Denominational Indoctrination

[OneLight]

1 hour ago, Sister_in_Christ said:

Does anyone know of a website that asks you questions in plain english (without using the official terms) to find out what denomination you align most with?  We have been without a church now since we have moved.  We desire to do home church as Francis Chan had started in the Multiply Movement.  Sadly, though we have tried to make many friends in our area, they all either already have a church or do not attend a church and do not seem interested.  For 50 yrs I always had a church family and now I feel like an orphan ( plus my parents have not talked to me since Nov 2016 and my husband does not have family, so really it is like being an orphan).

 We have visited a few bible believing churches, but just do not feel the Holy Spirit leading us to join any of them.   Here are some off the cuff thoughts. 

Some are better than others perhaps. 

*As far as end times.... it is going to be whatever it is going to be.  Though end times is certainly interesting, I honestly do not feel a need to nail anything down since God seems to always do things in very surprising and amazing ways.  When someone tells me their end times version is 100% the correct one, my response is to ask how then I am to love the lost any differently because of this end time version.  My thought is that we or the lost can die at any second.... so would THAT be an unexpected "end time" that would sort of forfeit any concern then for nailing down a specific end times version?  Let us act like every second could be our last chance to tell someone about Christ or pray for the lost. 

* God is the author of ALL life. Abortion is an abomination.... which is of course linked to fornication, sex trafficking and adultery which I would think accounts for the largest percent of abortions. 

* believers baptism only ( not sure that I think anyone under 18 should be baptised unless they can truly acknowledge that they are a sinner in need of a savior)

* I have not experienced the gift of tongues, casting out of demons or healing  though I think if God wants it to happen it can certainly still happen.  For Matthew 7:21-23 to make sense, then there must still be the capacity to heal and cast out demons. The healing that I hear of seems to be mainly from discomfort or ambiguous things.  But interestingly God used Francis Chan to heal a deaf sister and brother in an unreached people group not too long ago. That was amazing and I believe that it happened.  To me tongues would make more sense if the person we spontaneously able to speak a different actual language to communicate to a person.  I can do prayers in my head to God anytime and anywhere, so there is no real reason to pray out loud in an unknown prayer language as I hear some do (without interpretation)  except to make myself look religious to do it outloud ( did that sound too sassy?)

*  I believe that doing what James 1:27 says in taking care of widows and orphans is paramount and MORE important than using up all our energy worrying about meeting in expensive buildings with a paid staff, praise team and children's programs.  It is more important than discussing things that are debatable.  If we as a church got excited about making sure every kid has a Christian home to go to and then those who do not physically take in a kid are praying and trying to think of resourceful ways of helping (food, clothing, haircuts, tutoring etc).  Then the world would take note of our TRUE love for others. 

* Marriage is between one man and one woman.  

I am sure there are many more things to list, but I believe the bible is 100% inspired by God. God is a Trinity. We need to repent and trust solely in what Jesus Christ did for our salvation. There is nothing we could ever to do earn it. We do good works to show Jesus thank you for His selfless gift. Jesus Christ will return one day. 

 

Here is a very plain, though not through questioner.  http://www.selectsmart.com/FREE/freeResults.php

The statements you post are not in the questions asked.

[Michael37]

Hi Who me,  

On 8/7/2020 at 2:31 PM, Michael37 said:

Even in so-called non-denominational contexts I have been in there has still been a tendency for some among their retinues to overemphasise what it is that sets their group apart from others, and to adhere to an established routine in association with a perceived authority-base.

 

11 hours ago, Who me said:

How is this wrong, if they also preach the gospel?

 In my experience and training, overemphasis of any ideology is a fail, This is best summed up in the adage "Strength taken to extreme becomes a weakness".

Also, given that every denomination begins with someone wanting to emphasise some particular aspect, I would think the whole point of being non-denominational was to avoid this and other denominational characteristics. Often the ideological bias of a group can be picked up in their name or their set of beliefs, neither of which need be intrinsically wrong, but in the case of non-denoms with an overemphasis on their particular brand, more amusing to me because in reality it makes them another denomination. 

[Guest]

23 hours ago, Michael37 said:

You've made my day with your list of links, Saved.One. I have mentioned on Worthy that I like lists (lean towards them you might say) and your one will keep me going for some time. Already I have accessed some familiar material and as well as gleaned some fresh pickings.

One winter not so long ago I spent quite a few cold wet days online pleasantly absorbing hours of Old Testament history through videos and website entries, and became rivetted to stories that involved the splintering of Judaism into the Pharisees, Sadducees, Essenes, Zealots, & Nazarites etc, along with the fascinating accounts of the Maccabees and the Hasmonean Dynasty which they founded.

