True of False

[WordSword]

There are types of people who profess to be in Christ; those who are truly in Him and those who are not in Him. This has always been the situation since the beginning of Christianity, and the false professors are the hypocrites who will inevitably manifest that they do not truly believe by apostatizing (leaving or departing) from their false profession, for only those truly reborn (saved) never cease their profession in the Christian walk. Hypocrites are those whom the Lord Jesus said that “this people draweth nigh unto Me with their mouth, and honoureth Me with their lips; but their heart is far from Me” (never reborn - Mat 15:8).

The difference between true and false professors is important to identify, and is why the Lord said “the tree is known by his fruit” (Mat 12:33). One of the primary functions of Scripture is to teach believers how to identify those who nominally profess to believe, which eventually show itself outwardly by their lifestyle. Those who are not truly saved always give up, and those truly saved never give up; and this is seen in the parable of the sower in which only one of the examples presented is saved.

When Scripture speaks of those falling away, departing, etc., it refers to false professors who never continue professing to be living in the faith (not falling from the faith but from their false profession of it), because it requires the Spirit creating one in rebirth to be saved and remain. One of the reasons why many people practice false professions (many unaware it’s false until later) is to attempt to ease their conscience by and outward show so that they will be accepted, as guilt always attempts to seek self-justification.

Continuing in professing Christianity does not produce salvation but shows one is saved, for only one who is saved will continue without ceasing. Inwardly we are assured by the Sprit that we are saved (Rom 8:16); outwardly we will manifest this by God’s love for one another (Jhn 13:35). Not our natural love which is to others in the same degree we love ourselves (Mat 22:39), but in the love we have of Christ to others (Jhn 13:34), as this is what makes love to others a “new command.”

I believe one important reason why there are false professors is to outwardly affirm the true professors, just as the Tree of Knowledge was to affirm God’s holiness via contrast of good and evil (He wants us to know His holiness); and as the wheat and the tares bear resemblance when young, they can be distinguished when the ears of grain begin to show in the wheat.

[Jedi4Yahweh]

So your saying salvation is not really salvation unless you continue in your faith and produce godly fruit until the end then your truly saved, but if you fall away back into a life of disobedience and sin some time after, you where never truly saved to start with???

I will agree that there many false believers being produced in mainline denominations that teach just say this little sinners prayer and you will be saved for all eternity.  When the majority of the people never intend to follow Christ and will go right back to their life of sin and disobedience thinking they are saved by saying some sinners prayer script.  This is not the gospel that Jesus taught.  He said go into all the world and make DISCIPLES teaching them TO OBEY ALL THAT I HAVE COMMANDED YOU.  He said, IF you continue in my words then you are my disciples.  The truth is most churches are not making disciples nor teaching them of obey our Messiah but producing shallow false professors that continue to live in complete disobedience and sin.

Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to observe ALL things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, [even] unto the end of the world. Amen. - Mat 28:19-20 KJV

...IF ye continue in my word, [then] are ye my disciples indeed; - Jhn 8:31 KJV

And hereby we do know that we know him, IF we keep his commandments. He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. - 1Jo 2:3-4 KJV

Edited October 20, 2021 by Jedi4Yahweh

[Hopefully]

Amen. We will know them by their fruits.

“The wrong things the sinful self does are clear: committing sexual sin, being morally bad, doing all kinds of shameful things, worshiping false gods, taking part in witchcraft, hating people, causing trouble, being jealous, angry or selfish, causing people to argue and divide into separate groups, being filled with envy, getting drunk, having wild parties, and doing other things like this. I warn you now as I warned you before: The people who do these things will not have a part in God’s kingdom.
 

