Matthew 5:32

[Guest eponine]

On the other hand, I've found many places in the KJV during my few years reading it exclusively where the archaic language would tend to lead people astray due to modern communication differences.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I totally agree. I grew up on the KJV, and in the last few years have been reading the NAS and ESV. There have been many times when I read a verse and realized that I had never understood it before because of difficult KJV language and structure.

I realize that this reason will not be valid to someone who has a TR-only position, but it is still a huge problem. I could never give a KJV to a new Christian; especially one with little education. They must be able to understand God's Word in order for it to change them. Halifax, would you be in favor of an updated KJV(actually, I believe Ray Comfort made one), or perhaps a new translation based only on the TR?

The KJV is not for everyone.

[JesusisGod2]

Super Jew

[halifaxchristian]

On the other hand, I've found many places in the KJV during my few years reading it exclusively where the archaic language would tend to lead people astray due to modern communication differences.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I totally agree. I grew up on the KJV, and in the last few years have been reading the NAS and ESV. There have been many times when I read a verse and realized that I had never understood it before because of difficult KJV language and structure.

I realize that this reason will not be valid to someone who has a TR-only position, but it is still a huge problem. I could never give a KJV to a new Christian; especially one with little education. They must be able to understand God's Word in order for it to change them. Halifax, would you be in favor of an updated KJV(actually, I believe Ray Comfort made one), or perhaps a new translation based only on the TR?

The KJV is not for everyone.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

There is nothing "hard" about the KJV. It's simplicity and clarity and structure lends for easy, smooth reading. It has been found that the KJV reads at a grade 9 level, and most of the other modern versions read at 2 or 3 grade levels higher. I don't think that we need a new King James version...why change a miracle???

[Trust & Obey]

On the other hand, I've found many places in the KJV during my few years reading it exclusively where the archaic language would tend to lead people astray due to modern communication differences.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I totally agree. I grew up on the KJV, and in the last few years have been reading the NAS and ESV. There have been many times when I read a verse and realized that I had never understood it before because of difficult KJV language and structure.

I realize that this reason will not be valid to someone who has a TR-only position, but it is still a huge problem. I could never give a KJV to a new Christian; especially one with little education. They must be able to understand God's Word in order for it to change them. Halifax, would you be in favor of an updated KJV(actually, I believe Ray Comfort made one), or perhaps a new translation based only on the TR?

The KJV is not for everyone.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

There is nothing "hard" about the KJV. It's simplicity and clarity and structure lends for easy, smooth reading. It has been found that the KJV reads at a grade 9 level, and most of the other modern versions read at 2 or 3 grade levels higher. I don't think that we need a new King James version...why change a miracle???

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Heb 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

I remember when I first read this in the KJV I was like... "what?" "huh?" Why do we want to leave the principles of the doctrine of Christ? Aren't we to "hold fast" to the principles of the docrtine of Christ?

Well, it turns out that "principles" really means "elementary teachings." So, it isn't telling us to leave the principles of Christ, it is really telling us we need to move on beyond the first things. This verse in the KJV is confusing.

______________

There are many more, but I can't think of them all off the top of my head. Whenever I read the KJV and come across one it isn't that big of a deal though because I'll know the passage from other translations and can make out what it is saying. But, my point is that if you only read the KJV by itself, without anyone commentating on it at the same time, you can be lead in a different direction than is desired at times.

I love the KJV. It's a beautiful translation. You'll notice that when I paste verses here at Worthy I almost exclusively use the KJV.

But, to say that it is the only true Bible is a bit incorrect.

Halifax, I challenge you to show me some areas where the NKJV is significantly different (in an incorrect way) from the KJV. I'm open ears for this, because I spent weeks studying this before resting on the fact that there are no significant changes.

There may be a few areas we can point out where the NKJV could have translated something better, but then again we can do this with the KJV, too, like I just did above.

Clarity over poetry. That's my motto.

[Guest eponine]

There is nothing "hard" about the KJV.  It's simplicity and clarity and structure lends for easy, smooth reading.  It has been found that the KJV reads at a grade 9 level, and most of the other modern versions read at 2 or 3 grade levels higher.  I don't think that we need a new King James version...why change a miracle???

