Genesis Msg 1, God, Creation, Pre History and Origins

[MrBear]

7 hours ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

What's interesting to me, and this is apropos to the whole world, but you'll have cities built on top of other cities.  What happened that people wanted to build over another city

True I think it’s location perhaps or using remains as a strong foundation?

[MrBear]

1 hour ago, angels4u said:

This book brings  the life of Jesus in a good prespective,I  enjoy reading and studying it

Yeshua: The Life of Messiah from a Messianic Jewish Perspective - Arnold Fruchtenbaum.

 

I have great channel from messianic Jews on YouTube to share 

ONE FOR ISRAEL

Has some interesting videos you might like

SHALOM❤️
 

"I will thank Yahweh with all my heart; I will declare all Your wonderful works. I will rejoice and boast about You; I will sing about Your name, Most High."

- ‭‭Psalms‬ ‭9:1-2‬ ‭

[Your closest friendnt]

1 hour ago, MrBear said:

I have great channel from messianic Jews on YouTube to share 

ONE FOR ISRAEL

Has some interesting videos you might like

SHALOM❤️
 

"I will thank Yahweh with all my heart; I will declare all Your wonderful works. I will rejoice and boast about You; I will sing about Your name, Most High."

- ‭‭Psalms‬ ‭9:1-2‬ ‭

But he did not say PRAISE THE NAME OF JESUS. 

[Guest]

On 12/30/2021 at 4:17 PM, DeighAnn said:

Hi,
I am so glad I went there as a kid because my 'thoughts' weren't corrupted by anything and so I got to see if for what it was.  I don't know how big or mean those dinosaurs would look to me now but I remember someone telling me they were taken on the ark and my only reaction was .  Still is to this very day...

Maybe living super close to the Grand Canyon (easy access) and visiting Meteor Crater cemented my beliefs in an OLD earth but when I ponder on what is written and what we are told is coming up, it doesn't 'feel' like the end of a super short period of time. 

I am bringing together all the Scriptures I run across that I believe show 'ages'.  It is so hard to speak to because it calls everything you put forth into question and those who 'already know everything that has already been taught throughout all generations  and nothing new better be introduced no matter how much Scripture backs it' jump all over it.  BUT I think that God has put a ton of it in there because it would be considered new...if that makes any sense at all.  ANY WAY

Here is my most recent addition.  They are adding up.  Isa 45:18, where it all started for me anyhow. 

The Theologians of the Believers Bible Commentary would agree with you.

Isaiah 45:18, 19   When the LORD created the world, it was not as a chaos or in vain (t–hû, the same word used in Gen_1:2). He formed it to be inhabited by men, and revealed Himself to men in clear, understandable language. He did not create chaotically, nor did He communicate chaotically. Rather He revealed Himself in truth and righteousness as the absolute and supreme God.  [Believers Bible Commentary]

On 12/30/2021 at 4:17 PM, DeighAnn said:

Isaiah 51:1 Hearken to Me, ye that follow after righteousness, ye that seek the LORD: look unto the rock whence ye are hewn, and to the hole of the pit whence ye are digged

Isaiah 51:2 Look unto Abraham your father, and unto Sarah that bare you: for I called him alone, and blessed him, and increased him.

Isaiah 51:3 For the LORD shall comfort Zion: He will comfort all her waste places; and He will make her wilderness like Eden, and her desert like the garden of the LORD; joy and gladness shall be found therein, thanksgiving, and the voice of melody.

Isaiah 51:4 Hearken unto Me, My People; and give ear unto Me, O my nation: for a law shall proceed from Me, and I will make My judgment to rest for a light of the people.

Isaiah 51:5 My righteousness is near; My salvation is gone forth, and Mine arms shall judge the people; the isles shall wait upon Me, and on Mine arm shall they trust.

Isaiah 51:6 Lift up your eyes to the heavens, and look upon the earth beneath: for the heavens shall vanish away like smoke, and the earth shall wax old like a garment, and they that dwell therein shall die in like manner: but My salvation shall be for ever, and My righteousness shall not be abolished.

Isaiah 51:7 Hearken unto Me, ye that know righteousness, the People in whose heart is My law; fear ye not the reproach of men, neither be ye afraid of their revilings.

Isaiah 51:8 For the moth shall eat them up like a garment, and the worm shall eat them like wool: but My righteousness shall be for ever, and My salvation from generation to generation.

Isaiah 51:9 Awake, awake, put on strength, O arm of the LORD; awake, as in the ancient days, in the generations of old. Art thou not it that hath cut Rahab, and wounded the dragon?

