A failed prophecy regarding Nebuchadnezzar, or is there another explanation?

[BibleReader]

3 hours ago, Michael37 said:

•  So Rabshakeh returned, and found the king of Assyria warring against Libnah: for he had heard that he was departed from Lachish.

Perfect, so I think we agree that Rabshakeh and the men of Assyria were not killed in Jerusalem.  

This leaves the prophecy at Isaiah 31:4, 8 apparently unfulfilled until now which may mean that it is really referring to the future during Christ's return. 

Isaiah 31:4, 8  ". . .The Lord of Heaven’s Armies will descend to do battle on Mount Zion and on its hill. . .“Assyria will fall by a sword, but not one human made; a sword not made by humankind will destroy them. They will run away from this sword and their young men will be forced to do hard labor. 9 They will surrender their stronghold because of fear; their officers will be afraid of the Lord’s battle flag.” This is what the Lord says— the one whose fire is in Zion, whose firepot is in Jerusalem."  

• The Lord did not "battle on Mount Zion" against the Assyrian army.  

 

[Riverwalker]

On 2/17/2021 at 9:11 AM, BibleReader said:

According to history:

History is written by the victors and RARELY is a accurate telling of the entire subject

[Michael37]

2 hours ago, BibleReader said:

Perfect, so I think we agree that Rabshakeh and the men of Assyria were not killed in Jerusalem.  

This leaves the prophecy at Isaiah 31:4, 8 apparently unfulfilled until now which may mean that it is really referring to the future during Christ's return. 

Isaiah 31:4, 8  ". . .The Lord of Heaven’s Armies will descend to do battle on Mount Zion and on its hill. . .“Assyria will fall by a sword, but not one human made; a sword not made by humankind will destroy them. They will run away from this sword and their young men will be forced to do hard labor. 9 They will surrender their stronghold because of fear; their officers will be afraid of the Lord’s battle flag.” This is what the Lord says— the one whose fire is in Zion, whose firepot is in Jerusalem."  

• The Lord did not "battle on Mount Zion" against the Assyrian army.  

 

Claims that Mt. Zion was not the location of the Assyrian camp will never be proven, nor will any claims which rely on dubious translations and semantic bias rather than more accurate texts and informed exegesis. 

Isa 31:4  For thus has the LORD spoken unto me, Like as the lion and the young lion roaring on his prey, when a multitude of shepherds is called forth against him, he will not be afraid of their voice, nor abase himself for the noise of them: so shall the LORD of hosts come down to fight for mount Zion, and for the hill thereof.

Many Bible-readers are not Bible-believers, but simply read the Bible to find fault with it. 

Isa 37:36  Then the angel of the LORD went forth, and smote in the camp of the Assyrians a hundred and fourscore and five thousand: and when they arose early in the morning, behold, they were all dead corpses.

Quote from Bible Believer's Commentary: 

One of the great poems in the English language, written in 1815, dramatizes this event. Since many readers do not have access to an extensive library, we make no apology for reproducing it in full:
THE DESTRUCTION OF SENNACHERIB
The Assyrian came down like the wolf on the fold,
And his cohorts were gleaming in purple and gold;
And the sheen of their spears was like stars on the sea,
When the blue wave rolls nightly on deep Galilee.
Like the leaves of the forest when Summer is green,
That host with their banners at sunset were seen:
Like the leaves of the forest when Autumn hath blown,
That host on the morrow lay withered and strown.
For the Angel of Death spread his wings on the blast,
And breathed in the face of the foe as he passed;
And the eyes of the sleepers waxed deadly and chill,
And their hearts but once heaved, and forever grew still!
And there lay the steed with his nostril all wide,
But through it there rolled not the breath of his pride;
And the foam of his gasping lay white on the turf,
And cold as the spray of the rock-beating surf.
And there lay the rider distorted and pale,
With the dew on his brow, and the rust on his mail:
And the tents were all silent—the banners alone—
The lances unlifted—the trumpet unblown.
And the widows of Ashur are loud in their wail,
And the idols are broke in the temple of Baal;
And the might of the Gentile, unsmote by the sword,
Hath melted like snow in the glance of the Lord!
—George Gordon, Lord Byron (1788–1824)

[BibleReader]

7 hours ago, Michael37 said:

Claims that Mt. Zion was not the location of the Assyrian camp will never be proven, nor will any claims which rely on dubious translations and semantic bias rather than more accurate texts and informed exegesis. 