There's actually a second set of links from 1054 on to today.  But I didn't want to overwhelm you with too many hyperlinks.

[Guest]

5 hours ago, Sister_in_Christ said:

Does anyone know of a website that asks you questions in plain english (without using the official terms) to find out what denomination you align most with?  We have been without a church now since we have moved.  We desire to do home church as Francis Chan had started in the Multiply Movement.  Sadly, though we have tried to make many friends in our area, they all either already have a church or do not attend a church and do not seem interested.  For 50 yrs I always had a church family and now I feel like an orphan ( plus my parents have not talked to me since Nov 2016 and my husband does not have family, so really it is like being an orphan).

 We have visited a few bible believing churches, but just do not feel the Holy Spirit leading us to join any of them.   Here are some off the cuff thoughts. 

Some are better than others perhaps. 

*As far as end times.... it is going to be whatever it is going to be.  Though end times is certainly interesting, I honestly do not feel a need to nail anything down since God seems to always do things in very surprising and amazing ways.  When someone tells me their end times version is 100% the correct one, my response is to ask how then I am to love the lost any differently because of this end time version.  My thought is that we or the lost can die at any second.... so would THAT be an unexpected "end time" that would sort of forfeit any concern then for nailing down a specific end times version?  Let us act like every second could be our last chance to tell someone about Christ or pray for the lost. 

* God is the author of ALL life. Abortion is an abomination.... which is of course linked to fornication, sex trafficking and adultery which I would think accounts for the largest percent of abortions. 

* believers baptism only ( not sure that I think anyone under 18 should be baptised unless they can truly acknowledge that they are a sinner in need of a savior)

* I have not experienced the gift of tongues, casting out of demons or healing  though I think if God wants it to happen it can certainly still happen.  For Matthew 7:21-23 to make sense, then there must still be the capacity to heal and cast out demons. The healing that I hear of seems to be mainly from discomfort or ambiguous things.  But interestingly God used Francis Chan to heal a deaf sister and brother in an unreached people group not too long ago. That was amazing and I believe that it happened.  To me tongues would make more sense if the person we spontaneously able to speak a different actual language to communicate to a person.  I can do prayers in my head to God anytime and anywhere, so there is no real reason to pray out loud in an unknown prayer language as I hear some do (without interpretation)  except to make myself look religious to do it outloud ( did that sound too sassy?)

*  I believe that doing what James 1:27 says in taking care of widows and orphans is paramount and MORE important than using up all our energy worrying about meeting in expensive buildings with a paid staff, praise team and children's programs.  It is more important than discussing things that are debatable.  If we as a church got excited about making sure every kid has a Christian home to go to and then those who do not physically take in a kid are praying and trying to think of resourceful ways of helping (food, clothing, haircuts, tutoring etc).  Then the world would take note of our TRUE love for others. 

* Marriage is between one man and one woman.  

I am sure there are many more things to list, but I believe the bible is 100% inspired by God. God is a Trinity. We need to repent and trust solely in what Jesus Christ did for our salvation. There is nothing we could ever to do earn it. We do good works to show Jesus thank you for His selfless gift. Jesus Christ will return one day. 

People of Worthy Christian Forums have pointed me to gotquestions.org which is a pretty good conservative site.  I can't say I agree with everything there, but it seems a good place to starting.  The kjvbible.org is a good site I have spent many hours on.  There are other sights I don't have bookmarked on this tablet.

Edited August 9, 2020 by Saved.One.by.Grace

[Who me]

3 hours ago, Michael37 said:

overemphasis of any ideology is a fail

So Baptist's stress one must be baptised if one wants to join there church.

Penticostals stress speaking in tongues and grade Christians by there ' gifts' or lack of.

Calvanist stress predestination to a greater or lesser extent.

Anglican,/CoE have rituals and set order of services.

Non denomnations are proud of there tradition of not having traditions with set service patterns no set order of service!

May be things are different in the states, here I mix with different Christians from different traditions and there idiosyncrasies aside, I see no difference.

 

Just how do you see these majoring in minors making a difference?

[Michael37]

2 hours ago, Who me said:

So Baptist's stress one must be baptised if one wants to join there church.

Penticostals stress speaking in tongues and grade Christians by there ' gifts' or lack of.

Calvanist stress predestination to a greater or lesser extent.

Anglican,/CoE have rituals and set order of services.

Non denomnations are proud of there tradition of not having traditions with set service patterns no set order of service!

May be things are different in the states, here I mix with different Christians from different traditions and there idiosyncrasies aside, I see no difference.