Isaiah 51:10 Art thou not it which hath dried the sea, the waters of the great deep; that hath made the depths of the sea a way for the ransomed to pass over?

Isaiah 51:11 Therefore the redeemed of the LORD shall return, and come with singing unto Zion; and everlasting joy shall be upon their head: they shall obtain gladness and joy; and sorrow and mourning shall flee away.

51:9-11   This prompts the remnant to call on the LORD to deliver His people as He delivered them from Egypt (Rahab) and from Pharaoh (the serpent, his symbol), drying up the sea so the redeemed could cross over. The memory of God's intervention in the past causes them to foresee the ransomed captives' return to Zion. F. C. Jennings describes the event beautifully:
Their heads are garlanded with joy and gladness which they have vainly pursued hitherto, but have overtaken at last, while the storm through which they have passed rolls off like a thick cloud, taking with it all their sighs and tears!  [Believers Bible Commentary]

The serpent mentioned in this Biblical passage is the symbol for the Pharaoh of Egypt, which isn't obvious from reading the passage in the King James Version.  The passage and the scriptures that follow represent the Jewish miraculous escape from the hands of the Pharaoh of Egypt.

On 12/30/2021 at 4:17 PM, DeighAnn said:

Isaiah 51:12 I, even I, am He That comforteth you: who art thou, that thou shouldest be afraid of a man that shall die, and of the son of man which shall be made as grass;

Isaiah 51:13 And forgettest the LORD thy Maker, That hath stretched forth the heavens, and laid the foundations of the earth; and hast feared continually every day because of the fury of the oppressor, as if he were ready to destroy? and where is the fury of the oppressor?

Isaiah 51:14 The captive exile hasteneth that he may be loosed, and that he should not die in the pit, nor that his bread should fail.

Isaiah 51:15 But I am the LORD thy God, that divided the sea, whose waves roared: The LORD of hosts is His name.

Isaiah 51:16 And I have put My words in thy mouth, and I have covered thee in the shadow of Mine hand, that I may plant the heavens, and lay the foundations of the earth, and say unto Zion, Thou art my people.

I don't know at what point it will be seen, but I do know it will be.  

d

AN ADDRESS OF GOD TO HIS CAPTIVE PEOPLE. There is no very clear connection between this passage and the preceding, to which it is certainly not an answer. God comforts the captives under the oppression which they are suffering
(1) by reminding them of their oppressors’ weakness and short-livedness;
(2) by assuring them of speedy deliverance (Isaiah 51:14); and
(3) by impressing upon them his own power as shown in the past, which is a guarantee that he will protect them in the future (Isaiah 51:15, Isaiah 51:16).

Isaiah 51:12
I am he that comforteth you (comparing Isaiah 51:3, and the comment ad loc). Who art thou? Art thou a poor, weak, powerless, unprotected people, which might well tremble at the powerful Babylonians: or art thou not rather a people under the special protection of Jehovah, bound, therefore, to fear no one? As grass (comp. Isaiah 37:27; Isaiah 11:6-8).

Isaiah 51:13
And forgettest the Lord thy Maker. It is not so much apostasy as want of a lively and practical faith with which captive Israel is here reproached. They did not deny God—they only left him out of sight, neglected him, forgot him.

That hath stretched forth the heavens (comp. Isaiah 40:22; Isaiah 42:5; Isaiah 44:24; Isaiah 45:12, etc.). And laid the foundations of the earth (see Isaiah 48:13; Psalm 102:25; Hebrew 1:10). And hast feared continually … because of the fury of the oppressor. (On the sufferings of the Israelites under their Babylonian oppressors, see the comment on Isaiah 42:22, and again on Isaiah 47:6.) By the present passage it would appear that life itself was not safe from their cruel fury, when their victims had exasperated them. Where is the fury of the oppressor? All their violence and rage will come to nought, when they in their turn become subject to the conquering Persians.

Isaiah 51:14
The captive exile hasteneth that he may be loosed; rather, he that is bent down hasteneth to be released; i.e. such of the exiles as were cramped and bent by fetters, or by the stocks, would speedily, on the fall of Babylon, obtain their release. They would not "die unto the pit," i.e. so as to belong to the pit and to be east into it, but would live and have a sufficiency of sustenance.

Isaiah 51:15
But I am the Lord thy God, that divided the sea; rather, for I, the Lord thy God, am he that divided the sea (comp. Isaiah 51:10). The reference is once more to the great miracle wrought at the Exodus, when the Red Sea was "divided" before the host of Israelites (Exodus 14:21; comp. Psalm 74:13). Whose waves roared (see Exodus 14:27; Exodus 15:10).