Isa 31:4  For thus has the LORD spoken unto me, Like as the lion and the young lion roaring on his prey, when a multitude of shepherds is called forth against him, he will not be afraid of their voice, nor abase himself for the noise of them: so shall the LORD of hosts come down to fight for mount Zion, and for the hill thereof.

Many Bible-readers are not Bible-believers, but simply read the Bible to find fault with it. 

Isa 37:36  Then the angel of the LORD went forth, and smote in the camp of the Assyrians a hundred and fourscore and five thousand: and when they arose early in the morning, behold, they were all dead corpses.

Quote from Bible Believer's Commentary: 

One of the great poems in the English language, written in 1815, dramatizes this event. Since many readers do not have access to an extensive library, we make no apology for reproducing it in full:
THE DESTRUCTION OF SENNACHERIB
The Assyrian came down like the wolf on the fold,
And his cohorts were gleaming in purple and gold;
And the sheen of their spears was like stars on the sea,
When the blue wave rolls nightly on deep Galilee.
Like the leaves of the forest when Summer is green,
That host with their banners at sunset were seen:
Like the leaves of the forest when Autumn hath blown,
That host on the morrow lay withered and strown.
For the Angel of Death spread his wings on the blast,
And breathed in the face of the foe as he passed;
And the eyes of the sleepers waxed deadly and chill,
And their hearts but once heaved, and forever grew still!
And there lay the steed with his nostril all wide,
But through it there rolled not the breath of his pride;
And the foam of his gasping lay white on the turf,
And cold as the spray of the rock-beating surf.
And there lay the rider distorted and pale,
With the dew on his brow, and the rust on his mail:
And the tents were all silent—the banners alone—
The lances unlifted—the trumpet unblown.
And the widows of Ashur are loud in their wail,
And the idols are broke in the temple of Baal;
And the might of the Gentile, unsmote by the sword,
Hath melted like snow in the glance of the Lord!
—George Gordon, Lord Byron (1788–1824)

Very good, I also believe that Isaiah chapter 37 was a historical narrative of events regarding the Assyrians in Hezekiah's day.  Chapter 31 on the other hand seems to be prophetic, pointing to the future.  

Isaiah 10:24:  "So here is what the Sovereign Lord of Heaven’s Armies says: “My people who live in Zion, do not be afraid of Assyria, even though they beat you with a club and lift their cudgel against you as Egypt did."  

• When did Assyria ever beat Zion with a club?  It could not have happened during Hezekiah's day, correct?  (See 2 Kings 19:32, 33)

In light of this, could Isaiah chapters 10 and 11 along with chapters 31 and 32 be pointing to the future?  

[Sister]

Isaiah 10:24   Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD of hosts, O my people that dwellest in Zion, be not afraid of the Assyrian: he shall smite thee with a rod, and shall lift up his staff against thee, after the manner of Egypt.
 

It should be worded the Assyrian, not Assyria.  That translation is not correct.  God is referring to an individual, not that kingdom of old. 

The Assyrian here is God speaking about Satan.  Satan is also the King of Babylon today, because Babylon is Satan's land, ...his domain, his kingdom as a whole, and he is king of it.  When Satan is referred to as 'the Assyrian', he is the God of war, that aspect of it.  When he is referred to as 'Pharaoh', he is the God of oppression, as in the manner of Egypt for an example.  Egypt is also his land today, full of oppression.

The prophets are speaking in the 'spirit'.  They prophesied of things to come in the end times during those days, which is why you cannot find some things that already happened because speaking of future.  It looks like you are seeing this already.  These things are for us to know today as a witness that all was prophesied thousands of years ago already.

 

 

[Eternally Gratefull]

On 2/17/2021 at 1:22 PM, BibleReader said:

Thanks for your response Charlie. I also thought about what you mentioned.  However, the word "him", at least in English, can apply to a person not a kingdom.  Whether ancient Hebrew allows for the application you make, I'm just not sure.  

