from God.

There will indeed be suffering for every unredeemed soul. For certain at the judgement day and possible some after in relative fashion.

We must always remember context. Understand how the Jews related to Gehenna, Sheol, etc. Jesus was speaking to those Jews.

Gehenna--a dump where refuse and dead babies were burned.

Sheol--the grave.

Hades---now there is one to study on.

Eternal punishment can mean a 'perishing' that has no end. Once done its done. Forever separated from God and any inheritance of Christ that the Father offered.

Eternal physical and mental torture? This is not the character of the God I have come to know.

When one passage indicates eternal conscious torment all the rest become in meaning supportive of … Scripture does not conflict nor does The Lord lie. So to offer other is to not stand on the firm foundation of God's Word 

Rom 3:4-6

4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

5 But if our unrighteousness commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? Is God unrighteous who taketh vengeance? (I speak as a man)

6 God forbid: for then how shall God judge the world?
KJV
 

[Alive]

12 minutes ago, enoob57 said:

When one passage indicates eternal conscious torment all the rest become in meaning supportive of … Scripture does not conflict nor does The Lord lie. So to offer other is to not stand on the firm foundation of God's Word 

Rom 3:4-6

4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

5 But if our unrighteousness commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? Is God unrighteous who taketh vengeance? (I speak as a man)

6 God forbid: for then how shall God judge the world?
KJV
 

And yet I have quoted a great many verses that seem contrary to your eternal torture, but rather speak to a ceasing to exist?

How do you square those? I only ask you to give room to consider these things before your Lord and mine---the Lord of heaven and earth and our Savior.

¹⁶ For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

Edited December 15, 2019 by Alive