Just how do you see these majoring in minors making a difference?

I have observed that the differences vary from doctrinal, either in their dogmas or in their deficits, to  structural and cultural preferences.

I was raised by parents who believed the Anglican Church was the proper one, such was the extent of their indoctrination. It didn't mean they didn't associate with others, and some of their good friends were in other denominations, although so-called "non-conformists" were frowned on.

Quite often congregation members staunchly loyal to their denomination are unaware of its doctrinal stand, for example with some Presbyterians and Baptists oblivious to the Calvinist theology in their governing constitutions.

What difference does denominational majoring in minors make? It leads to denominational pride and it's rampant in my neck of the woods.

I'm not affiliated with any denomination, but have likes and dislikes just the same. Mostly I read God's Word, pray and intercede, serve as required and fellowship with whomever the Lord provides.

[Who me]

2 hours ago, Michael37 said:

leads to denominational pride and it's rampant in my neck of the woods

2 hours ago, Michael37 said:

serve as required and fellowship with whomever the Lord provides.

 

Sounds to me like you sit at home not getting involved with a local church.

 

One of the major reasons we are to meet with others, is not that we might be blessed, but that we might be a blessing to others.

 

I often advise. Enquiring atheists to join a gospel church and to be openly the friendly atheist, who holds the preacher to account for his rationality in his sermon and to be asking Christians, why do you believe that and what evidence do you have for that belief.

I do this for two reasons. That in being exposed to practical Christianity and arguing the reasoning behind it the atheist will come to know Jesus. While also making the preacher and the Christians deepen there knowledge of the Bible.

 

I would suggest you do the same. Attend your local church and be the friendly nondenominational believer, challenging the preacher and members as to why they believe that and what evidence they have for the belief.

 

I don't think you will become a card carrying what ever they are, but you will let light into areas of he church where salt and light have not been for years.

[Michael37]

13 hours ago, Who me said:

Sounds to me like you sit at home not getting involved with a local church.

 

One of the major reasons we are to meet with others, is not that we might be blessed, but that we might be a blessing to others.

I often advise. Enquiring atheists to join a gospel church and to be openly the friendly atheist, who holds the preacher to account for his rationality in his sermon and to be asking Christians, why do you believe that and what evidence do you have for that belief.

I do this for two reasons. That in being exposed to practical Christianity and arguing the reasoning behind it the atheist will come to know Jesus. While also making the preacher and the Christians deepen there knowledge of the Bible.

I would suggest you do the same. Attend your local church and be the friendly nondenominational believer, challenging the preacher and members as to why they believe that and what evidence they have for the belief.

I don't think you will become a card carrying what ever they are, but you will let light into areas of he church where salt and light have not been for years.

 You are wide of the mark, Who me. My wife and I regularly host some quite large gatherings in our home, and have done for over 30 years, along with making our resources available, including my truck and contracting gear, ministering constantly to the needs of all and sundry. I have spent many years serving on boards & committees, leading and preaching in assemblies, been a Royal Rangers' Chaplain, a Children's Ministry Superintendent, a treasurer and a ministry and logistics co-ordinator, as well as the building and groundkeeping maintenance person for more churches than I care to remember.

Back to the purpose of this thread though, to explore the indoctrinations of denominations. I am not one to tilt at windmills and regard the plethora of denominations and their proliferation as a fact of life, something to build a bridge and get over, rather than a wall to butt heads against.  

[Guest]

I was baptized as a infant in the Roman Catholic church.  As an adult, I felt it was important for me to be fully submerged and baptized as a born-again Christian.  Did the first baptism count, is the second baptism no longer valid because I no longer go to that church?  At what point does this become legalism?  Is legalism a bad thing?  Points for discussion.

[Michael37]

4 hours ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

I was baptized as a infant in the Roman Catholic church.  As an adult, I felt it was important for me to be fully submerged and baptized as a born-again Christian.  Did the first baptism count, is the second baptism no longer valid because I no longer go to that church?  At what point does this become legalism?  Is legalism a bad thing?  Points for discussion.

Good subject, S.O.by G. Praise God that you made your own decision to have a real, full immersion, public confession of your faith in Christ. It's called "believer's baptism", and since no-one can believe for you, or decide on your behalf that you are a Christian, I am convinced it is the only one that counts. I did the same thing as you, coming into the AOG out of the Anglican Communion 36 years ago when I was 30 and was nearly written out of my widowed mother's Will. Another family member felt I had betrayed our late father's faith, but the situation improved a couple of years later and my mother got a special infilling of the Holy Spirit.