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Whoa, halifax! This is simply not true! The KJV is difficult to read. I have worked in many kids clubs and camp settings where kids were memorizing verses (KJV) and did not understand what they were saying because of the diffcult words and structure. I have also worked with kids using simpler translations and seen a huge difference in how much the kids understood. Do you realize how many people do not read at a ninth grade level? Most of the people in grades 8 and below for starters. But there are tons of adults (certainly some in my church) who do not read that well. I assume the modern versions you refer to that read more difficult that the King James are ones like the RSV or NAS, right? I worked at a Christian bookstore and we had a chart comparing Bible versions. I reacal the KJV being the highest reading level, and there are many that read much easier. Especially if you get into the dynamic equivalent ones which I am not very fond of. Anyway, my point is that I don't think that your statement "most of the modern versions read at 2 or 3 grade levels higher" is true. Please prove me wrong if I am, but your asserting that does not prove anything. As for the KJV being a miracle, what do you mean by that? Surely God's original inspiration of the Bible was nothing short of a miricle. But translation is simply a process that involves linguistics. How can this be called a miracle? God does not call it that, and neither should you.

[Remnantrob]

First off I wanna say woohoo I'm a "veteran" now. I've always wondered what I'd have to do to get to this level

Next, I'd have to agree with Hal. Hold on......let me see what I'm agreeing with.brb....

okay, the difficulty of the KJV. It can be hard but didn't christ say

Matt. 21:22 And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.

The reformers and people who lived before the newer versions must have been some really smart people. They even got their kids reading, quoting and understanding scripture. The Quakers(I believe) still use it and their kids got it down. When it comes down to it, I think we're just lazy nowadays(especially myself) and need a watered down everything.

[Trust & Obey]

First off I wanna say woohoo I'm a "veteran" now.  I've always wondered what I'd have to do to get to this level

Next, I'd have to agree with Hal.  Hold on......let me see what I'm agreeing with.brb....

okay, the difficulty of the KJV.  It can be hard but didn't christ say

Matt. 21:22 And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.

The reformers and people who lived before the newer versions must have been some really smart people.  They even got their kids reading, quoting and understanding scripture.  The Quakers(I believe) still use it and their kids got it down.  When it comes down to it, I think we're just lazy nowadays(especially myself) and need a watered down everything.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sorry, Rob. That's a weak argument.

Can I teach my kids to master the KJV? Sure I could. Is it necessary? Nope.

Will my kids be more effective in reaching others with the Word of God if that Word they are reaching out with is in our modern tongue? I think so.

Can you step up to the plate and answer the challenge I posed to halifax about the NKJV?

[Joy in the Journey]

Let's assume for a minute that the KJV is harder to read. Would you rather raise your intellect to the Bible, or lower the Bible to your intellect ? Just a thought

I actually read/use many versions- I find them all to be helpful; some versions just explain things in different ways and often I find if I don't understand something in one version, I can turn to another version for a different way of saying it. I don't find the KJV particularly difficult, but that's me. As for being the only "inspired version" ? No, that's just silly. I do like the KJV, but I certainly don't believe it's the only "preserved Word of God".

Just my thoughts

Tim

[Trust & Obey]

Let's assume for a minute that the KJV is harder to read.  Would you rather raise your intellect to the Bible, or lower the Bible to your intellect ?  Just a thought 

I've heard that argument before and it assumes that the KJV is of a higher intellect.

I have a feeling that the KJV was as readable as any modern translation, excluding a couple of diluted versions, to the generation it was written to. The problem is, this isn't that generation.

Is it still a viable translation? Sure. But, it is not "superior" simply because of the working/structure of the text.

If you read the Bible you will indeed learn a bunch of new words (i.e. raise your intellect). But, if you attempt to use any of those words (words like hath, concupiscence, limiteth, betwixt, etc.) in everyday use with people you will not communicate effectively to them since they won't understand you.

Now, what is the more "intellectual" thing to do? Communicate effectively in a language that is readily understood? Or spout off with 17th century poetry and impress people?

[Joy in the Journey]

Let's assume for a minute that the KJV is harder to read.

Edited August 6, 2005 by Joy in the Journey