Is "charging" ever cheating??

[CaptWalker]

Well I know this is probably not the norm as far as questions posed here, but lately have really been wondering about just how far you should go in following where you feel God is leading you. So i'll just get straight to it by asking would HE ever expect you to live almost entirely with your credit card or should you wait until you have the necessary funds to do what you feel called to? In other words, I am feeling "led" to relocate to another city across the country but barely have enough to even eat on, so my main expenses(lodging,gas,etc) would all be on credit. And I already owe almost $300 and am afraid if i don't make the minimum $25 payment that my card may start being declined? And i would have to secure some kind of job first just to have any hope of getting back to where i can sustain myself with a regular income. And even though i do have the faith to believe God will provide what i need for the most part, but at the same time He is not obliged to bail us out of certain situations that we get ourselves in without first seeking His counsel or the "OK" to go ahead with those plans. And i am very aware of what the Bible says about Usury, so no need to remind me unless you just feel led to quote some of those scriptures in order to maybe help someone else better understand God's views on this. And apparently there is actually such a thing as a dumb question, or at least an unnecessary one, but am hoping i would be given a pass on that HERE...? 

Edited February 1, 2020 by CaptWalker

[The_Patriot21]

is using credit cards wrong? well, financially its not wise-its spending money you don't have-and even if you have the money to pay it back in the future, you end up paying more for whatever item then you otherwise would have through interest. Its not wise financially. there have been times that I have had to do so, but im paying the consequences for it now.

Is it a sin? well the bible certainly has a lot to say about financial responsibility. My thoughts are if its something God truly wants you to do, He will provide a way to do it. I would be hesitant to go into massive debt just to move, unless it was absolutly necessary. When I moved from my last town to this one, I did-but there was a goal-I was barely making ends meet in my last town, and I had a high paying job lined up where Im at now and a plan to get a higher paying one. So yes I went into debt-but I also got it paid back.

I would say do not move and use your credit card unless you have a plan. Sure you want to move-but it sounds like you don't have a plan. its move, find housing and then a job. I would first sit down, decide why you want to move, what kind of work you are looking for, and how much its going to cost you to move. If you just move without a plan, then chances are high you will be in your new town, in debt, with no work. If Possible I would instead stay where your at, work if possible, and save up money, and once youve saved up some take say a weeks vacation to visit the new town, get a feel for the place and put in some job applications, then go back. and with any luck you will find a job there, so that when you do end up leaving, instead of leaving to the unknown and in debt, you will be moving to a job, and financially secure.

[Justin Adams]

21 minutes ago, CaptWalker said:

And i do believe there are actually such a thing as a dumb question,

Not dumb. More should ask. Get any job to pay off card and save. Any job. You do not know what is around the corner. Pay off the card, save and then move. Like Patriot said. A plan bro. A plan.

[CaptWalker]

Well unfortunately you quoted me before i had a chance to edit,(ooops!) since i thought maybe the way i worded it might offend someone? Oh well, that's kind of how my luck's been going lately anyway, and yes i agree 110% on paying it off or at least to where it is much more manageable. But even after a few bad mistakes i made not long ago i just feel like God/Holy Spirit has been still expecting me to "act" on what i was supposed to do before those mistakes, and that's my problem as far as just how i go about it. I know that sounds unfair and doesn't seem to represent who God is and what He has already done as far as salvation through His only Son, but also I feel like HE expects us to take responsibility and sometimes that requires quite extreme measures on our part. But to me it just seems like having to pay for almost everything with a credit card is even illogical and unethical to non-believers, so maybe i've answered my own question? But does seem like God has worked in stranger ways before, or maybe i'm just letting some of these looney "faith preachers" to influence me a bit too much???

Edited February 1, 2020 by CaptWalker

[Jostler]

Brother if the Lord didn't specifically speak to you and tell you to accomplish what is on your heart using credit (and I'm skeptical He would do that anyway), I'd wait until He funds you. 

 

Quote

Pro 22:7

The rich rule over the poor, and the borrower is slave to the lender.

We are to have ONE Master.  Going into debt puts us in a position where we might well be constrained in our ability to follow where He leads.

I think Wisdom would be to go to Him and say "Lord, I feel this impression, this urging, and if this really does represent Your will for my life, I'm looking to You for Your plan and the resources necessary to make it happen.  I'm willing, let Your will be done."

He is not constrained by money.  He owns it all.  He provides for what He appoints.  Personally, I take situations like this as an opportunity to see Him move.  I struggle with the idea we need to go bow down before bankers to have our needs met.  I'm not saying using credit in every situation is wrong.   But it better be very precisely and pointedly led of the Lord if we do.

Again, for me personally, i will not EVER borrow money for daily needs.  If what I need to spend the money on is going to be consumed, and need replacing, i'll do without until i can save enough to pay full price, up front.

I can imagine some situations where borrowing short term, based on a very well thought out plan that will allow me to create more capital...MIGHT be ok.  But I am not in debt now, haven't been for about 15 years I guess....and have no plans to ever borrow money again.  I got a credit card and I use it....for convenience.  But it gets paid off every time I use it too.   Within days, before any interest accrues at all.

i pray He will give you wisdom as you seek to do His will.

