AdHoc Posted December 31, 2021 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 4 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,109 Content Per Day: 3.29 Reputation: 1,486 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/29/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted December 31, 2021 5 hours ago, WilliamL said: Sad. If I "might be right," but you reject it anyway, then your faith lies in men, not the Word. Your logic is questionable. It is the "Word" that is under discussion. You have assumed your rendering to be correct. That is not how we establish things. Very capable men say different to you. I have sided with them this time, but might agree with you in another matter. It is also how the Lord wants it. 29 Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge (1 Co 14:29) 5 hours ago, WilliamL said: There were scholars before the AV, and there have been scholars after the AV. Your faith (not any actual evidence) is in those AV scholars, not in the search for truth. Quite. It is my job to examine the evidence and make a decision. I reject yours, but did admit I could be wrong - which you took umbrage to. 5 hours ago, WilliamL said: Certainly. And that applies equally to the AV scholars as to others. Certainly. I investigated, I calculated and I made a decision. This happens all the time in all walks of life. It is the same with the texts. Although I study and acquaint myself with the Alexandrian texts, I chose the Received Texts. The beauty of this whole discussion is that the rendering of Daniel's 9th is not critical to my walk as a Christian. Maybe we should be expending our energy and argumentative skills on weightier matters. For instance, John 7:39 says that "the Spirit was not yet given ... ". But you and I both know that the word "given" is not in the original. This causes the true rendering to be; "... the Spirit was NOT YET ... ." Is that true? If you don't agree with me diverting the subject, I understand. Just disregard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth7t7 Posted December 31, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,749 Content Per Day: 0.60 Reputation: 329 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/19/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted December 31, 2021 3 hours ago, JoeCanada said: t7t7, How then does Satan accuse the brethren....before God (who is in heaven).......day and night? The same way as any person on this earth would accuse another, the earth is Gods footstool, we are all before God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth7t7 Posted December 31, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,749 Content Per Day: 0.60 Reputation: 329 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/19/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted December 31, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, DeighAnn said: And was thrown [out] the dragon great the serpent ancient who is called devil and Satan deceiving the inhabited [world] whole He was thrown down to the earth and the angels of him with him were thrown down WE know what happens when ANGELS come to earth and so it is impossible Rev 12 is not future. ANOTHER reason it can only be for a short season. Satan is only once spoken of as deceiving the whole world. That also is future Thanks for the response D We disagree, satan was on the earth during Jobs temptation, and during the Lords temptation of 40 days/nights The reading in Revelation 12:4 is past tense, as satan through King Herod tried to destroy the child (Jesus) when he was born long ago Revelation 12:4KJV 4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born. Edited December 31, 2021 by truth7t7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeCanada Posted December 31, 2021 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 9 Topic Count: 77 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 1,278 Content Per Day: 0.55 Reputation: 684 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/26/2018 Status: Offline Author Share Posted December 31, 2021 14 minutes ago, truth7t7 said: Thanks for the response D We disagree, satan was on the earth during Jobs temptation, and during the Lords temptation of 40 days/nights The reading in Revelation 12:4 is past tense, as satan through King Herod tried to destroy the child (Jesus) when he was born long ago Revelation 12:4KJV 4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born. t7t7, If a person reads all of Rev 12, they will come to the conclusion that it spans from the time of Jesus's birth until His return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth7t7 Posted December 31, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,749 Content Per Day: 0.60 Reputation: 329 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/19/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted December 31, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, JoeCanada said: t7t7, If a person reads all of Rev 12, they will come to the conclusion that it spans from the time of Jesus's birth until His return. That doesn't remove the fact that satan was on earth during the earthly ministry of Jesus Christ, as the Lord was tempted by satan 40 days/nights Also Jesus beheld satan cast to earth as lightning, and satan was on earth for Jobs temptation Revelation 12:4 is a recap of the story, not a future event Joe Edited December 31, 2021 by truth7t7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeCanada Posted December 31, 2021 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 9 Topic Count: 77 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 