I think we can use Daniel as an example.

in chapter 2. We are told nebachadnezzar was the head of God. Which actually represented babylon.

In this context, "him" would be referencing Babylon. not the king himself. Just like when we are told that Daniel will sit on his throne in jerusalem after Israel is restored. When it actually means Christ.

Hope this helps. I understand how confusing it can be

[BibleReader]

2 hours ago, Eternally Gratefull said:

I think we can use Daniel as an example.

in chapter 2. We are told nebachadnezzar was the head of God. Which actually represented babylon.

In this context, "him" would be referencing Babylon. not the king himself. Just like when we are told that Daniel will sit on his throne in jerusalem after Israel is restored. When it actually means Christ.

Hope this helps. I understand how confusing it can be

Thank you.  What you mention may be plausible, I don't rule it out.  The question for me is if that explanation is likely or not.  But just so that I can understand your perspective better, who do you believe Babylon is today, or do you believe it will be revived in the future?  Since you make reference to Daniel chapter 2 and the head of Gold of the statue is crushed along with all other materials in the prophecy (Daniel 2:44,45), who do you believe the kingdom of God will crush in the future that corresponds to the head of gold? 

[Charlie744]

1 minute ago, BibleReader said:

Thank you.  What you mention may be plausible, I don't rule it out.  The question for me is if that explanation is likely or not.  But just so that I can understand your perspective better, who do you believe Babylon is today, or do you believe it will be revived in the future?  Since you make reference to Daniel chapter 2 and the head of Gold of the statue is crushed along with all other materials in the prophecy (Daniel 2:44,45), who do you believe the kingdom of God will crush in the future that corresponds to the head of gold? 

My understanding is He will destroy the entire metal man image which represents all and any kingdoms of man on the earth. He destroys all of man's kingdoms, organizations, religions, etc., and He brings in HIS KINGDOM which will reign forever.

Charlie

[BibleReader]

18 hours ago, Sister said:

Isaiah 10:24   Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD of hosts, O my people that dwellest in Zion, be not afraid of the Assyrian: he shall smite thee with a rod, and shall lift up his staff against thee, after the manner of Egypt.
 

It should be worded the Assyrian, not Assyria.  That translation is not correct.  God is referring to an individual, not that kingdom of old. 

The Assyrian here is God speaking about Satan.  Satan is also the King of Babylon today, because Babylon is Satan's land, ...his domain, his kingdom as a whole, and he is king of it.  When Satan is referred to as 'the Assyrian', he is the God of war, that aspect of it.  When he is referred to as 'Pharaoh', he is the God of oppression, as in the manner of Egypt for an example.  Egypt is also his land today, full of oppression.

The prophets are speaking in the 'spirit'.  They prophesied of things to come in the end times during those days, which is why you cannot find some things that already happened because speaking of future.  It looks like you are seeing this already.  These things are for us to know today as a witness that all was prophesied thousands of years ago already.

 

 

I appreciate your input.  In verses 5-11 of Isaiah chapter 10, God is using the Assyrian as a rod to express his anger against Israel along with Mount Zion (See verses 1-4 and 20-27).  Does this mean that you believe that God will use Satan to punish Israel and the inhabitants of Mount Zion in the future?  

[Eternally Gratefull]

5 minutes ago, BibleReader said:

Thank you.  What you mention may be plausible, I don't rule it out.  The question for me is if that explanation is likely or not.  But just so that I can understand your perspective better, who do you believe Babylon is today, or do you believe it will be revived in the future?  Since you make reference to Daniel chapter 2 and the head of Gold of the statue is crushed along with all other materials in the prophecy (Daniel 2:44,45), who do you believe the kingdom of God will crush in the future that corresponds to the head of gold? 

The statue represents all aspects of the time of the gentiles. Including the 4 kingdoms. Each kingdom has aspects of the kingdom before it. The final kingdom will be the reformed roman empire or the feet of Iron and Clay. If you look in revelation 13 we see the beast which comes out of the ocean has all the characteristics of the beasts in Daniel 7, which is a parallel passage to chapter 2. It is this gentile system, Who has ruled over jerusalem who will be destroyed.