Isaiah 51:16
And I have put my words in thy mouth. Some commentators detach this verse altogether from the preceding passage, and regard it as a fragment intruded here out of its proper place by some unaccountable accident. From the close resemblance of the expressions used to those in Isaiah 49:2, they consider that the person addressed must be "the Servant of Jehovah," and hence conclude that the verse "originally stood in some other context" (Cheyne). It is, however, quite possible to regard Israel as still addressed; since Israel too was the recipient of God’s words (see Isaiah 59:21), and was protected by God’s hand from destruction, and kept in existence until the happy time should come when God would create a new heaven and a new earth (Isaiah 65:17) for Israel’s dwelling-place, and say unto Zion—i.e. to the "new Jerusalem" Revelation 21:2)—Thou art my people. This crowning promise well terminates the comforting address wherewith Jehovah at this time saw fit to cheer and encourage his captive people.  [The Pulpit Commentary]

The viewpoint here should be Israel as the captive saved.

Edited January 11, 2022 by Saved.One.by.Grace

[Guest]

5 hours ago, MrBear said:

True I think it’s location perhaps or using remains as a strong foundation?

The ancients sure did that.  But I was thinking more recently about San Francisco, after the earthquake.  Or my birth city of Saint Louis.  There are all kinds of tunnels under the city so "product" could be moved from the Mississippi River to the Anheuser-Busch brewery.

[MrBear]

21 minutes ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

The ancients sure did that.  But I was thinking more recently about San Francisco, after the earthquake.  Or my birth city of Saint Louis.  There are all kinds of tunnels under the city so "product" could be moved from the Mississippi River to the Anheuser-Busch brewery.

I didn’t know that interesting 

SHALOM❤️

[DeighAnn]

5 hours ago, Saved.One.by.Grace said:

The Theologians of the Believers Bible Commentary would agree with you.

Isaiah 45:18, 19   When the LORD created the world, it was not as a chaos or in vain (t–hû, the same word used in Gen_1:2). He formed it to be inhabited by men, and revealed Himself to men in clear, understandable language. He did not create chaotically, nor did He communicate chaotically. Rather He revealed Himself in truth and righteousness as the absolute and supreme God.  [Believers Bible Commentary]

51:9-11   This prompts the remnant to call on the LORD to deliver His people as He delivered them from Egypt (Rahab) and from Pharaoh (the serpent, his symbol), drying up the sea so the redeemed could cross over. The memory of God's intervention in the past causes them to foresee the ransomed captives' return to Zion. F. C. Jennings describes the event beautifully:
Their heads are garlanded with joy and gladness which they have vainly pursued hitherto, but have overtaken at last, while the storm through which they have passed rolls off like a thick cloud, taking with it all their sighs and tears!  [Believers Bible Commentary]

The serpent mentioned in this Biblical passage is the symbol for the Pharaoh of Egypt, which isn't obvious from reading the passage in the King James Version.  The passage and the scriptures that follow represent the Jewish miraculous escape from the hands of the Pharaoh of Egypt.

AN ADDRESS OF GOD TO HIS CAPTIVE PEOPLE. There is no very clear connection between this passage and the preceding, to which it is certainly not an answer. God comforts the captives under the oppression which they are suffering
(1) by reminding them of their oppressors’ weakness and short-livedness;
(2) by assuring them of speedy deliverance (Isaiah 51:14); and
(3) by impressing upon them his own power as shown in the past, which is a guarantee that he will protect them in the future (Isaiah 51:15, Isaiah 51:16).

Isaiah 51:12
I am he that comforteth you (comparing Isaiah 51:3, and the comment ad loc). Who art thou? Art thou a poor, weak, powerless, unprotected people, which might well tremble at the powerful Babylonians: or art thou not rather a people under the special protection of Jehovah, bound, therefore, to fear no one? As grass (comp. Isaiah 37:27; Isaiah 11:6-8).

Isaiah 51:13
And forgettest the Lord thy Maker. It is not so much apostasy as want of a lively and practical faith with which captive Israel is here reproached. They did not deny God—they only left him out of sight, neglected him, forgot him.

That hath stretched forth the heavens (comp. Isaiah 40:22; Isaiah 42:5; Isaiah 44:24; Isaiah 45:12, etc.). And laid the foundations of the earth (see Isaiah 48:13; Psalm 102:25; Hebrew 1:10). And hast feared continually … because of the fury of the oppressor. (On the sufferings of the Israelites under their Babylonian oppressors, see the comment on Isaiah 42:22, and again on Isaiah 47:6.) By the present passage it would appear that life itself was not safe from their cruel fury, when their victims had exasperated them. Where is the fury of the oppressor? All their violence and rage will come to nought, when they in their turn become subject to the conquering Persians.