But the fruit that the Spirit produces in a person’s life is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control. There is no law against these kinds of things. Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified their sinful self. They have given up their old selfish feelings and the evil things they wanted to do. We get our new life from the Spirit, so we should follow the Spirit.”
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭5:19-25‬ ‭

[Ancient]

On 10/19/2021 at 1:35 AM, WordSword said:

There are types of people who profess to be in Christ; those who are truly in Him and those who are not in Him. This has always been the situation since the beginning of Christianity, and the false professors are the hypocrites who will inevitably manifest that they do not truly believe by apostatizing (leaving or departing) from their false profession, for only those truly reborn (saved) never cease their profession in the Christian walk. Hypocrites are those whom the Lord Jesus said that “this people draweth nigh unto Me with their mouth, and honoureth Me with their lips; but their heart is far from Me” (never reborn - Mat 15:8).

The difference between true and false professors is important to identify, and is why the Lord said “the tree is known by his fruit” (Mat 12:33). One of the primary functions of Scripture is to teach believers how to identify those who nominally profess to believe, which eventually show itself outwardly by their lifestyle. Those who are not truly saved always give up, and those truly saved never give up; and this is seen in the parable of the sower in which only one of the examples presented is saved.

When Scripture speaks of those falling away, departing, etc., it refers to false professors who never continue professing to be living in the faith (not falling from the faith but from their false profession of it), because it requires the Spirit creating one in rebirth to be saved and remain. One of the reasons why many people practice false professions (many unaware it’s false until later) is to attempt to ease their conscience by and outward show so that they will be accepted, as guilt always attempts to seek self-justification.

Continuing in professing Christianity does not produce salvation but shows one is saved, for only one who is saved will continue without ceasing. Inwardly we are assured by the Sprit that we are saved (Rom 8:16); outwardly we will manifest this by God’s love for one another (Jhn 13:35). Not our natural love which is to others in the same degree we love ourselves (Mat 22:39), but in the love we have of Christ to others (Jhn 13:34), as this is what makes love to others a “new command.”

I believe one important reason why there are false professors is to outwardly affirm the true professors, just as the Tree of Knowledge was to affirm God’s holiness via contrast of good and evil (He wants us to know His holiness); and as the wheat and the tares bear resemblance when young, they can be distinguished when the ears of grain begin to show in the wheat.

I really don't think it is that hard or philosophical. We need to be very careful in our judgements of others. There is a bit of assuming in the OP. It's a lifelong journey, we grow, we stall, sometimes we fall back a ways, then we grow some more and so on. We should be getting stronger and stronger as the days, months and years pass by, if we don't then there are problems with your walk. Being saved is in the future tense so we will ultimately find out when we stand before Yeshua and He opens the books.

Ohhh Yahweh may our names be found in your Book of Life.

We should not be presuming others walk unless we know them, your experience with someone may have been when they were having a bad day. We are humans and have emotions, we excel and we fall. Yahweh's grace and mercy is sufficient if and when we repent. 

A great analogy I heard many years ago is you could drive past a field and it can seem that it is all dirt and nothing growing. We don't know at that time what type of seed may have just been sown in that dirt, what potential is in that ground. It could be a field that at sometime in the future have a bumper wheat crop in it. We just don't know at that point in time when we drive by and it is only dirt.

May we be careful in our assumptions only He knows the heart of a person, the struggles of a person. In the end I can only really be responsible for myself, my own actions and the words I speak. Again may I be found in His book of Life when that day comes.

Yes we do know them by their fruits absolutely true, but how can we bring correction, a rebuke, and chastisement which are all Biblical to do with another believer. But done in love, mercy and compassion with the goal of restoring and bringing the person closer to Yahweh. Just like He does with us when at times we deserve to be tossed into the rubbish heap known as Gehenna.

Kind of a sobering thought!

Shalom

[Don19]

On 10/18/2021 at 10:35 AM, WordSword said:

There are types of people who profess to be in Christ; those who are truly in Him and those who are not in Him.

Absolutely true.

 

On 10/18/2021 at 10:35 AM, WordSword said:

This has always been the situation since the beginning of Christianity, and the false professors are the hypocrites who will inevitably manifest that they do not truly believe by apostatizing (leaving or departing) from their false profession, for only those truly reborn (saved) never cease their profession in the Christian walk.