1,278 Content Per Day: 0.55 Reputation: 684 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/26/2018 Status: Offline Author Share Posted December 31, 2021 5 minutes ago, truth7t7 said: That doesn't remove the fact that satan was on earth during the earthly ministry of Jesus Christ, as the Lord was tempted by satan 40 days/nights Also Jesus beheld satan cast to earth as lightning, and satan was on earth for Jobs temptation Revelation 12:4 is a recap of the story, not a future event Joe I agree that Satan was on the earth, not only during Jesus' ministry, and Jobs temptation, and during Daniels time.......... he was on the earth since Adam and Eve. He is, after all, the ruler of this world. But Rev 12:3.... The dragon with 7 heads and 10 horns..... The 10 horns does not happen until the time of the end. They are the 10 toes that are struck by Jesus at His coming, destroying the four kingdoms of the statue at the same time...."the stone that was cut out of the mountain without hands" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeighAnn Posted December 31, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 9 Topic Count: 84 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 6,301 Content Per Day: 3.57 Reputation: 1,658 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/31/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted December 31, 2021 4 hours ago, truth7t7 said: Thanks for the response D We disagree, satan was on the earth during Jobs temptation, and during the Lords temptation of 40 days/nights The reading in Revelation 12:4 is past tense, as satan through King Herod tried to destroy the child (Jesus) when he was born long ago Revelation 12:4KJV 4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born. I am not saying that he never FELL PREVIOUSLY as we know iniquity was found in him and HIS TAIL drawing the 1/3 WAS that one. BUT that one wasn't a WAR and a losing and a casting out of him and HIS ANGELS ONLY. Different times. I also agree that Satan was walking to and from for Job. But I believe that to and fro stopped when 'Get thee behind me Satan' was spoken and at that point it was no longer him 'to and fro' but just his influencing people from then on. It works for my beliefs as it has him up in heaven, it has him accusing day and night and it has him being kicked out so LIKE THE DAYS OF NOE, also is a perfect fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth7t7 Posted December 31, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 2,749 Content Per Day: 0.60 Reputation: 329 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/19/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted December 31, 2021 2 minutes ago, DeighAnn said: I am not saying that he never FELL PREVIOUSLY as we know iniquity was found in him and HIS TAIL drawing the 1/3 WAS that one. BUT that one wasn't a WAR and a losing and a casting out of him and HIS ANGELS ONLY. Different times. I also agree that Satan was walking to and from for Job. But I believe that to and fro stopped when 'Get thee behind me Satan' was spoken and at that point it was no longer him 'to and fro' but just his influencing people from then on. It works for my beliefs as it has him up in heaven, it has him accusing day and night and it has him being kicked out so LIKE THE DAYS OF NOE, also is a perfect fit. We disagree, I have explained my position several times Jesus Is The Lord 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selah7 Posted December 31, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 56 Topics Per Day: 0.05 Content Count: 2,610 Content Per Day: 2.37 Reputation: 3,183 Days Won: 11 Joined: 05/25/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted December 31, 2021 (edited) On 12/8/2021 at 12:17 PM, missmuffet said: The tribulation saints are among the unbelievers who have come into the 7 year tribulation. When they have genuinely come to Christ during the 7 year tribulation they will be saved and go to heaven. All those who take the MOB and do not come to God during the 7 year tribulation will go into hell. Hi, missmuffet. I'm simply trying to figure out what you're saying, so I have to ask. How can tribulation saints be unbelievers? For example, the book of Ephesians is written to the saints. Now who are the saints? They are the “set aside” (consecrated) ones. Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, To the saints who are in Ephesus, and faithful in Christ Jesus: - Ephesians 1:1 (NKJV) S. Edited December 31, 2021 by Selah7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmuffet Posted December 31, 2021 Group: Royal Member Followers: 34 Topic Count: 1,995 Topics Per Day: 0.48 Content Count: 48,693 Content Per Day: 11.71 Reputation: 30,343 Days Won: 226 Joined: 01/11/2013 Status: Offline Share Posted December 31, 2021 8 hours ago, Selah7 said: Hi, missmuffet. I'm simply trying to figure out what you're saying, so I have to ask. How can tribulation saints be unbelievers? For example, the book of Ephesians is written to the saints. Now who are the saints? They are the “set aside” (consecrated) ones. Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, To the saints who are in Ephesus, and faithful in Christ Jesus: - Ephesians 1:1 (NKJV) S. After the rapture of the Church those who are not believers will go into the 7 year tribulation. Many of those people will come to God during the 7 years. Most of them will be killed as martyrs by the Antichrist for their belief in God. Those people will be the tribulation saints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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