 

[other one]

31 minutes ago, CaptWalker said:

Well I know this is probably not the norm as far as questions posed here, but lately have really been wondering about just how far you should go in following where you feel God is leading you. So i'll just get straight to it by asking would HE ever expect you to live almost entirely with your credit card or should you wait until you have the necessary funds to do what you feel called to? In other words, I am feeling "led" to relocate to another city across the country but barely have enough to even eat on, so my main expenses(lodging,gas,etc) would all be on credit. And I already owe almost $300 and am afraid if i don't make the minimum $25 payment that my card may start being declined? And i would have to secure some kind of job first just to have any hope of getting back to where i can sustain myself with a regular income. And even though i do have the faith to believe God will provide what i need for the most part, but at the same time He is not obliged to bail us out of certain situations that we get ourselves in without first seeking His counsel or the "OK" to go ahead with those plans. And i am very aware of what the Bible says about Usury, so no need to remind me unless you just feel led to quote some of those scriptures in order to maybe help someone else better understand God's views on this. And apparently there is actually such a thing as a dumb question, or at least an unnecessary one, but am hoping i would be given a pass on that HERE...? 

if you are going to drive across the country. you can actually sleep in the car at a Walmart parking lot....   you can use their restrooms and buy cheap food there instead of using restaurants.   You might be surprised how cheap it can be to drive across the country.

As for using the credit card, that's a real gamble.   Is there any way of getting some kind of a job lined up before you get there...

Ultimately you are asking us something you need to be asking God about.

Also it's kind of low for my personal self pride but you could just ask people to help you get there as you cross the country.    We have panhandlers here that just stand on the corner asking for money that can make 30 thousand dollars a year...

If you are traveling all the way across the country to California, I would just say don't go unless God makes a way...    don't do the credit card....   if he really wants you to go he'll make a way.

[CaptWalker]

Well as far as begging goes, i personally relate much more to Luke-16:3. And as far as hitchhiking, i've actually gotten a ride before with a truckdriver even though he told me upfront that he was going against company policy by picking me up, so i don't expect to use that as a way to make it where i need to go. But where i'm at NOW is simply not working out, to put it very mildly, so i am open to any new suggestions! 

[Neighbor]

Hi, Back in the old days before credit cards were common I borrowed the minimum of $75 that a finance company would lend me as I needed 25 dollars for a trailer rental in order to move my family to a new better paying job. I spent the $25 on the trailer kept the remaining fifty dollars until my first pay day at the new job and paid off the loan including all their fees. It was the only way I could manage to take the job. I leveraged myself into a job that led me to a career.

 I also once borrowed a million dollars that I did not need in order to get $290,000  that I did need to refinance a ten plex I had built on totally borrowed money. I couldn't get less than the million, but the savings and loan would process a million minimum.  I had literally gone to every source of money there was trying to get less money, but no one would lend  what I needed.

So I built twenty more apartments with the excess money in order to get the one million dolllars the minimum the lender would write  up. I  kept all thirty  until the tenant's rents paid off that loan in full and also made me a bit of money. Then I sold them all, one day having become older and tired of being a landlord.

 

Borrowing isn't always a bad thing, but one needs have a plan of action as to how to use  the money and pay off the loan. Few people can start out self financed, most borrow to buy houses and cars and all sort sof things. But one has to have a plan a real one and then stick to it building up value, equity, so that there is  real gain and not just consumer debt piling up.

 

Oh, God also had me move clean across country not once, but three times. Very expensive! I had to arrange a swing loan of some $20,000 the first time. Yes, it became very obvious it was God's plan for  my family! It has been a wild ride but oh such a blessing.

May God answer your own prayers regarding your own understanding  of His lead for you. Be ready for a wild ride!

[missmuffet]

On 2/1/2020 at 12:16 PM, CaptWalker said:

Well I know this is probably not the norm as far as questions posed here, but lately have really been wondering about just how far you should go in following where you feel God is leading you. So i'll just get straight to it by asking would HE ever expect you to live almost entirely with your credit card or should you wait until you have the necessary funds to do what you feel called to? In other words, I am feeling "led" to relocate to another city across the country but barely have enough to even eat on, so my main expenses(lodging,gas,etc) would all be on credit. And I already owe almost $300 and am afraid if i don't make the minimum $25 payment that my card may start being declined? And i would have to secure some kind of job first just to have any hope of getting back to where i can sustain myself with a regular income. And even though i do have the faith to believe God will provide what i need for the most part, but at the same time He is not obliged to bail us out of certain situations that we get ourselves in without first seeking His counsel or the "OK" to go ahead with those plans. And i am very aware of what the Bible says about Usury, so no need to remind me unless you just feel led to quote some of those scriptures in order to maybe help someone else better understand God's views on this. And apparently there is actually such a thing as a dumb question, or at least an unnecessary one, but am hoping i would be given a pass on that HERE...? 

It is not a wise choice to live off your credit card. You will eventually have it maxed out then what would you do?

[other one]

Just a note about credit cards in general; they are not evil things as long as people understand the costs.   Sometimes such as if your hot water tank goes out, or your car breaks and you can't get to work without it....   then it is a quick preapproved way to borrow some money short term.  Most interest rates though are really ridiculous though.

Using them strictly for convenience is ok as long as you keep a balance in your bank account to ALWAYS pay it off at the end of the month.

Personally we charge everything we can that doesn't have an upcharge we have to pay just to get the cashback rewards from it..     and when you put your utilities, phones and all that stuff on it the cashback adds up.    We have had up to $600 a year.    Put a new house air conditioner on it last year and paid it off with our emergency fund backup.   Could have just paid cash but was much easier to hand them the card and get the cashback and leave the cash in the bank to make interest for 3o days or so.    One can actually use the system to save money if one understands everything and has the self control to always pay it off at the end of the month....

/But one month missed payment or even a late payment can wipe out a lot of the good effects of using the card.

As for security, Discover has covered every single penny of fraud use of our cards, and yes it does happen every two or three years.  Usually from some restaurant where the waiter physically takes your card to put the charge on it out of your sight.   Only once in the past 20 years has it come from an internet usage.  Debit cards do not have that kind of security though and care has to be taken using those.

Just some personal experience for the past 40 years.