Not true. Many false professors continue in their false profession until their death. When they are resurrected, they will be surprised at the great white throne judgment (Matt 7:21-23, 25:41-46).

 

On 10/18/2021 at 10:35 AM, WordSword said:

Those who are not truly saved always give up, and those truly saved never give up; and this is seen in the parable of the sower in which only one of the examples presented is saved.

This is an incorrect interpretation of the parable. Only the first of the four examples does not have eternal salvation. The others received the earnest of their inheritance, which means they are sealed and can never lose eternal salvation, no matter what. However, only the last will receive the reward (1 Cor 3:13-15).

 

On 10/18/2021 at 10:35 AM, WordSword said:

When Scripture speaks of those falling away, departing, etc., it refers to false professors who never continue professing to be living in the faith (not falling from the faith but from their false profession of it),

In some instances, it refers to genuine, eternally-secure believers who have slipped up (James 5:19-20, 2 Pet 2:20-22, Heb 6:4-8).

[kwikphilly]

38 minutes ago, Ancient said:

A great analogy I heard many years ago is you could drive past a field and it can seem that it is all dirt and nothing growing. We don't know at that time what type of seed may have just been sown in that dirt, what potential is in that ground. It could be a field that at sometime in the future have a bumper wheat crop in it. We just don't know at that point in time when we drive by and it is only dirt.

Blessings Ancient

     That is a great analogy,love it! Now I am ancient myself (lol) & I've never heard that one before...........thanks for sharing

    Praise Jesus!                                                                                   With love-in Christ,Kwik

[Guest]

11 hours ago, Jedi4Yahweh said:

So your saying salvation is not really salvation unless you continue in your faith and produce godly fruit until the end then your truly saved, but if you fall away back into a life of disobedience and sin some time after, you where never truly saved to start with???

Hi and thanks for the probing comments! I pretty much agree with your reply, but perseverance only manifests salvation, not produces it. An outward evidence of an inward absence of rebirth is apostatizing. I believe an apostate is one who has never been reborn (saved), as is why it inevitably shows. Of course, love to individuals should always be the motive, regardless the state of their soul.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Ancient said:

I really don't think it is that hard or philosophical. We need to be very careful in our judgements of others. There is a bit of assuming in the OP. It's a lifelong journey, we grow, we stall, sometimes we fall back a ways, then we grow some more and so on. We should be getting stronger and stronger as the days, months and years pass by, if we don't then there are problems with your walk. Being saved is in the future tense so we will ultimately find out when we stand before Yeshua and He opens the books.

Appreciate and agree with your comments. Scripture, in love (should be same for us; love the sinner hate the sin) maintains instructions on identifying one another for the purpose of responding correctly to one another. The Lord Jesus often declared the means of identification (e.g. Mat 7:20). When the motive concerning anything is not love, our learning is stunted. 

 

[Guest]

50 minutes ago, Don19 said:

Not true. Many false professors continue in their false profession until their death. When they are resurrected, they will be surprised at the great white throne judgment (Matt 7:21-23, 25:41-46).

Thanks for the reply and comments. True, if they die before manifesting themselves. It's my understanding that, excluding death, they always depart or fall away from professing and attempting to show they are saved. They have no perseverance unto the end. 

[Guest]

59 minutes ago, Don19 said:

This is an incorrect interpretation of the parable. Only the first of the four examples does not have eternal salvation. The others received the earnest of their inheritance, which means they are sealed and can never lose eternal salvation, no matter what. However, only the last will receive the reward (1 Cor 3:13-15).

Unless I'm misunderstanding you, we are saying the same thing, that the last example of the four mentioned in the parable are those saved.

Concerning the "reward" it is not in reference to salvation but our works, for as we know salvation is not a reward but a gift. 

1 hour ago, Don19 said:

In some instances, it refers to genuine, eternally-secure believers who have slipped up (James 5:19-20, 2 Pet 2:20-22, Heb 6:4-8).

I agree, falling away or departing is in the sense of being permanent.