Isaiah 51:14
The captive exile hasteneth that he may be loosed; rather, he that is bent down hasteneth to be released; i.e. such of the exiles as were cramped and bent by fetters, or by the stocks, would speedily, on the fall of Babylon, obtain their release. They would not "die unto the pit," i.e. so as to belong to the pit and to be east into it, but would live and have a sufficiency of sustenance.

Isaiah 51:15
But I am the Lord thy God, that divided the sea; rather, for I, the Lord thy God, am he that divided the sea (comp. Isaiah 51:10). The reference is once more to the great miracle wrought at the Exodus, when the Red Sea was "divided" before the host of Israelites (Exodus 14:21; comp. Psalm 74:13). Whose waves roared (see Exodus 14:27; Exodus 15:10).

Isaiah 51:16
And I have put my words in thy mouth. Some commentators detach this verse altogether from the preceding passage, and regard it as a fragment intruded here out of its proper place by some unaccountable accident. From the close resemblance of the expressions used to those in Isaiah 49:2, they consider that the person addressed must be "the Servant of Jehovah," and hence conclude that the verse "originally stood in some other context" (Cheyne). It is, however, quite possible to regard Israel as still addressed; since Israel too was the recipient of God’s words (see Isaiah 59:21), and was protected by God’s hand from destruction, and kept in existence until the happy time should come when God would create a new heaven and a new earth (Isaiah 65:17) for Israel’s dwelling-place, and say unto Zion—i.e. to the "new Jerusalem" Revelation 21:2)—Thou art my people. This crowning promise well terminates the comforting address wherewith Jehovah at this time saw fit to cheer and encourage his captive people.  [The Pulpit Commentary]

The viewpoint here should be Israel as the captive saved.

Yes, I agree, that fits, very well.  Sometimes though, it seems that Gods information on the past tells a lot about the future and as the future tells a lot about the past.  And sometimes you read something and its like being tapped on the shoulder and told 'Remember 'the here a little there a little'?  well, here a little.  Since I have spent many hours on the age (s)? before this one, first heaven created, then the host of heaven created, then the earth created, then iniquity was found in Satan, and NEXT THING you know the EARTH has JUST BEEN CREATED and there is Satan in the garden...
Our story unfolds with the beginning of the earth being set into a perfect dwelling place for God and His children having become 'void and without form' (I will ask the question again, what do people think GODS REACTION was to iniquity being found in Satan, the BEING you created more perfect than any other, a protector of the Mercy Seat, most trusted ally?  1/3 of His children tricked into following a liar,  because of his lies?  Moses struck a rock on his own once.  Things that make you go Hmmm)  

Any way, I think the 'NEW JERUSALEM' heaven and earth after the former things are passed away of which we will have no memories is extremely telling about the past.  I think God left dinosaurs bones for the very purpose of saying, Hey, check it out, I stuck Satan ALREADY as the serpent at the very start of the story so you would have to say  WHAT???  What is this all about,  This can't be.  Something is wrong.  This can't be the beginning can it?  One reading through and you say, I knew there was something wrong, God didn't create Satan that way, something happen.  SHOOT, God doesn't even HINT at any creation of him taking place at that time and and then He doesn't even speak to him EXCEPT to pronounce SENTENCE upon him, GOD DOESN'T LIKE HIM.  How does that not just SCREAM 'age before this one'...Sorry, I go off...

Any way I look at it as another telling part  of Gods personality and how He works and that is always good for instruction and enlightenment and helps us to see better.  I don't mean to take away from a first basic truth, I just tend to continue on from there to seek out the more eternal or infinite side of the words to find if they have meaning.  Sometimes they don't.  Some times they do.  Depends on the subject almost.  I should have indicated that first and then said 'have you ever considered this' in addition to that?   Again, I have spent many hours pondering on the works of God not from the science point of view but from the Plan of God He works in laws point of view.  It all works to tell His story and what part we might get to be of that.  

d
 

[Guest]

@DeighAnn I started reading a new (to me) book on the gap theory called The Gap Fact and Out-of-Whack Creation Scientism by Michael Pearl.  It is the only book I have which names the Gap Theorists during the Apostle John's time and afterward way before Darwin's Theory of Evolution.  But I just started reading the book so I can't say anymore about it at this time.  I've got people doubting the Gap Theory and Old Earth Creation because they refused to believe anyone believed in the Gap Theory or OEC and this was just an answer to Darwin.